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-   -   Handling? (http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2357)

mprhead5 12-23-2007 01:26 AM

Handling?
 
Any speculation on how well the new camaro is going to handle? I never had many problems with my 96 Z28 but after driving sportscars for the last 6 years im spoiled on handling and its likly to be the main factor in weather I get the camaro or not.

If its as much understeer monster at the race track as the old F-bodies I'll have to pass. I used to get around it on the street and autocross track by brake drifting but you can't do that at race speed on a track.

There has been really good reviews of the G8 handling by topgear in the form of the vxr8 and some other places so I'm hoping that the camaro comes with handling a few steps better than what has been available before. It seems that the recent independent rear cars have come with some good praise but will it hold its own on the track after suspension mods against cars like the c5 vette and 350z.

Mr. Wyndham 12-23-2007 01:39 AM

IRS will def. beat the old Camaros for handling. But what you've seen on TopGear is generally what you'll see in the Camaro - except minus a couple hundred pounds.:burnrubber:

mprhead5 12-23-2007 01:55 AM

I may have to relearn to drive camaros. However it dose look like the overhangs are much less on the new car so maybe that will go a good ways towards improving on 4th gen understeer issues. at least I will be back in somthing a little less darty. When a little sportscar lets go it can get ugly real fast. I did like the easy 2 drift setup of the old F-bodies but thats when I was 20 and I don't drive like that anymore.

I'm more interested in clipping late apexes than brake drifting into a power over exit like I used to in my z28

BrokenTrans 12-23-2007 05:24 AM

I'm really hoping the IRS helps this car a lot, I just hope it doesn't handle like the 06 GT I test drove, otherwise I'll have to reconsider...correct me if I'm wrong not a huge import car fan, but 350's are pretty decent handling cars are they not? if the camaro can hang with them handling wise I'll be pleased :)

mprhead5 12-23-2007 05:41 AM

350z's handle ok but the dynamics are really nice. I think I have just spoiled myself with the mazdaspeed running near race tires on the street so I will have to lowwer my standards with anything but a vette in the handling department.

The mustang GT's handle like dogs. The camaro had better be a good bit better because the stock GT stang is really bad in the handling department.

2010_5thgen 12-23-2007 01:00 PM

i bet they will have some kind of special option suspension like the vette has. and if you have any problems with the suspension ....remember theres always after market. you can make it however you want it to be. dont let one little thing(that can be changed) turn you off to the camaro,especially if you dont even really know anything about it yet.

stovt001 12-23-2007 01:52 PM

Even if it has great handling, the dynamics will still be different than the little Miata. They're just on opposite ends of the performance car spectrum.

Emher 12-23-2007 05:49 PM

I'm used to a worn Saab with shitty suspenders. The Camaro will be heaven!

mprhead5 12-23-2007 07:10 PM

Luckly the driving dynamice of 3rd and 4th gen F-bodies are hardwired into my soul. Sit me down in a 5 speed Iroc and its like the comfort of the whomb.

Ive just gotten more picky with handling I think. My 87 handled great with polygraphite bushings and a firebird formula 350 rear swaybar from the junkyard. I have just developed a severe hatred for understeer.

I remember when I drove the mustang GT and I was like OMG this is horrible!! I don't think the 235 crap perelli's it comes with help much either. Luckly the camaro has always handled better than the mustang since the camaro is for enthusiests and the mustang is for kids and non motorheads. hopefully GM is willing to deal with a few ladys complaining about how its hard to get into and make it for the rest of us.

stovt001 12-23-2007 11:04 PM

My guess is for autocrossing and lower speed courses, the Miata will be better. But on higher speed courses, the Camaro can use what is likely to be excellent handling along with superior power to turn the faster time, and it looks the the Zeta hardware allows for plenty of tail-out action.

mprhead5 12-23-2007 11:21 PM

whats the story with the engine placment? is it to be behind the front axle line?

I had looked at the double ball joint setup for the front. Looks heavy on the unsprung side.

Mr. Wyndham 12-23-2007 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mprhead5 (Post 35934)
whats the story with the engine placment? is it to be behind the front axle line?

I think it could be. even if it was on top of it a little, the majority of the engine would be behind the front axle line. At least how I see it.:iono:

Quote:

Originally Posted by mprhead5 (Post 35934)
I had looked at the double ball joint setup for the front. Looks heavy on the unsprung side.

....:help: I feel like I should know what you're talking about.;) But the fact remains that I don't.:help:

headpunter 12-24-2007 01:53 AM

unsprung weight is in the wheels and axles, hubs, brakes. anything not held up by the springs and shocks. as i understand it

garfin 12-24-2007 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mprhead5 (Post 35853)
I may have to relearn to drive camaros. However it dose look like the overhangs are much less on the new car so maybe that will go a good ways towards improving on 4th gen understeer issues. at least I will be back in somthing a little less darty. When a little sportscar lets go it can get ugly real fast. I did like the easy 2 drift setup of the old F-bodies but thats when I was 20 and I don't drive like that anymore.

I'm more interested in clipping late apexes than brake drifting into a power over exit like I used to in my z28

As someone who makes getting out on a road course 2-3 times a season with my 98 SS a very high priority, I was extremely pleased with the makeup of the Camaro Enthusiast Focus Group we participated in last May in Detroit. Although I can't talk about what was discussed, I can tell you that the composition of the group was made up of (what I thought) was a highly disproportionate number of road racers and autox'ers! :thumbup:

Best regardSS,

Elie

MTron 12-24-2007 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2010_5thgen (Post 35881)
i bet they will have some kind of special option suspension like the vette has. and if you have any problems with the suspension ....remember theres always after market. you can make it however you want it to be. dont let one little thing(that can be changed) turn you off to the camaro,especially if you dont even really know anything about it yet.

amen to that. i don't care how it handles, what suspension its got/dont got, as long as its got it in the looks dept and has an LS series engine under the hood, im golden. Suspension can always be changed, rather easily at that. the body and engine, not so much

Jeff 12-24-2007 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTron (Post 35976)
amen to that. i don't care how it handles, what suspension its got/dont got, as long as its got it in the looks dept and has an LS series engine under the hood, im golden. Suspension can always be changed, rather easily at that. the body and engine, not so much

I agree, but I'm sure the suspension will be perfectly fine anyways. GM wouldn't build up all this suspense about the Camaro then come out with a bad handling car. They know better. :bow:

Myka 12-24-2007 01:02 PM

I believe the new camaro will be shorter and wider than the 4thgen. So that should improve handling along with the IRS and other parts.

stovt001 12-24-2007 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTron (Post 35976)
amen to that. i don't care how it handles, what suspension its got/dont got, as long as its got it in the looks dept and has an LS series engine under the hood, im golden. Suspension can always be changed, rather easily at that. the body and engine, not so much

True, but why pay for that and go through the hassle when it can come with a good suspension straight from the factory? I'm sure this thing will handle. The Zeta architecture is just great, and I don't think they'd give the current full size sedans built on it better handling than the Camaro, right? Fear not. :party0048:

TAG UR IT 12-25-2007 12:18 AM

I have ZERO doubt in my mind that this will be the best handling Camaro EVER built. They've only said it a million times not to worry...that this will be the best one ever and that everyone will be happy. I can't wait to try out that IRS.

stovt001 12-25-2007 12:33 AM

Best handling Camaro ever built? Psh, I'm sure it will be one of the best handling cars ever built, period.

Jay 12-25-2007 03:04 AM

This Camaro is gunna rock your girlfriends/wifes panties off around the corners in the passenger seat fella's.... not too worry about the handling.... I'm sure GM will put some real-good time into this area as it is a "sports car" they are selling.... and the "best Camaro yet".

mprhead5 12-25-2007 08:30 AM

from wikipedia

duel ball joint front

The extra ball joint adds weight and cost. It also increases steering friction, and the parasitic friction in the suspension. The geometry has some undesirable characteristics that need careful management, such as returnability from full lock when parking

Well now my interest is peaked so I guess I'll have to spend a couple days looking into the chassis design and figure it out.

Here is a look at what the setup will look like

http://forums.peddersusa.com/imageho...27d7a88074.gif

and the full link
http://forums.peddersusa.com/showthread.php?p=1337

DGthe3 12-25-2007 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2010_5thgen (Post 35881)
i bet they will have some kind of special option suspension like the vette has. and if you have any problems with the suspension ....remember theres always after market. you can make it however you want it to be. dont let one little thing(that can be changed) turn you off to the camaro,especially if you dont even really know anything about it yet.

I believe that package would be known as Z28 . . . and aftermarket systems can give nearly any car 1g in the skidpad.

But from the factory, I would imagine that the Camaro will make better than 0.9g. The current Mustang GT makes something between 0.86 and 0.89 g's from what I've read.

2010_5thgen 12-26-2007 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DGthe3 (Post 36124)
I believe that package would be known as Z28 . . . and aftermarket systems can give nearly any car 1g in the skidpad.

But from the factory, I would imagine that the Camaro will make better than 0.9g. The current Mustang GT makes something between 0.86 and 0.89 g's from what I've read.

yeah i know the z28 is a special package , but i think they will offer a special package ,like the z51 for vette, for the regular v8 camaro's that arent the z28 models. like the vette has the regular vette and regular shocks, then theres the z06 with beefed up everything , but the middle of those 2 is the vette with the z51 package. vented rotors, different suspension components,tires, and the magnetice shocks. i think the base camaro will have some kind of suspension upgrade package ,that you can buy. and the z28 will have it,or something else, standard on it.

radz28 12-26-2007 01:15 PM

I just wonder if Z28 is confirmed to be the "top dog" package. It seemed to me the latest SS was considered the top dog so I wonder if GM will stay with that concept.


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