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Old 09-29-2006, 03:51 PM   #26
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No offense, but my girlfriend has a 2001 Saturn, not sure what the actual model it is, it doesn't say on any part of the car. But she has a little over 60,000 miles on it and her transmission (and some other things that I'm not sure of) had to have some work because it's shift points were off and it feels so much more dainty than my 1996 Intrepid. My car still feels like a nicer car than hers after 120k and being totaled. I had to have the frame stretched. She also just had her brakes replaced, I believe when I replaced mine over the summer it was the first for them, but I could be mistaken. Older Saturns (aka not in the past few years) really feel like cheap cars. Just my .02
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Old 09-30-2006, 08:21 AM   #27
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Can't see production cars being ready within 12 months. Plant has to be set-up first.
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Old 10-02-2006, 07:32 AM   #28
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yeah they will be ready in the next 12 months. if they already have 1 production model done, that meens they have everything how they want it and the companies that make the sheet metal or plastic already have a mold.the longest part of getting a car going has already been done...... and thats the concept stage. now its "a piece of cake" for GM to getthe rest of this going. in no time theyll be making thousands of those cars a week and they will be out on the street. so TEAM CHEVY it is possible,
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Old 10-05-2006, 07:48 AM   #29
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I agree that molds for plastics and dies for sheet metal may have been used to create the first production model, but the actual plant has to be set-up to accommodate the new build and it's not ready for that stage yet. So yes, BlacLac02 it is "possible" but not very "likely" to happen within 12 months.
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Old 10-05-2006, 09:59 AM   #30
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yeah it is. if they are saying that they plan on having it out in the next year what does that tell you. obviously they are on top of their game and know exactly what they are doing. i wouldnt put anything past them.anything is possible especially with the right amount of drive and anxious customers...... it will be ready in time
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Old 10-05-2006, 12:06 PM   #31
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Ok guys...no one from GM ever officially announced it will be coming out within a year. Let's just sit back and see what happens after SEMA. If nothing is released at SEMA, I will be very suprised...and will be expecting something by the end of the year.
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Old 10-05-2006, 01:51 PM   #32
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tag did you not se the article on the home page...... "the show claims that Terry Woychowski said that GM was in a “rush to get it [Camaro] out the door,” and “don’t be surprised if it’s by this time next year.”
they never said directly that "yes its coming out on october 2nd 2007" but you have to read into it more than what you see. how people from gm answer question are how you need to see it. he "hints" to you but no he will never say until the day before. because hes not allowed to but no one said he can hint toward something.
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Old 10-05-2006, 04:32 PM   #33
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I actually also hope GM keeps thier word about it coming out around 08 because thats around the time I'll be able to afford it.
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Old 10-05-2006, 11:03 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by BlacLac02 View Post
tag did you not se the article on the home page...... "the show claims that Terry Woychowski said that GM was in a “rush to get it [Camaro] out the door,” and “don’t be surprised if it’s by this time next year.”
they never said directly that "yes its coming out on october 2nd 2007" but you have to read into it more than what you see. how people from gm answer question are how you need to see it. he "hints" to you but no he will never say until the day before. because hes not allowed to but no one said he can hint toward something.
Of course I read it. I know people can hint at things and I'm right there w/ you hoping it will come out in 07. I wish more GM emp's would hint more about everything...engines, dates, etc. After all, I've been saying 40th Anniversary Edition like 4 or 5 times. But that's still not a confirmed GM announcement. It's just "hinting".
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Old 10-06-2006, 06:41 AM   #35
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because they probably arent supposed to say it yet that its goign to be early for sure. they are waiting forthat right time to say it will be out early.
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Old 10-15-2006, 12:05 AM   #36
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Won't be coming out in 07 according to my sources. GM had a contract w/ St.Therese plant lasting throughout the 08 year. GM, in other words, can not make a 2007/8 Camaro unless it is built at the St.Therese plant. This plant no longer exists. Therefore, the next Camaro will be an 09 model. It can't be released until 08. But, no one ever said anything about them not being able to bring it out in early 08. So, no. It won't be coming out in a year.
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Old 10-16-2006, 09:11 AM   #37
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Won't be coming out in 07 according to my sources. GM had a contract w/ St.Therese plant lasting throughout the 08 year. GM, in other words, can not make a 2007/8 Camaro unless it is built at the St.Therese plant. This plant no longer exists. Therefore, the next Camaro will be an 09 model. It can't be released until 08. But, no one ever said anything about them not being able to bring it out in early 08. So, no. It won't be coming out in a year.
To be honest, I never have suspected that it would come out any sooner than 2008. I did have a gleamer of hope, but realistically the liklihood of it hitting dealerships in 2007 is pretty slim. If it were going to be out in 2007, the camaro enthusiest community would have already heard leaked news from the suppliers and word that contracts have already been finalized.

That is ok though.... gives us time to set aside a fatter downpayment.
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Old 10-16-2006, 03:11 PM   #38
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After my last post and a few hours of browsing the various automotive magazine websites, I was wondering; assuming a mid to late 2008 release of the Camaro, how soon before then can we expect to start hearing some actual news about the Camaro's options and trim lines? Think it will all be held under wraps until the production model debuts at the NAIAS Jan 2008?
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Old 10-18-2006, 05:45 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by BlacLac02 View Post
yeah they will be ready in the next 12 months. if they already have 1 production model done, that meens they have everything how they want it and the companies that make the sheet metal or plastic already have a mold.the longest part of getting a car going has already been done...... and thats the concept stage. now its "a piece of cake" for GM to getthe rest of this going. in no time theyll be making thousands of those cars a week and they will be out on the street. so TEAM CHEVY it is possible,
Just my 2 cents but being that I work in an OEM factory we have showed production models without having finished molds or hard tooling more than one time. I have a hard time believing tooling is done or started. Most tooling will take six to 12 weeks. If you believe the tooling is done you would have to believe that they sent finalized drawings to vendors 12 weeks ago. I doubt it.
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Old 10-18-2006, 08:22 PM   #40
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Well...looks like no info for a while. In other words, I have found that GM will most likely NOT be releasing any information at the SEMA show:( . I could be wrong (and hope to be) but ... looks like a "no go". We will surely start to hear rumors and leaks when things start to come together. It'll just take time.
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Old 10-19-2006, 04:53 AM   #41
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i just got my passses to the sema show cant wait.
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Old 10-19-2006, 09:13 AM   #42
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Just my 2 cents but being that I work in an OEM factory we have showed production models without having finished molds or hard tooling more than one time. I have a hard time believing tooling is done or started. Most tooling will take six to 12 weeks. If you believe the tooling is done you would have to believe that they sent finalized drawings to vendors 12 weeks ago. I doubt it.
While I still am not optimistic for an early arrival, I don't see how this is at all unlikely. I would not be surprised if GM had a team working on the production version Camaro when it was unveiled almost a year ago. I am sure GM anticipated the response that they received. I find it hard to believe that GM just started this project around the time that they announced they would build the Camaro.

I also would like to think that GM does not want to be the last man standing in the muscle car wars. The challenger will be out in '08 I believe and obviously the Mustang is going nowhere. IMO the earlier the better for GM.

Like I said, I am in no way expecting or even optimistic about an early arrival (Hopeful - yes), I just don't think it is at all impossible for them to be at this stage.

Also, I was browsing around for future car models today and you already see spy photos/videos of other 2009 model cars... My question: how long on average does it take to test a car before its release? If some of these makers are already testing their 09 models that suggests one of two things. The Camaro is nearing the production stages or the Camaro is not going to be tested nearly as rigorously as other models... which is it?
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Old 10-19-2006, 10:21 AM   #43
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I am hoping that the Camaro will be available in 08 but I want it done right.Do you all agree?
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Old 10-19-2006, 10:30 AM   #44
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While I still am not optimistic for an early arrival, I don't see how this is at all unlikely. I would not be surprised if GM had a team working on the production version Camaro when it was unveiled almost a year ago. I am sure GM anticipated the response that they received. I find it hard to believe that GM just started this project around the time that they announced they would build the Camaro.

I also would like to think that GM does not want to be the last man standing in the muscle car wars. The challenger will be out in '08 I believe and obviously the Mustang is going nowhere. IMO the earlier the better for GM.

Like I said, I am in no way expecting or even optimistic about an early arrival (Hopeful - yes), I just don't think it is at all impossible for them to be at this stage.

Also, I was browsing around for future car models today and you already see spy photos/videos of other 2009 model cars... My question: how long on average does it take to test a car before its release? If some of these makers are already testing their 09 models that suggests one of two things. The Camaro is nearing the production stages or the Camaro is not going to be tested nearly as rigorously as other models... which is it?
Prototype camoflaged cars are on the road anything from 18 months to 3 year before production.....so I wouldn't read too much into it. Besides, the car will utilise the Zeta platform and a massive amount of the hardware the Camaro will use will already have been tested during the development of the Holden Commodore. That said, I reckon you can expect to see spy shots of cammo'd Camaros some time next year.

So, if there's no announcement at SEMA, I guess the next time we can hope for anything firm will be Detroit in January. Oh, to have the production car there!
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Old 10-19-2006, 10:30 AM   #45
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I agree completely. That is why I was wondering about the testing stage. If other vehicles are already being tested but will not be available until 09 and there is speculation as to whether or not the Camaro even has the molds done yet then there is a major disconnect. If the molds are not even done for the new camaro then that would mean that a production version is still months away, correct?

How can other makers already be testing their 09 models and chevy not even have a production version ready? Does this mean that the Camaro will not be tested as rigorously or does it mean that the other makers are allowing more time to make adjustments?
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Old 10-19-2006, 10:40 AM   #46
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just because they are testing doesn't mean they aren't going to make changes. why machine and mold when things might change? that's a waste of money. . .if you keep having to change the mold everytime you make a minor change that isn't good. you might see a pre-production 09 car being tested but I don't think the 09 cars are fully ready to see a production line like you are making them out to be.
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Old 10-19-2006, 10:42 AM   #47
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idk but I just wish they would get it done and release it to the public.
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Old 10-19-2006, 10:48 AM   #48
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just because they are testing doesn't mean they aren't going to make changes.
Can you elaborate? I think i am missing the point because of the double negative. Are you saying that becasue they are testing in no way means it is a done deal and ready for production?



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why machine and mold when things might change? that's a waste of money. . .if you keep having to change the mold everytime you make a minor change that isn't good.
To clarify my question earlier, I was not refering to the molds that would change (When we are talking about molds I am assuming we are talking about the actual body and how it fits together). I was referring more to the other nuances like the actual mechanics of the car, the software, the handling, etc, etc...
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Old 10-19-2006, 12:05 PM   #49
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I was also refering to how something fits together. even in testing they find things wrong. So why would they make a mold until the testing is done? I remember watching a thing on the Discovery channel about one of BMW's new cars and they didn't make any molds for it until after they were 100% sure that is how it was going to be. and that was after they had done a lot of driving in the preproduction versions. (ie the 09 cars we see testing right now). that's what I was trying to get at. I'm tired and not totally here sorry if I'm not clear.
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Old 10-19-2006, 01:23 PM   #50
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I remember watching a thing on the Discovery channel about one of BMW's new cars and they didn't make any molds for it until after they were 100% sure that is how it was going to be.(ie the 09 cars we see testing right now).
And actually the cars I saw the most of in terms of spy shots were the BMWs.

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I was also refering to how something fits together. even in testing they find things wrong. So why would they make a mold until the testing is done?
Exactly, so my question was then... if there are other 09 cars in this stage right now, is it probable that they have a production version of the Camaro already laid out and ready for testing? If not, does anyone think that it will compromise the Camaro's quality in the first run year becasue they did not have enough time to test due to time constraints? --I probably was not too clear initially myself---
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