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Old 09-24-2008, 02:46 PM   #15
radz28
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Can someone explain the difference between shorties and long tube headers. I mean obviosly shorties are shorter but what do they do differently and why would this make GM offer shorties?
In F-bodies, shorties as of late have typically just been a replacement for the OEM manifold, keeping the cats' in their original location(s). Hooker, Edelbrock, and possible a couple others (I can't think of for sure at this time) are a couple of the companies who have spent resources to test their shorties to pass CARB laws. GM would make shorties in order to pass CARB laws because there are no CARB-legal long tubes (LTs) (for at least 4th. Gen. F-bodies) because they don't light the cats' off quick enough and get them and keep them hot enough to burn all the emissions they're designed and supposed to. I have validated this by testing my own LTs with an infrared digital thermometer and found at idle the temps' just aft of the exhaust ports were around 700-800*s but when I check just in front of my cats', temps' were already down to around 400*. Cats' are designed to run hot (although they can run too hot a burn up - not litterally) in order to burn off more emissions. In addition, LTs are usually more difficult to install because they usually take up more space than shorties. Another thing to consider is that 02 sensors are designed to run under certain conditions to send accurate signals to the PCM and if you move them downstream of the their original location(s) they may not be operating under the same conditions and send false information (voltage) to the PCM (i.e. having already said the further you go down the header (or exhaust) the cooler the gasses get and if you move the sensor(s) further away from the exhaust port it may not be operating within the range it is supposed to.) I know this from experience with mid-length and LTs and have had my tuner disable the PCM from referrencing the 02s. There are people on both sides of the fence on whether or not this is the best approach, in this regard, but I'm just going by experience and with my tuner.

Power-wise, shories can produce really good power if you rev' the engine high enough but you can have a more power under the curve with LTs because they scavange the exhaust and actually pull more spend gasses, after combustion in the engine, so the new air-fuel mixture will be less polluted by the previous combustion event. Think about it like flushing your toilet - shorties would leave more of your waste in the bowl than LTs because LTs will evacuate the bowl better leaving clear water there.

I could go on more, and this is all off the cuff, but I'd be happy to clarify. There's a lot I left out and some I'm sure I'd revise, but that's the sum of it
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Old 09-24-2008, 03:31 PM   #16
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better put thier flame suits on
No joke. Alot of the people over there don't even know what they're talking about, they just like to be assholes.
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Old 09-24-2008, 03:36 PM   #17
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Headpunter - didn't John Cox say this weekend that whatever bolt on performance parts you buy through the dealer will not void the warranty?
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Old 09-24-2008, 05:05 PM   #18
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Headpunter - didn't John Cox say this weekend that whatever bolt on performance parts you buy through the dealer will not void the warranty?
Assuming that's what you heard, this is exactly the reason I won't be straying too far from GMPP or accessory parts Even IF GM were to offer LTs, they would almost be guaranteed to be "Race Only" and not be offered with a warranty.

JMVHO.
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Old 09-24-2008, 05:53 PM   #19
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yeah the GMPP stuff has its own warranty that covers any gaps it creates.
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Old 09-24-2008, 06:35 PM   #20
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Headpunter - didn't John Cox say this weekend that whatever bolt on performance parts you buy through the dealer will not void the warranty?
Yeah I Heard Something To that effect..
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Old 09-24-2008, 06:36 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by radz282003 View Post
Assuming that's what you heard, this is exactly the reason I won't be straying too far from GMPP or accessory parts Even IF GM were to offer LTs, they would almost be guaranteed to be "Race Only" and not be offered with a warranty.

JMVHO.
One thing to keep in mind is the approach they are taking with this car with respect to over the counter parts. They really want the buyer to be able to customize the car to his/her taste and are going to offer more neat stuff then they have in the past.

Take the engine covers and interior lighting packages for example. GM has never gone that far before in having those type of parts available at launch. Usually they left it to the aftermarket.
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Old 09-24-2008, 06:47 PM   #22
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they want the car to appeal to the average guy that could do a couple little weekend projects here and there so the car can be his own.
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Old 09-24-2008, 10:13 PM   #23
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Will headers void the warranty for the SS? I am pretty sure an aftermarket cam will.
Shop around for a good service department just like you do to purchase the car, you don’t have to get it serviced where you purchased it.

A good friend of mine Found a local dealership with a motor head for a service writer; in fact the service writer drives a moded F-body. My friend was still under warranty and had headers, cam, and heads when He had a problem with the rear end (Good ole 10 bolt). They replaced it under warranty. It was kind of funny to see the tech start it up, he sat there for a second right after turning the key "something is certainly wrong with the idle" written all over his face.
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