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-   -   NO PERFORMANCE GAINS ACHEIVED WITH MOST MODIFICATIONS (http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48485)

drtwo 10-21-2009 09:02 PM

NO PERFORMANCE GAINS ACHEIVED WITH MOST MODIFICATIONS
 
Now that I have your attention:

IF YOU ROUTINELY RACE YOUR CAR THEN PLEASE DO NOT READ THIS THREAD OR REPLY AS IT DOES NOT APPLY TO YOU!!!

A V6 2010 Camaro has around 304HP
An SS 2010 Camaro has 426HP
A 2009 Pontiac G8 v8 has 361HP

WHY do we spend big $$ on a small 8-10HP gain from a catback exhaust, cold air intake etc.. that will increase our overall HP FARRRRR less than the simple difference in HP gain from a V6 to a V8?

The Horsepower between the cars above varies more than 120HP and yet the performance of each of these cars varies only by tenths of seconds in a quarter mile and maybe less in a 0-60 run. (WITH OVER A HUNDRED HORSEPOWER IN DIFFERENCE)!!!

These modifications look good and sound good, but there seems to be no actualized difference in the cold air intake performance in real life. Although I VERY much appreciate the science and time to test the products!!! Great JOb!

I'd say buy your aftermarket stuff to personalize your car and enjoy it! Take Power gains with a grain of salt. Buy the CAI that looks cool to you and the exhaust that sounds good to you and don't worry about the numbers!!!

If you want real performance gains: you'll have to get a turbo or supercharger or some other extreme engine modification.

Any comments?!

robertway 10-21-2009 09:17 PM

After trying to fully absorb the CAI results thread (http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48202) my understanding is that the CAI by itself doesn't do all that much dollars per hp but instead opens the door to fully utilizing other mods down the line (long tubes, hi-flow exhaust, even forced induction). The stock intake will eventually become a restrictor plate once other things are added to the engine's "respiratory system". Now I could be totally off base with this but the CAI seems to be the first logical step in fully exploiting what the engine will eventually be capable of.

HaveBlue 10-21-2009 09:18 PM

Because no matter how good it is. Nobody likes STOCK. This is America, we want to change it:D (dont mean that obama change thing)

POWERFREAK 10-21-2009 09:20 PM

Let me guess...you're keeping your car stock?

I dunno...you can pretty easily get 50hp without any major modifications (intake/headers/tune)...50hp is a difference that you can feel. Right now I just have a Vararam and a tune...and it's made a HUGE difference "in real life".

1320junkie 10-21-2009 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by POWERFREAK (Post 1074201)
i dunno...you can pretty easily get 50hp without any major modifications (intake/headers/tune)...50hp is a difference that you can feel.

Exactly...and adding to your list a cam..is not considered an extreme engine modification either

Indpowr 10-21-2009 09:26 PM

CAI, Exhaust, etc really are not a huge bang for the buck.

This is why when you read that gears give you the biggest bang for the dollar. They will make you feel like your car gained 50rwhp easily...

2SSRS@Gen5diy 10-21-2009 09:27 PM

CAI or headers work to make the engine take in more air and gas and the more that can go in and out of the motor the more HP you make, there is good headers and some not as good its the same for CAI and with some you need to do a tune and some you don't.

If you go to a NHRA race and see a top fuel car run that car uses 8+ GL of fuel for 1 pass down the track.

coolman 10-21-2009 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drtwo (Post 1074109)
Now that I have your attention:

A V6 2010 Camaro has around 304HP
An SS 2010 Camaro has 426HP
A 2009 Pontiac G8 v8 has 361HP

WHY do we spend big $$ on a small 8-10HP gain from a catback exahust, cold air intake etc.. that will increase our overall HP FARRRRR less than the simple difference in HP gain from a V6 to a V8?

The Horsepower between the cars above varies more than 120HP and yet the performace of each of these cars varies only by tenths of seconds in a quarter mile and maybe less in a 0-60 run. (WITH OVER A HUNDRED HORSEPOWER IN DIFFERENCE)!!!

These modifications look good and sound good, but there seems to be no actualized difference in the cold air intake performance in real life. Although I VERY much appreciate the science and time to test the products!!! Great JOb!

I'd say buy your aftermarket stuff to personalize your car and enjoy it! Take Power gains with a grain of salt. Buy the CAI that looks cool to you and the exhaust that sounds good to you and don't worry about the numbers!!!

If you want real performace gains: you'll have to get a turbo or supercharger or some other extreme engine modification.

Any comments?!

Did you see the post on the new sho. It ran a 12.92 with just a tune.

DocHolliday 10-21-2009 09:29 PM

When will we ever see gears for this car????

Bentley78 10-21-2009 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HaveBlue (Post 1074184)
Because no matter how good it is. Nobody likes STOCK. This is America, we want to change it:D (dont mean that obama change thing)

This is the only thing that made LoL today, good job!

speedster 10-21-2009 09:36 PM

Properly matched bolt-ons and a good tune can easily gain 50-100 hp. People would not be spending their hard earned money if it did not. Things like gears are included here.

It does cost more money, but a Procharger is also a true bolt on. No pulling the intake or anything like that. Easily done in a day. Magnacharger is not much more difficult either. But with FI mods you really want an updated exhaust to maximize the increase.

Missile Man 10-21-2009 09:57 PM

If you own a 2010 SS and don't feel the need to modify............... you need to look down and see if the fella's are still hanging........ :sm0:

1320junkie 10-21-2009 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Missile Man (Post 1074396)
If you own a 2010 SS and don't feel the need to modify............... you need to look down and see if the fella's are still hanging........ :sm0:

Ok maybe I should laugh at this..but it's funny...very funny..sig worthy

coolman 10-21-2009 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Missile Man (Post 1074396)
If you own a 2010 SS and don't feel the need to modify............... you need to look down and see if the fella's are still hanging........ :sm0:

In my mind nobody make a car fast enough from factory. 8hp here ,10hp there, I
would sooner have 444 then 426.

axis 10-21-2009 10:23 PM

Unfortunately on a NA car, you're stuck with small gains that turn into a overall bigger gains. Ever hear the term "ounces make pounds"? Coming from a turbo car where you can just crank a knob and get 50+whp it takes a little getting use to but these are the facts. Add to it that you're getting the "almost corvette" tax added since it's such a new platform and it is a NEW Camaro. If you want REAL gains, give your new car a MUCH NEEDED diet and put it on the bottle. That will give you 100+whp for less than $500. It will still pass emmisions and won't void your warrany, if you take it off before taking it in. Unless i'm mistaken, there isn't a "nitrous" trigger in the ECU and it won't show up in a Tech II report. :rolleyes:

1320junkie 10-21-2009 10:25 PM

Folks tend to make the Dyno a godlike item when in reality it's just a calibration tool.

drtwo 10-21-2009 11:13 PM

I like the responses and still feel that unless you are going to (down the line) do some major modification (NOS, TURBO, SUPERCHARGER) which the VAST majority are NOT, headers and CAI may give you a few extra horsepower, but until you gain well over 100+ HP you won't see any TRUE performace gain (ie.. compare the V6 to the V8 in the 1/4 mile times...and that's OVER 120 EXTRA HP!!!!) 10 here and 20 there will only give you milliseconds... so unless you are a hard core racer...DO IT ONLY FOR THE SHOW, NOT THE 'GO'...

drtwo 10-21-2009 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by POWERFREAK (Post 1074201)
Let me guess...you're keeping your car stock?

I dunno...you can pretty easily get 50hp without any major modifications (intake/headers/tune)...50hp is a difference that you can feel. Right now I just have a Vararam and a tune...and it's made a HUGE difference "in real life".

btw I plan to put axle back exhaust for better sound, but not any gain... but I'm not bashing anyone at all... spend! Spend! Personalize your car to make it kick A$$, (and stimulate the economy while your at it!)

PS... someone still needs to explain why 120 extra HP from the V6 to the V8 give only tenths of seconds in improved performance?

coolman 10-21-2009 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drtwo (Post 1074779)
I like the responses and still feel that unless you are going to (down the line) do some major modification (NOS, TURBO, SUPERCHARGER) which the VAST majority are NOT, headers and CAI may give you a few extra horsepower, but until you gain well over 100+ HP you won't see any TRUE performace gain (ie.. compare the V6 to the V8 in the 1/4 mile times...and that's OVER 120 EXTRA HP!!!!) 10 here and 20 there will only give you milliseconds... so unless you are a hard core racer...DO IT ONLY FOR THE SHOW, NOT THE 'GO'...

I don't know Jimmy Johnsons adds a 1/2lb of air to the right rear and damn near lapps the field.

1320junkie 10-21-2009 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drtwo (Post 1074779)
I like the responses and still feel that unless you are going to (down the line) do some major modification (NOS, TURBO, SUPERCHARGER) which the VAST majority are NOT, headers and CAI may give you a few extra horsepower, but until you gain well over 100+ HP you won't see any TRUE performace gain (ie.. compare the V6 to the V8 in the 1/4 mile times...and that's OVER 120 EXTRA HP!!!!) 10 here and 20 there will only give you milliseconds... so unless you are a hard core racer...DO IT ONLY FOR THE SHOW, NOT THE 'GO'...

you can spend a few thousand on suspension and the car handles totally different...and the pest performance mod in my mind is a driving school...but anyway..I dont believe in NOS, turbo's or superchargers...but I do believe in more cubes head work cams etc...im a n/a guy to my core

coolman 10-21-2009 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1320junkie (Post 1074808)
you can spend a few thousand on suspension and the car handles totally different...and the pest performance mod in my mind is a driving school...but anyway..I dont believe in NOS, turbo's or superchargers...but I do believe in more cubes head work cams etc...im a n/a guy to my core

you have a zr1 and don't believe in superchargers?

1320junkie 10-21-2009 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolman (Post 1074818)
you have a zr1 and don't believe in superchargers?

Nope I got rid of it as I enjoyed my LPE Z06 a lot better...and it was a business move i bout it at MSRP and sold it for way over...made over 28k on the sale

coolman 10-21-2009 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1320junkie (Post 1074829)
Nop I got rid of it as I enjoyed my LPE Z06 a lot better...and it was a business move i bout it at MSRP and sold it for way over...made over 28k on the sale

I'm with you. I love the z06. I hoping to get one in early spring.

2SSRS@Gen5diy 10-21-2009 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1320junkie (Post 1074808)
you can spend a few thousand on suspension and the car handles totally different...and the pest performance mod in my mind is a driving school...but anyway..I dont believe in NOS, turbo's or superchargers...but I do believe in more cubes head work cams etc...im a n/a guy to my core

Same for me no superchargers only big CI and internal mods.

Kelso 10-21-2009 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robertway (Post 1074178)
After trying to fully absorb the CAI results thread (http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48202) my understanding is that the CAI by itself doesn't do all that much dollars per hp but instead opens the door to fully utilizing other mods down the line (long tubes, hi-flow exhaust, even forced induction). The stock intake will eventually become a restrictor plate once other things are added to the engine's "respiratory system". Now I could be totally off base with this but the CAI seems to be the first logical step in fully exploiting what the engine will eventually be capable of.


well written :thumbsup:


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