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-   -   Spohn Del-Sphere Trailing Arms Installed (http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81353)

caverman 05-04-2010 11:30 AM

Spohn Del-Sphere Trailing Arms Installed
 
13 Attachment(s)
SoÖwith my first trip to the race track I could not get my car to do anything but wheel hop all through 1st and part of 2nd. I came back to the forum and got some good info on how to help prevent wheel hop when launching. One of the things is to install some aftermarket Trailing Arms. The two different Mfgs recommended were BMR and Spohn. I was going to go with BMR because others had used them with a lot of luck and I had never heard of Spohn but after I watched the video on their Del-Sphere product and talking with one of their techs I was sold. They cost me $213 to my door and after getting them I can say I was extremely impressed by how well it was built and it looks like itís worth every penny. Itís a very nice piece and I would recommend it to anyone wanting some Trailing Arms.

http://www.spohn.net/shop/2010-Chevr...ar-Suspension/
http://www.spohn.net/delsphere/

The install was every easy. An 18mm socket and wrench, some bearing grease, a crescent wrench (maybe), and a torque wrench should be all you would need. While I had the car in the air I did a few things but the trailing arm install only took about 30-45 min. Since they are shipped set to the same length as the factory Trailing Arms an alignment shouldnít be needed.

Here are some pics. The only issue I had was that one side the Del-Sphere end didnít quite fit. A slight pull from the crescent wrench on the mounting bracket fixed that with ease.

It will be a couple weeks before I can get back to the track and Iíll report back after I do so. I just thought these were extremely nice and wanted to share so others could see. Iíll probably get the Toe Links eventually but I was told the Trailing Arms are what really make a difference.

Bruce@raymondsperformance 05-04-2010 11:52 AM

The spohn parts are great we have used them on our road race car for years.I noticed in the photo you have not changed the rear bushing yet,they are a must if you are going to do much drag racing.

GQ4Life 05-04-2010 12:06 PM

wonder why you wheel hop so bad. I only wheel hopped first launch cuz I spun too much.. every other one just got a lil wheel spin and went.. Though I did lower air pressure alot second time..

Either way let me know how well that part works.. I'll prob be spinning alot when Supercharger installed so might need that..
So they are solid no bushings?
Any noticable added virbration?

caverman 05-04-2010 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raymo1 (Post 1805190)
The spohn parts are great we have used them on our road race car for years.I noticed in the photo you have not changed the rear bushing yet,they are a must if you are going to do much drag racing.

No...no rear bushings yet. Other than some drop springs this is the only other suspension upgrade. Lack of money makes me have to be very selective on what I can do. From my understanding the TAs are a big culprit for wheel hop and since they were'nt expensive and easy to install it was a no brainer.

So what are your recommendations on rear bushings? I might as well start my research to see how much money I need and what kind of install they would be.


Quote:

Originally Posted by GQ4Life (Post 1805248)
wonder why you wheel hop so bad. I only wheel hopped first launch cuz I spun too much.. every other one just got a lil wheel spin and went.. Though I did lower air pressure alot second time..

Either way let me know how well that part works.. I'll prob be spinning alot when Supercharger installed so might need that..
So they are solid no bushings?
Any noticable added virbration?

My trip to the track was a very last minute thing. Even then I wasn't going to race until a friend talked me into it and even paid the race fee. So....I wasn't prepared at all. I didn't do anything to my car. No lowering of air pressure and I was popping the clutch to hard. I'm going to practice that in a parking lot soon.

Take a look at the link about Del-Sphere that I posted and you'll see exactly how they work...but no....I don't think they are a solid bushing at all. They rotate which makes them a better product than just the solid mounted TAs with poly bushings.

So far I've felt no difference in driveability. No vibrations, stiffness, or noise. However....I haven't even had them on 24 hrs yet and there was so much dew in the air last night because it had rained earlier that I couldn't really test them out. Stay tuned to the thread as I'll be posting more along the way.

Moriartii 05-04-2010 12:43 PM

Out of curiosity why did you not consider the Pfadt TA's? I see that BMR and Spohn were on the list but not Pfadt hence why I ask, as someone who is looking to do the same with my suspension I am curious about your thought process.

Install looks very nice!
Cheers
K

Bruce@raymondsperformance 05-04-2010 01:26 PM

I would start with replacing the rear diff bushings and the rear sub frame bushings next,they will make a big improvement.The OE bushings are very soft and allow alot of movement in the rear of the car.there are a few good ones on the market,we used Pedders on our car.

caverman 05-04-2010 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moriartii (Post 1805375)
Out of curiosity why did you not consider the Pfadt TA's? I see that BMR and Spohn were on the list but not Pfadt hence why I ask, as someone who is looking to do the same with my suspension I am curious about your thought process.

Install looks very nice!
Cheers
K

Honestly I was initially recommended to look at BMR and Spohn. Phadt and LSR were never brought up. I had already been looking at BMR because I had seen a handfull of people using them but once I looked at Spohn and saw the Del-sphere I was immediately sold.

I just took a look at the Pfadt TAs and I'm will say that I would have still chosen the Spohn without a doubt. Not that there is anything wrong with BMR, Pfadt, or LSR.....I just think the way the Del-sphere joint works is going to be much better by for all around street and racing. It allows for rotation of the end, can be adjusted, and can be rebuilt if needed. None of the other products I saw could do anyting like it. That's just my opinion.....again I'm not knocking the other Mfgs and I'm not a suspension expert by any means. It just made since to me once I saw the way it works.

Now I will say that the Pfadt and LSR TAs should be a lot lighter. That's one negative about the Spohn is that it's heavier than the factory arm. Not by a ton but I'm sure probably 2lbs per arm. However, for my the other advantages seem to out wiegh the wieght disadvantage.

Look at all the products and make a decision based on what you think will work best for your situation. For me the Spohn TA is an awesome piece and I look forward to getting it out to the track to put it through some real world testing.

caverman 05-04-2010 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raymo1 (Post 1805527)
I would start with replacing the rear diff bushings and the rear sub frame bushings next,they will make a big improvement.The OE bushings are very soft and allow alot of movement in the rear of the car.there are a few good ones on the market,we used Pedders on our car.

Won't replacing the bushings cause it to ride a bit rougher? I guess I need to do a search on the forum to see what it takes to install them. Don't you have to almost take out the whole rear end to get to the bushings? Also, do you know about what they cost?

Moriartii 05-04-2010 02:08 PM

Thanks Caver!!! I looked between the two and cost played in the favor of Spohn as well. I see what you mean about the Del-sphere also. Did you upgrade to the Chromoly or get the standard piece?

Cheers
K

danhr 05-04-2010 02:14 PM

very nice. These are the ones I am going to get. I used a lot of spohn pieces on my 4th gen, and was impressed. And the design of this trailing arm, imho, seems like the best on the market right now. It is available in chromemoly, which is a giant plus, as others on the market are only made out of common grade steel. the welds from spohn are always spot on. and the key point in the design of these are the joints, imho. and spohn nailed that dead on, with their del-sphere design. I especially like the groves in the bushings to help better distribute the grease.

I'd like to get some feedback on the del-sphere's though. How noisey are they? I had something similar on my 4th gen, from j&m parts, for my LCA's.

caverman 05-04-2010 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moriartii (Post 1805698)
Thanks Caver!!! I looked between the two and cost played in the favor of Spohn as well. I see what you mean about the Del-sphere also. Did you upgrade to the Chromoly or get the standard piece?

Cheers
K

No.....just the standard. If your worried about weight you might go with the Chormoly but I didn't see the need for me.

If you have any questions either call them or Chat with them from their website. They answered right away and I asked a bunch of questions through their Chat feature.

They seemed to be real good guys. I ordered in the late morning, it was shipped right after lunch, and got it in about 3 days.

Michael_Js 05-04-2010 02:16 PM

I like the Pfadt ones - they come with both new bushing sets - need a bushing tool to get the lower one out! ;)

haven't taken her to the track yet - 5/17 ;)

Moriartii 05-04-2010 02:16 PM

Nice!!!! Thanks again Caver!!!
Cheers
K

caverman 05-04-2010 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moriartii (Post 1805746)
Nice!!!! Thanks again Caver!!!
Cheers
K

BTW: Don't buy any grease for the Del-Shere arms. Even though they have the grease ends on them the Del-Sphere come greased from the factory. I had already ordered the grease with the arms when they emailed me the install instructions. When I looked at the instructions it said not to grease them and that any additional grease would just collect dirt.

Now....their other arms are a different story. I think you have to grease them.....not like that's a big deal....just letting everyone know.

caverman 05-04-2010 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael_Js (Post 1805743)
I like the Pfadt ones - they come with both new bushing sets - need a bushing tool to get the lower one out! ;)

haven't taken her to the track yet - 5/17 ;)

Yes....it would probably be better to replace the factory lower bushing but from my understanding the flexing comes from the cheap, thin, pressed metal that the factory arms are made from more than the bushings. The Del-Sphere end does replace the upper TA bushing so you're only re-using the lower factory bushing.

GQ4Life 05-04-2010 05:59 PM

So what do you guys think should be done first?
diff bushing, rear sub frame, or trailing arms?

PfadtRacing 05-07-2010 04:09 PM

Hey guys thank you for recommending our products. It just looks like the different manufacturers of rear trailing arms for the new Camaro have attacked it from different perspectives, thats all! Caverman obviously did some research and formed his own opinion as to what he felt would be best for his car and use. Naturally we want everyone to see the benefits our Pfadt products in particular but its great to see people making decisions this way! Not all products address every issue, and finding out which ones are important to you is a great way to go about it!

GQ4Life, it is our opinion that starting with the Rear Trailing Arms is a great idea. We have had many customers respond to us after installing our Pfadt arms that the wheel hop is gone. Others have had the same experience using our Rear Subframe Bushings. The Rear Subframe Bushings are a fantastic upgrade for many different reasons. But if your sole goal it to reduce wheel hop and have more controlled transfer of power to the ground, then trailing arms and diff bushings are where you want to start! Hope this helps guys!

caverman 05-07-2010 04:27 PM

I'm going to try the Spohn's with the factory bushings. If I still have issues the bushings will be next.

I'm just trying to save up for some headers and a tune. Unfortunately my mod fund had to take a small hit for the TAs but the headers won't do me any good if I can't get the power to the ground.

GQ4Life 05-07-2010 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PfadtRacing (Post 1819925)
Hey guys thank you for recommending our products. It just looks like the different manufacturers of rear trailing arms for the new Camaro have attacked it from different perspectives, thats all! Caverman obviously did some research and formed his own opinion as to what he felt would be best for his car and use. Naturally we want everyone to see the benefits our Pfadt products in particular but its great to see people making decisions this way! Not all products address every issue, and finding out which ones are important to you is a great way to go about it!

GQ4Life, it is our opinion that starting with the Rear Trailing Arms is a great idea. We have had many customers respond to us after installing our Pfadt arms that the wheel hop is gone. Others have had the same experience using our Rear Subframe Bushings. The Rear Subframe Bushings are a fantastic upgrade for many different reasons. But if your sole goal it to reduce wheel hop and have more controlled transfer of power to the ground, then trailing arms and diff bushings are where you want to start! Hope this helps guys!

Thank you for the answer. It helps alot. I got my excel mod sheet I have to go add this too LoL

nuptualnemesis 05-08-2010 01:58 PM

BMR makes the cheapest differential bushings. It is a three hour job to change these bushings. A BMR franchisee may have a tool to speed this up. I haven't changed mine because of labor cost. Do subframe bushings at the same time because subframe removal is probably required unless there is some special tool involved.

I did install the Pedder EP1200 subframe insert bushings and they did tighten things up. You can feel the expansion filler bumps a little more on a concrete road but it is no worse than my Nissan truck which rides pretty nice. I don't notice it on the Interstate or asphalt. These were $255.00 and pretty easy to put in. They fit above and below stock subframe bushings. I think this is worthwhile.

The EP1201 is a replacement bushing set for $462 and they even have an EP 1201HD set for $595.00. Both require removal of stock bushings. This is labor intensive. I think they make a tool that helps. These are recommended over 450 rwhp I believe. I am sure these will make the ride harsher.

I installed the BMR toe rods because it was easy but didn't really notice a difference in launch. The Spohn toe rods are adustable for toe adjustment on alignment. BMR makes an adjustable and non-adjustable toe rod.

After market lower control arms are coming out now. They may help more than upper toe rods. Stock control arms look pretty strong though.

I really don't have an issue with wheel hop with the 17" MT's. The Nitto drag radials will help control wheel hop probably more than anything else after the Trailing Arms. You can run them between 16 and 20 PSI to stop wheel hop. They will also improve 60 ft. more than any other add on and save the expensive stock street tire.

The 18"Z06 replica rims are pretty cheap and fit well. You can then run any brand drag radial. I can run a 1" shorter tire in front than back with no ABS issues. I assume same is true visa versa. Smaller the front tire the more weight savings where it counts. ABS keeps getting more sophisticated and you may even be able to get away with bigger difference in tire size.

It looked like the current, just shipped, GM High Tech Magazine test of Nitto NTO5R's ran a 18x9 front Z06 rim on the back with the NTO5R and stock rim and tire on front. This is probably a 2" tire height difference. I have been told the rear Z06 18x10.5 rim will also work but I would think the backspacing is awfully close to the back of the wheel well. (small spacer?)

caverman 05-08-2010 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nuptualnemesis (Post 1823614)
BMR makes the cheapest differential bushings. It is a three hour job to change these bushings. A BMR franchisee may have a tool to speed this up. I haven't changed mine because of labor cost. Do subframe bushings at the same time because subframe removal is probably required unless there is some special tool involved.

I did install the Pedder EP1200 subframe insert bushings and they did tighten things up. You can feel the expansion filler bumps a little more on a concrete road but it is no worse than my Nissan truck which rides pretty nice. I don't notice it on the Interstate or asphalt. These were $255.00 and pretty easy to put in. They fit above and below stock subframe bushings. I think this is worthwhile.

The EP1201 is a replacement bushing set for $462 and they even have an EP 1201HD set for $595.00. Both require removal of stock bushings. This is labor intensive. I think they make a tool that helps. These are recommended over 450 rwhp I believe. I am sure these will make the ride harsher.

I installed the BMR toe rods because it was easy but didn't really notice a difference in launch. The Spohn toe rods are adustable for toe adjustment on alignment. BMR makes an adjustable and non-adjustable toe rod.

After market lower control arms are coming out now. They may help more than upper toe rods. Stock control arms look pretty strong though.

I really don't have an issue with wheel hop with the 17" MT's. The Nitto drag radials will help control wheel hop probably more than anything else after the Trailing Arms. You can run them between 16 and 20 PSI to stop wheel hop. They will also improve 60 ft. more than any other add on and save the expensive stock street tire.

The 18"Z06 replica rims are pretty cheap and fit well. You can then run any brand drag radial. I can run a 1" shorter tire in front than back with no ABS issues. I assume same is true visa versa. Smaller the front tire the more weight savings where it counts. ABS keeps getting more sophisticated and you may even be able to get away with bigger difference in tire size.

It looked like the current, just shipped, GM High Tech Magazine test of Nitto NTO5R's ran a 18x9 front Z06 rim on the back with the NTO5R and stock rim and tire on front. This is probably a 2" tire height difference. I have been told the rear Z06 18x10.5 rim will also work but I would think the backspacing is awfully close to the back of the wheel well. (small spacer?)

Thanks for the info....

Do you have a link for the Z06 replica wheels? I might consider those as well if I can't get things to hook up. I'm hoping to get back out to the track at the end of May or begining of June to see if all the tips that were given + the trailing arms help out. I have a feeling I'll do a lot better the next time. I'm also going to go practice the heel/toe launches in a big parking lot again.

PfadtRacing 05-10-2010 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GQ4Life (Post 1821424)
Thank you for the answer. It helps alot. I got my excel mod sheet I have to go add this too LoL

No worries! Glad to help.

2010 SSRS 05-10-2010 12:52 PM

nice

Silver2SSRS6spd 06-23-2010 11:39 PM

Thanks for all of the info Caverman, I just ordered the Tubular Rear Trailing Arms with Del-Sphere Pivot Joints in chrome-molly with the adjustment tool. I have raced the car one and had the wheel hop and can also see it at the end of my burnouts on the street. I will post more info after testing them out.

Viral 06-24-2010 09:36 AM

While I haven't been to the strip yet, I have yet to experience wheel hop as far as I can tell. Depending on what RPMs I launch from, I either bog or spin the tires. I do my best to balance these two, but why am I not experiencing wheel hop on factory PZeros when so many others are? My best 60 ft time (according to the dynolicious iphone app) was 2.19s. Am I simply not launching hard enough yet to introduce wheel hop? And finally, given my situation, would my launches still benefit from these TAs even if my wheels are staying on the ground?


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