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-   -   Top Replacement on Tramtwo's 2011 2SS Vert (http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=241124)

tramtwo 08-01-2012 01:57 PM

Top Replacement on Tramtwo's 2011 2SS Vert
 
Turned car in on Monday to have the top replaced. I have had rub mark problems and deep wrinkles (top was down for three months on showroom floor) with the top documented since the car was about two months old. The marks continued to worsen despite the dealer performing all enchantments. My top is 11 months old and has 20k miles on it. Many of the marks have begun fraying. The service manager made the call about 2 months ago to replace the top and we have waited for parts ever since.The installation is being outsourced to a local trim shop.

I have been reluctant to have the top replaced because we all know the real problem is in the frame mechanism. Also with this top there has been no water leaking or excessive wind noise. I am sure that this local trim shop has not done a fifth gen car before. I just hope that their 50 years of experience gets the job done right the first time.

Rub marks are one thing, a top that has frayed in less than a year is something different. This is my dealers fifth bite at the apple. 1 more than the trigger to lemon the car in Louisiana. I am really hoping for the best as I have over 7k in mods invested in my car and don't want to start that process all over again.

:popcorn:



Chevrolet Customer Svc 08-01-2012 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tramtwo (Post 5378162)
Turned car in on Monday to have the top replaced. I have had rub mark problems and deep wrinkles (top was down for three months on showroom floor) with the top documented since the car was about two months old. The marks continued to worsen despite the dealer performing all enchantments. My top is 11 months old and has 20k miles on it. Many of the marks have begun fraying. The service manager made the call about 2 months ago to replace the top and we have waited for parts ever since.The installation is being outsourced to a local trim shop.

I have been reluctant to have the top replaced because we all know the real problem is in the frame mechanism. Also with this top there has been no water leaking or excessive wind noise. I am sure that this local trim shop has not done a fifth gen car before. I just hope that their 50 years of experience gets the job done right the first time.

Rub marks are one thing, a top that has frayed in less than a year is something different. This is my dealers fifth bite at the apple. 1 more than the trigger to lemon the car in Louisiana. I am really hoping for the best as I have over 7k in mods invested in my car and don't want to start that process all over again.

:popcorn:



I am sorry for the inconveniences you may be experiencing. Do you have an existing case with GM customer service? If not, I would like to set one up for you and do some more research regarding this concern. Please send me your first and last name, address, phone number, VIN, mileage and involved dealership.

I look forward to your correspondence.

Brandon
Chevrolet Customer Service

tramtwo 08-01-2012 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chevrolet Customer Svc (Post 5378540)
I am sorry for the inconveniences you may be experiencing. Do you have an existing case with GM customer service? If not, I would like to set one up for you and do some more research regarding this concern. Please send me your first and last name, address, phone number, VIN, mileage and involved dealership.

I look forward to your correspondence.

Brandon
Chevrolet Customer Service

Let's get the car back first and see if the problem has been fixed. Thanks for your offer.

cactuseater 08-01-2012 11:48 PM

Customer Service and case numbers only do one thing, they call the dealership incessantly and tell you the same thing the dealer service manager just told you a few minutes before. :thumbdown: Just a bunch of phone calls by some call center somewhere. Total waste of time, but it does help with documenting the problem.

Replacing the entire defective design flawed mechanism with the new design is the step they should take, but Chevy is arrogant in their resistance to repair these vehicles correctly. It also seems that the fixes are inconsistent from dealer to dealer and especially from state to state. Demand the new mechanism and see what happens, the animal will show it's real stripes at that point, and you'll know what your're dealing with.

I am on the receiving end of that BS game as well. Also way past the statute requirements in my state as well, over 100 days out of service since January 2012. :facepalm:

'11 cyber grey vert 08-02-2012 06:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cactuseater (Post 5380847)
Customer Service and case numbers only do one thing, they call the dealership incessantly and tell you the same thing the dealer service manager just told you a few minutes before. :thumbdown: Just a bunch of phone calls by some call center somewhere. Total waste of time, but it does help with documenting the problem.

Replacing the entire defective design flawed mechanism with the new design is the step they should take, but Chevy is arrogant in their resistance to repair these vehicles correctly. It also seems that the fixes are inconsistent from dealer to dealer and especially from state to state. Demand the new mechanism and see what happens, the animal will show it's real stripes at that point, and you'll know what your're dealing with.

I am on the receiving end of that BS game as well. Also way past the statute requirements in my state as well, over 100 days out of service since January 2012. :facepalm:


Replacing the entire mechanism with a new one is not going to happen right away.I have been saying all along the been counters are in control at GM.so they attempt to fix A, then A+B, then A+B+C and when they have exhausted all attempts they might consider putting on a new top mechanism or they will just let you lemon law it.
Hell, I couldn't even get GM Canada to approve new carpeting when I had the finding nemo effect(flood in backseat floor area caused by water management bag failure).So I spent $45K on a car to have flood ravaged carpeting in it.I must say though my dealer did an excellent job cleaning it up(no musty smell at all).Aside from the obvious problem of design flaw/top problems, the dealers ability to repair such , varies from dealer to dealer.If a dealer has top experience then you have a good chance at a repair(may no solve the rub marks since they are a design flaw) but could have other issues fixed ie broken 5th bow.I have had both my 5th bow replaced and my water management bag replaced at 2 different times as GM Canada would not approve the water management bag replacement at the time the 5th bow was being replaced.Sure enough at 6-7 weeks after 5th bow replaced, I was back in for the finding nemo effect.It has been 2 months since and knock on wood, all seems to be holding together right now.How long the repairs will last is anyones guess.

SnowVert 08-02-2012 06:39 AM

That almost looked like I was watching a video of my roof, except your wrinkles are worse. good luck, keep good documentation and start researching your state's lemon law.

tramtwo 08-02-2012 12:32 PM

Got the car back today. And the first impressions are... great!

The fit of the top while up is perfect. No wrinkles or waves and it doesn't appear to be overly tight.

This new top sits in the well much different than the old. This one folds up more compact. There are no parts of the top that touch the well. It does seem to ride a tad higher.

The interior sound level in the car was good with the old top it is much quieter now. I never checked over my shoulder once to see if the back window was down.

I know GM paid $1,400 to the trim shop to install this top. I looked over everything and can find no defects.

I will post up some photos soon and I will also perform the lotion rub test to see if I am still going to be susceptible to the classic rub marks.

I never believed the tops could look this good. Now if I can just keep it this way.

cactuseater 08-02-2012 02:50 PM

Sending good vibes your way man. Hoping mine comes back just as good in the next few days....

tramtwo 08-02-2012 02:53 PM

See below. I am very happy with the top. There seems to be one wrinkle above the drivers door.. I am assured this is an easy fix.


tramtwo 08-03-2012 03:00 AM

PHOTOS
 
9 Attachment(s)
:clap:

pony 08-03-2012 10:58 AM

THIS looks good. Now lets ALL hope the new tops/fix stay that way.

Calikenn 08-03-2012 11:24 AM

Looks great tramtwo...fingers crossed...good luck!

dannykay 08-03-2012 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tramtwo (Post 5386173)
:clap:

Looks like your windows are tinted.....is the dealership going to compensate you for the back window to get it re-tinted?

tramtwo 08-03-2012 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannykay (Post 5388213)
Looks like your windows are tinted.....is the dealership going to compensate you for the back window to get it re-tinted?

free oil change

tramtwo 08-04-2012 06:39 PM

God provided a good leak test this morning...
 
1 Attachment(s)
Post new top install, water management failed. Dealer wants the car on Monday to have the contractor take a look at it. Unwilling to just order the new bag... :facepalm:

tramtwo 08-04-2012 06:51 PM

Here come the rub marks...
 
2 Attachment(s)
Put the completely dry top down on a country road for about 30 minutes today. Speeds between 35 and 55, no tonneau cover. It needs to be replaced due to peeling and separation of material. The top handle was left in the open position, will not do that again.

Remember these marks appeared in less than 30 minutes of easy driving. Passenger side more pronounced than drivers. Same with the old top. There are also some shallow wrinkles in the B pillars.

I really love this car and am trying very hard to work within the GM service structure to get this fixed. I am sure they have spent at least 5k on this car in the last year on warranty repairs. More to come on Monday. :iono:

vanlieremead 08-04-2012 07:24 PM

3 Attachment(s)
I really just don't understand the failure of the water management system. It's so fundamental to get that right. I was going to mention that the real seal along the edge looks too exposed - a minor knit when you (were) so happy to begin with. Mine was too much exposed - I had them fix it.

I like the mod on the inter-liner clips. Are the wheels exposed a little from the inside with it closed? Look up and to your left while seated.

I get a whistle up and to my left. The dealer told me its normal. It wasn't always there and not immediately after the top was replaced. I can make it come and go by switching the A/C between recycle (no noise) and no recycle (noise).

Hang in there.

Angrybird 12 08-04-2012 07:32 PM

Seems like most of the water bag failures occurred shortly after the tops have been replaced. Is it a coincidence or do the installers damage something while working on the top?

tramtwo 08-04-2012 07:56 PM

Nothing exposed when closed. The fit seems excellent, and the car is unbelievably quiet even at highway speeds. I have 20k miles in a year in the car so am really in-tune with it.

SnowVert 08-04-2012 08:02 PM

I'm sorry to see you are having problems with the new roof. Just keep working with them on it.

spikess581 08-04-2012 09:06 PM

They probably pulled the drain tubes out. Easy fix and over looked by many installers.

cactuseater 08-04-2012 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tramtwo (Post 5392463)
Post new top install, water management failed. Dealer wants the car on Monday to have the contractor take a look at it. Unwilling to just order the new bag... :facepalm:

Fortunately, your leak may be the result of an installation error - as mine was, they installed it upside down on top #2. If not, it's the faulty design of the waterbag.

They will never "shampoo" out the mold and mildew in that thing, never. Why? Because they don't take the carpet out of the car and dis-infect it like trim shops used to back in the 70's and 80's with flood jobs. I did hundred of them from river flooding in the Northeast back in my day working at my dad's trim shop. They don't know how to do this properly, or simply just don;t want to. They you it was steam cleaned or something similar. It's crap, the carpet needs to come out, the padding removed and thrown away, new padding installed, and the carpet thoroughly cleaned on both sides with a disinfectant shampoo. They couldn't get away with it on mine since the carpet is a light grey and shows everything. It also smelled horrible, like rotting trash in a trashcan.

Today's dealers are "parts changers." They look at the computer and go by what GM thinks should be done, not what old fashioned common sense and intuition tell them to do. GM authorizes a shampoo, refuses a new carpet, and a few weeks down the road you're in for a new carpet anyway. It's really freakin' ridiculous anymore. So, demand a carpet kit if all they are going to do is shampoo the carpet while it is still in your car - epic failure. :thumbdown:

If the damn top keeps showing those "V" marks, demand a new mechanism. Those marks are classic on this top - the problem is so widely known already. Keep taking it back. Document the days out of service. And maybe as the last resort get an attorney involved. Not sure of you vehicle history, but you are invited to PM me here and I can help the best I can. I have been through ALL OF THIS already.

Nutbutt 08-05-2012 07:59 AM

Just wondering if they installed the re-designed water management bag when they re did the top. When they replaced my top and mechanics in april the water management bag sent was the old style bag. Luckily my service manager spotted this and kept the larger re-designed one I had installed a month earlier. So far the top on mine has been fantastic, no rub marks just the wave is noticeable above the side windows. I agree with most that GM will not replace the whole mechanics till all attempt to patch fix the top has failed. I still think once the 5th bow is broken they should replace it all. Good luck with the water management replacement.

tramtwo 08-05-2012 10:07 PM

The top is 22972088 F-Cover.

2001ragtop 08-06-2012 10:20 AM

it sounds like the water bag is a separate item. The fit on that new top looks fantastic though.


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