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Old 04-20-2010, 02:39 PM   #1
1977and2010
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Rear subframe bushing help

What all is involved in changing out rear subframe bushings? Any special tools needed, alignment. Does the cradle need to come completely out? Please help.
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Old 04-20-2010, 07:13 PM   #2
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I see you need some help with a little body role. LOL

I have done quite a few complete subframe bushings. They are acutally pretty easy.

Check this link and you can actually see the tool that I use.


Using the tool takes about 2-3 minutes a bushing.

But it can be donw without our special Pedders tool, and without removing the subframe.

1. You will have to lower the subframe about 6 inches, remove the black metal covers on each of the subframes. They are tight and will require significant prying off.

2. Drill a large hole thru the rubber

3. With a reciprical saw, core the rubber out of the bushing

4. CAREFULLY cut a 1 inch strip of the outer fiberglass jacket out and then cut another slice 180 degrees. SPECIAL PRECAUTION. USE EXTREME CARE NOT TO CUT INTO THE SUBFRAME EYELET. IF YOU DO CUT INTO IT, MAKE SURE YOU SAND OUT THE SHARP EDGES. POLY DOES NOT LIKE SHARP EDGES


5. At least for our Pedders complete bushings, EP1201 and EP1201HD, we want toe eyelets very clean. The OE units use a blue glue or sealer of some kind that must be removed from the eyelets so our poly bushing is
tight up against the metal eyelets.

6. Install the bushings and raise the subframe back into the body, with care aligning the rear pins to the bushings.

Please note the bolts are seriously tight on the rear subframe and is important to torque them correctly


Does this help?

thanks
mike
dms
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Old 04-20-2010, 09:20 PM   #3
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That's exactly what I was looking for thanks a lot.
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Old 04-21-2010, 03:46 PM   #4
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DMS that is funny you should say that because I am still waiting for my solution B sway bars. They were ordered dec 10 2009 from precision motorsports in odessa fl. Whats the deal?
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Old 04-21-2010, 04:38 PM   #5
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How about this option



These are relatively straight forward to install and are a very nice upgrade for your intended use, auto crossing. In fact the car that won the auto cross at 5fest was using these bushings.
Here is a video of them in action


As for installation, you will need to drop the rear cradle which is really relatively easy and can be done with some jack stands.
I would encourage you to review these instructions to give you an in depth perspective into the install http://www.pfadtracing.com/blog/wp-c...stallation.pdf

Also if you are are tired of waiting and would like an equivalent product I have Pfadt sport sways on the shelf ready to ship , and I would be happy to get you a Camaro5 Member deal.

Hope some of this information may be enlightening, please message me or contact me if you would like any further information.

Good luck
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Old 04-21-2010, 06:50 PM   #6
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I'm seriously considering that. If I hadn't paid already I'd be all over it. If they don't came in very very soon I'm jumping ship.
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Old 04-21-2010, 07:12 PM   #7
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Thank you Brandon, for posting up with the Pfadt info. Yes this past weekend was great for us, considering our suspension was featured on both of the class winners! The street tire class winner only had our 1.25" Drop Springs and Sport Sway Bars installed!

Anyway, 1977and2010, the install ins not that bad. If you have done a couple DIY modifications this will be no problem for you. Our Rear Subframe Bushings are solid, and are the ultimate solution to reducing any type of subframe movement on your Camaro. Take a look at the video! Thanks for your time.

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Old 04-21-2010, 07:29 PM   #8
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Pedders offers 3 levels of subframe bushing performance. No one else does.
They are:

1. EP1200 inserts that are good to 500 rear hp
2. EP1201 that are good for over 500hp at the rear
3. EP1201HD. These units are animal!! You cannot make enough hp at the rear to distort of move these. They are as hard as delrin. Here is what they look like installed:

THE REAR PEDDERS EP1201HD SERIOUSLY HD SUBFRAME BUSHING


FRONT PEDDERS EP1201HD SERIOUSLY HD SUBFRAME BUSHING


thanks
mike
dms
They have been track proven! You will not be dissapointed
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Old 04-22-2010, 05:10 PM   #9
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I hate to likely shoot myself in the foot, but I gotta' ask:

Are there any videos of the Pedders solutions for the rear subframe? I have to admit that I'm torn between those and the Pfadt, but we have a video of one, and not the other. Obviously - I don't want to have to pay more than I have to, and if the polys hold the subframe like the solids, that's enough for me; I'd like to see about any videos though.

I'm not calling anyone out because I LOVE BOTH of these companies, but I had to ask... I can't be the only one to have, at least, thought about the question.

Respectfully...
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Old 04-22-2010, 05:22 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radz282003 View Post
I hate to likely shoot myself in the foot, but I gotta' ask:

Are there any videos of the Pedders solutions for the rear subframe? I have to admit that I'm torn between those and the Pfadt, but we have a video of one, and not the other. Obviously - I don't want to have to pay more than I have to, and if the polys hold the subframe like the solids, that's enough for me; I'd like to see about any videos though.

I'm not calling anyone out because I LOVE BOTH of these companies, but I had to ask... I can't be the only one to have, at least, thought about the question.

Respectfully...
We upgraded all of our cameras to hd versions. But they are too large to put and mount underneath to show.

But I will do this: get our EP1201HD, and put them in. If you are not satisfied with the control they offer, then return them for a full refund. Just keep the box. Would a 2 weeks be enough time for you to evaluate them? The EP1201HDs are the bushings that Paul Tracy had in the Camaro when he kicked butt at the Optima Challenge.


So not only can you save some money with our HD units, you do not have to remove the subframe to do them. That will save you 3-5 hours of labor.

email me or call me if you need further info.

thanks
mike
dms

Last edited by Info@PeddersUSA.com; 04-22-2010 at 05:32 PM.
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Old 04-22-2010, 05:29 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dms View Post
We upgraded all of our cameras to hd versions. But they are too large to put and mount underneath to show.

But I will do this: get our EP1201HD, and put them in. If you are not satisfied with the control they offer, then return them for a full refund. Just keep the box. Would a 2 weeks be enough time for you to evaluate them? The EP1201HDs are the bushings that Paul Tracy had in the Camaro when he kicked butt at the Optima Challenge.

thanks
mike
dms
Well - I think that answers my question Again - I had to ask out of curiosity. I'd take you up on that sweet offer, but I need a Z28 first Thanks again.
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Old 04-22-2010, 05:39 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by radz282003 View Post
Well - I think that answers my question Again - I had to ask out of curiosity. I'd take you up on that sweet offer, but I need a Z28 first Thanks again.
I take it you are in Sacromento? Drive down to Livermore, and I will assist you in installing them!!. We can take a bunch of pictures, and show this awesome community how we can do it in their driveway!!

mike
dms
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Old 04-22-2010, 08:24 PM   #13
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I take it you are in Sacromento? Drive down to Livermore, and I will assist you in installing them!!. We can take a bunch of pictures, and show this awesome community how we can do it in their driveway!!

mike
dms
If the offer stands when I finally order my ride, I'll take you up on it. Chances are, I'll ask to visit your shop before that anyways, lol
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Old 04-22-2010, 09:42 PM   #14
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Radz i am in the exact same position as you. I am getting an edelbrock supercharger and i figure as soon as i get it installed, i am going to see some downfalls of the stock bushings and suspension. I do not plan on taking my car to a track (might still do it though), or do serious racing, but when i punch the gas i want to make sure its solid, no wheel hop, and nothing that will cause the car to want to go out of control.

Im down to the pedders EP1201 and the pfadt one. I would like to fix any problems caused by the stock bushings but keep NVH as stock as possible. I love the look and machining done on the Pfadt one, but i just cant see how a solid mount will not increase noise dramatically.

Also im worried about going to a hard urethane or solid bushing because at some point the bushing is going to move, and since the bushing will be made of a hard material wont that potentially wear the subframe? The factory bushings are soft so during any movement the bushing will give before the subframe.

Please correct me if im wrong, but in my eyes if i put a hard material (steel, aluminum, urethane, etc) and the subframe moves and twists and things rub together (probably likely) its not going to start to wear the subframe?
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Old 04-22-2010, 09:57 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oachalon View Post
Radz i am in the exact same position as you. I am getting an edelbrock supercharger and i figure as soon as i get it installed, i am going to see some downfalls of the stock bushings and suspension. I do not plan on taking my car to a track (might still do it though), or do serious racing, but when i punch the gas i want to make sure its solid, no wheel hop, and nothing that will cause the car to want to go out of control.

Im down to the pedders EP1201 and the pfadt one. I would like to fix any problems caused by the stock bushings but keep NVH as stock as possible. I love the look and machining done on the Pfadt one, but i just cant see how a solid mount will not increase noise dramatically.

Also im worried about going to a hard urethane or solid bushing because at some point the bushing is going to move, and since the bushing will be made of a hard material wont that potentially wear the subframe? The factory bushings are soft so during any movement the bushing will give before the subframe.

Please correct me if im wrong, but in my eyes if i put a hard material (steel, aluminum, urethane, etc) and the subframe moves and twists and things rub together (probably likely) its not going to start to wear the subframe?
I will be in Ohio on May 22nd. for a killer Pedders Day at:

Back Street Performance
650 W, Smith Road, unit 2
Medina, OH 44256
Rich Johnson
(440) 655-7677
rich@backstreetper.com

We will be offering Pedders Days discount. We should have some of these to show you. You will have 0 wear of the subframe with any of our poly bushings!!

So if you are thinking of the EP1201 bushings, you will save a very serious amount of money compared to the other metal units.

Will you be able to come?

mike
dms

Last edited by Info@PeddersUSA.com; 04-23-2010 at 11:51 AM.
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Old 04-23-2010, 08:38 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oachalon View Post
Radz i am in the exact same position as you. I am getting an edelbrock supercharger and i figure as soon as i get it installed, i am going to see some downfalls of the stock bushings and suspension. I do not plan on taking my car to a track (might still do it though), or do serious racing, but when i punch the gas i want to make sure its solid, no wheel hop, and nothing that will cause the car to want to go out of control.

Im down to the pedders EP1201 and the pfadt one. I would like to fix any problems caused by the stock bushings but keep NVH as stock as possible. I love the look and machining done on the Pfadt one, but i just cant see how a solid mount will not increase noise dramatically.

Also im worried about going to a hard urethane or solid bushing because at some point the bushing is going to move, and since the bushing will be made of a hard material wont that potentially wear the subframe? The factory bushings are soft so during any movement the bushing will give before the subframe.

Please correct me if im wrong, but in my eyes if i put a hard material (steel, aluminum, urethane, etc) and the subframe moves and twists and things rub together (probably likely) its not going to start to wear the subframe?
Well you are in our area , we are in Columbus, and have all Pfadt's product line on hand, and installed on our demo car. Come down, and we can show you the material, drive the car, feel the difference ect. And you can also check out our dyno facility, fabrication area ect. I will make you a very friendly local deal as well.

As for the concern about tolerance in the sub frame after say a hard bushing install like pfadts, there will be no material issues with vibration or wear. The idea is to fix the rear cradle so it wont twist and shake now, which will move the energy to the wheels versus the deflection in the sub frame bushings. You will have no concern with the pfadt bushings stretching or twisting vibrating, they will last in 100% performance longer then your engine .


Hope you can stop down.

Regards
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Old 04-23-2010, 10:23 AM   #17
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I am interested in both of your offers:

Mike, your venue is pretty close to me (about 50 miles) but May 22nd is my brothers wedding.

Brandon, columbus is a little more of a drive (im 25 miles east of cleveland), but i might have to be down there soon for work, so maybe i will stop by.

Also supporting local companies is a big thing for me, be it the retailer or the manufacturer. Plus ohio needs it as much as possible.
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Old 04-23-2010, 11:47 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oachalon View Post
I am interested in both of your offers:

Mike, your venue is pretty close to me (about 50 miles) but May 22nd is my brothers wedding.

Brandon, columbus is a little more of a drive (im 25 miles east of cleveland), but i might have to be down there soon for work, so maybe i will stop by.

Also supporting local companies is a big thing for me, be it the retailer or the manufacturer. Plus ohio needs it as much as possible.
Well, if your wait for about a month you can come by our open house event we are planning for the launch of our new 30,000 sq ft building

Hope we can cross paths soon.
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