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-   -   My Dealer Says (10/10/08) GM is limiting pricing to no less than MSRP (http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7953)

PatrickfromMD 10-10-2008 05:42 PM

My Dealer Says (10/10/08) GM is limiting pricing to no less than MSRP
 
Was at my Chevy Dealer again last night working the sales manager to hopefully work with me on pricing when ordering opens up.
He said once he gets his allotment he would be better able to deal with me. I just got off the phone with him and he says his allotment for the 1st model run year is 21.
HE further says MSRP is the lowest they would go, and it was not up to them, it was a decision by GM.
I thought I’d throw this out to you all for comment. I can understand if he’s only getting in 21 for the whole year, why they might not discount (they have an arrangement with COSTO for special member pricing BTW) , but I was surprised to hear them say this was a decision by GM? Does GM have such control over the dealers?

I’d been popping my head in routinely building a relationship, and they claim to be the largest in the Washington DC region, with the largest corvette sales for an even larger area.
Should I go in and plop down a deposit? Is this the best I might hope for?

Crowley 10-10-2008 05:55 PM

I don't know .. I didn't think it worked that way though. I mean they have a cost to buy the car from GM and can sell if for whatever they want? I don't see where it would matter to GM how low a dealership would go? ..

What do I know though .. I could be way off here ..

Crowley

SimC33 10-10-2008 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crowley (Post 152236)
I don't know .. I didn't think it worked that way though. I mean they have a cost to buy the car from GM and can sell if for whatever they want? I don't see where it would matter to GM how low a dealership would go? ..

What do I know though .. I could be way off here ..

Crowley


hey Crowley, I know this is off topic so i apologize in advance, but you have the same 135i that I do! color and everything...lol Ok well sorry for thet..


Carry on....:thumbup:

CamaroScotty 10-10-2008 06:17 PM

Get ready - there are those who SAY MSRP OR LESS.....and then there's those who are....Now the TRUE COLORS will start to come out!

With the funky pre-order system in place, some seem to be thinking the car is now rare and hard to get.

The_Stache 10-10-2008 06:20 PM

GM has no ability to tell the dealerships how to sell cars. All they can do is set the MSRP(Manufacturer SUGGESTED Retail Price). The dealer your so "in" with is lying to you.

A dealer can sell a car for $1.00, they will just be taking a large loss. The dealer could also sell the same car for $1,000,000.00. AND GM could do absolutly ZERO about it.

GM sells the cars to a dealer. The dealer in turn sells them to us.

scotchsride09 10-10-2008 06:21 PM

Patrick; also off-topic but do you have any more info you could share on the Costco member pricing? Is it exclusive to that dealer or across the board?

rolnslo 10-10-2008 06:55 PM

Your dealer is practicing self preservation. As in, he's trying to blame GM when it really is just him being greedy.

Quote:

HE further says MSRP is the lowest they would go, and it was not up to them, it was a decision by GM.
"Would" being the operative word there. "Could" would imply that they was nothing they could do about about it. "Would" says it was their decision.

Federal franchise laws prevent auto manufacturers from controlling prices at the franchise dealer level. They can suggest a price but they can not dictate the final sales price. Most states have laws in place that also prevent manufacturers from selling direct to consumers and also prevents them from owning franchises directly.

headpunter 10-10-2008 07:46 PM

your dealer is lying in to you, as simple as that.

Chewy 10-10-2008 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SimC33 (Post 152239)
hey Crowley, I know this is off topic so i apologize in advance, but you have the same 135i that I do! color and everything...lol Ok well sorry for thet..


Carry on....:thumbup:

WOW, i test drove the 135i (blk w/ blk n red interior) loooved the car but a bit out of my price range brand new:cry:

now onto the Camaro:headbang:

Crowley 10-10-2008 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SimC33 (Post 152239)
hey Crowley, I know this is off topic so i apologize in advance, but you have the same 135i that I do! color and everything...lol Ok well sorry for thet..


Carry on....:thumbup:

Cool .. do you post on 1addicts? ..

Ok .. back to topic . .. LOL

SimC33 10-10-2008 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crowley (Post 152393)
Cool .. do you post on 1addicts? ..

Ok .. back to topic . .. LOL


Yes sir...been on there for quite a while!

NOW....back to topic.... :laugh:

playhard67 10-10-2008 08:43 PM

I have read elsewhere that franchise laws prevent GM from telling their dealers what they have to sell the car for...hence MSRP

headpunter 10-10-2008 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by playhard67 (Post 152403)
I have read elsewhere that franchise laws prevent GM from telling their dealers what they have to sell the car for...hence MSRP

M anufacturers S uggested R etail P rice

Silverghost 10-10-2008 08:58 PM

Your dealer is telling fibbs

http://web.camaross.com/forums/showp...17&postcount=6

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fbodfather (Post 4164917)
You are, for the most part, correct.

GM or any other manufacturer is strictly prohibited from telling a dealer what he/she can or cannot sell a car for... It's called anti-trust and the United States Government takes it very seriously. When a GM employee is hired as a 'field' contact, there is a stack of papers he/she must sign. (and I DO mean a stack!) One of them is called the "Discount House Decree" from wayyyyyyyyy back in the early 50s. We cannot -- under any circumstances, tell a dealer what they can charge for a car. Shortly after that decision, the Monroney law was passed that requires that all new vehicles have a window sticker that plainly spells out the MSRP of the vehicle. (thus the term 'monroney label')

Now.......fine, you say......just don't give the dealer any more cars! Wrong again. That is called "mal-distribution' -- and again, the manufacturer is strictly prohibited from "cutting a dealer off" -- so to speak. We must have a distribution system in place that allocates product and it must withstand court scrutiny...............for instance: You might go into a small Chevy dealer --- or Honda dealer, for that matter -- and give him/her a deposit on a hot selling model. (think Z06) The dealer gets product allocated to him based on sales history. Not TOTAL sales history, but history on that particular vehicle line. (in cases of a brand new nameplate, the allocation is usually a blend of one or more existing vehicle lines balanced with a market study) --I digress. In the case of Corvette, we provide dealers with a letter that tells them how many Corvettes they will receive in a given timeframe. If the dealer takes 15 sold orders -- and he/she is only going to get 5-- there are going to be 10 very upset customers....and here's the clincher----we can't tell you "well, he's only getting 5, but go to "Dealer B" 'cause he's getting 24!" -- 'cause that's against the law as well.

So you see, my friends........this isn't necessarily an easy business! Further, I can see that Dodge and Chevy are going to have problems meeting demand for the Challenger and Camaro -- and that in two years, we will, in some cases, be highly criticized on this very site -- 'cause someone isn't getting their Challenger or Camaro in a 'timely' manner.

(And NOW you know why I have such little hair left!)


headpunter 10-10-2008 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silverghost (Post 152416)

nice find.

EllwynX 10-10-2008 09:55 PM

A local dealer eMailed me today with the info that they would be allocated 12 Camaro's. And that the price would be $2500 OVER MSRP.

Which is disappointing because that was my preferred dealership since I bought my last Camaro from them...

PatrickfromMD 10-11-2008 03:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silverghost (Post 152416)
Your dealer is telling fibbs

"Originally Posted by Fbodfather
You are, for the most part, correct.

GM or any other manufacturer is strictly prohibited from telling a dealer what he/she can or cannot sell a car for... It's called anti-trust and the United States Government takes it very seriously. When a GM employee is hired as a 'field' contact, there is a stack of papers he/she must sign. (and I DO mean a stack!) One of them is called the "Discount House Decree" from wayyyyyyyyy back in the early 50s. We cannot -- under any circumstances, tell a dealer what they can charge for a car. Shortly after that decision, the Monroney law was passed that requires that all new vehicles have a window sticker that plainly spells out the MSRP of the vehicle. (thus the term 'monroney label')

Now.......fine, you say......just don't give the dealer any more cars! Wrong again. That is called "mal-distribution' -- and again, the manufacturer is strictly prohibited from "cutting a dealer off" -- so to speak. We must have a distribution system in place that allocates product and it must withstand court scrutiny...............for instance: You might go into a small Chevy dealer --- or Honda dealer, for that matter -- and give him/her a deposit on a hot selling model. (think Z06) The dealer gets product allocated to him based on sales history. Not TOTAL sales history, but history on that particular vehicle line. (in cases of a brand new nameplate, the allocation is usually a blend of one or more existing vehicle lines balanced with a market study) --I digress. In the case of Corvette, we provide dealers with a letter that tells them how many Corvettes they will receive in a given timeframe. If the dealer takes 15 sold orders -- and he/she is only going to get 5-- there are going to be 10 very upset customers....and here's the clincher----we can't tell you "well, he's only getting 5, but go to "Dealer B" 'cause he's getting 24!" -- 'cause that's against the law as well.

So you see, my friends........this isn't necessarily an easy business! Further, I can see that Dodge and Chevy are going to have problems meeting demand for the Challenger and Camaro -- and that in two years, we will, in some cases, be highly criticized on this very site -- 'cause someone isn't getting their Challenger or Camaro in a 'timely' manner."



http://web.camaross.com/forums/showp...17&postcount=6

Thankyou for commenting on this subject. BTW, I know I wrote Dealer “would not” but actually I meant he said he “could not” go below MSRP per GM. I did get him to agree (on the phone at least) if allocations change then things are open for discussion. He said a deposit is refundable. I think the smart move is to make a deposit and place an order. Some where I will have to sign on the dotted line and I may notate “as per your instruction that GM will not allow above MSRP sales for this allocation”. If there is some place I can include this, I can use it as a bargaining chip later perhaps ? thoughts? Perhaps as things get closer to delivery, things will ease up and they can work more on price (or from recent rumors, maybe Chrysler will be calling the shots by then hehe....just kidding, I sure hope not) . I suppose when the time comes , show them the antitrust laws (but I don’t want them to say, ok, we will give your slot to someone else. :barf: Its going to be a delicately played out deal with the almighty dealer :bow: I suppose.

SilverTurtle 10-11-2008 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PatrickfromMD (Post 152797)
Thankyou for commenting on this subject. BTW, I know I wrote Dealer “would not” but actually I meant he said he “could not” go below MSRP per GM. I did get him to agree (on the phone at least) if allocations change then things are open for discussion. He said a deposit is refundable. I think the smart move is to make a deposit and place an order. Some where I will have to sign on the dotted line and I may notate “as per your instruction that GM will not allow above MSRP sales for this allocation”. If there is some place I can include this, I can use it as a bargaining chip later perhaps ? thoughts? Perhaps as things get closer to delivery, things will ease up and they can work more on price (or from recent rumors, maybe Chrysler will be calling the shots by then hehe....just kidding, I sure hope not) . I suppose when the time comes , show them the antitrust laws (but I don’t want them to say, ok, we will give your slot to someone else. :barf: Its going to be a delicately played out deal with the almighty dealer :bow: I suppose.

honestly, you're in VA and Tom Henry Chevy is in Bakerstown, PA... skip dealing with the hassel of your dealership and call Tom Henry... he will hook you up with what you want and he will have the allocation to get you a car... call your local dealership and tell them that you were guaranteed MSRP at another dealership and you're taking your business somewhere else unless they guarantee you the same thing... bring up that you know there are anti-trust laws in the US that stop GM from being able to dictate what a car is sold at... if they still stiff arm you, walk... you'll be better off... and if you order from Tom Henry, you'll have about a 5 hour or less drive home to get used to the car.

that or get in touch with CamaroScotty and have him drop ship it to that dealership so your local dealership has to watch you take possession of a car that they could have sold you... lol

Txturbo 10-11-2008 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by diarmadhi (Post 152264)
GM has no ability to tell the dealerships how to sell cars. All they can do is set the MSRP(Manufacturer SUGGESTED Retail Price). The dealer your so "in" with is lying to you.

A dealer can sell a car for $1.00, they will just be taking a large loss. The dealer could also sell the same car for $1,000,000.00. AND GM could do absolutly ZERO about it.

GM sells the cars to a dealer. The dealer in turn sells them to us.

Actually, most dealers don't own the cars. They just have them floorplanned through GMAC and just pay interest on them until sold.

KILLER74Z28 10-11-2008 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PatrickfromMD (Post 152216)
Was at my Chevy Dealer again last night working the sales manager to hopefully work with me on pricing when ordering opens up.
He said once he gets his allotment he would be better able to deal with me. I just got off the phone with him and he says his allotment for the 1st model run year is 21.
HE further says MSRP is the lowest they would go, and it was not up to them, it was a decision by GM.
I thought I’d throw this out to you all for comment. I can understand if he’s only getting in 21 for the whole year, why they might not discount (they have an arrangement with COSTO for special member pricing BTW) , but I was surprised to hear them say this was a decision by GM? Does GM have such control over the dealers?

I’d been popping my head in routinely building a relationship, and they claim to be the largest in the Washington DC region, with the largest corvette sales for an even larger area.
Should I go in and plop down a deposit? Is this the best I might hope for?

Well, now you know you dealer is not an honest dealer… :bs:;)

Angrybird 12 10-11-2008 12:09 PM

What others have said is correct MSRP is just that a suggested retail price, By Law they cannot tell what a car can be sold for but they can charge the dealer a set price per car they sell..now if GM charges the dealer the MSRP price for the car then the dealer would not go below that price or he would actually lose money. A lot has to do with how much a dealer actually pays GM for a car, The number of sales is a major factor, the more volume he does the less per car he pays and a honest dealer will sell the cars for less because he makes it up on the number he sells. where a smaller dealer will have to stick closer to MSRP just to make money, because he pays more per car.

kevin2323 10-11-2008 12:50 PM

thye said the same thing about the gtr and challenger...yea they cant control the dealers....not gonna happen.

MotorCityAgent 10-11-2008 08:32 PM

Im cool with MSRP on a functional scoop equipted Z28!

fastfret7 10-12-2008 12:00 AM

O.K. the same thing happened with the 05 Mustang when it came out. the dealers marked all the GT above MSRP and the V6's you could get for MSRP. The dealers are suffing in this falling market. So, yeah their going to mark up the car as much as they can. Because if you don't buy it someone else will. Hopefully they will take the pre-orders at MSRP and mark up the "instock" cars.

I have a deal through my company to get GM cars/trucks for a discount. But, I think I'm still going to have to pay MSRP.

Basically what I'm trying to say is that "yes, the dealers are going to price slap. Call around and haggle them down and if they won't bend go somewhere else. this is going to be a full production car. Be patient everyone will be getting their camaro. Hell, if you wait long enough you might get the color and trim you wanted.
:readthethread:

Txturbo 10-12-2008 08:00 AM

My deal is in writing and its below MSRP.


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