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Old 03-04-2008, 02:17 PM   #1
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Hybrid Camaro?

Just thought I'd post this. Hadn't seen it before. From MT.

GENEVA - General Motors has signed a deal with Hitachi to supply Lithium-Ion batteries for its next-generation mild hybrid technology, due to hit the road in 2010. The GM/Hitachi Vehicle Energy deal also will provide battery technology for the Chevrolet Volt plug-in hybrid, which GM says it's continuing to develop apace. The Hitachi deal is the latest volley in what has become a three-way race to get Li-Ion batteries -- used mainly to power laptop computers -- under the hoods of clean, high-mileage cars.

Mercedes-Benz has apparently taken the lead in that race. It plans to bring an S400 hybrid using Li-Ion by 2009. That car will launch in Europe before the U.S., and probably won't come Stateside until late in that year.

The third player in this race is, of course, Toyota, which is partnering with Panasonic on battery technology (Mercedes hasn't named a battery partner) and showed a plug-in Li-Ion Prius at the Detroit show in January and again here at Geneva.

GM's showcase for its next-generation mild hybrid was the Saab 9-X Biofuel concept, a major hint at that brand's Volvo C30/Audi A3 competitor, which may be imported to the U.S. The 9-X was shown with a 1.4-liter biopower (gas and E85) turbo four (an engine soon to make its way into the Chevy Cobalt), with an electric motor three times as powerful and a battery less than two-thirds the size of the one used in the current Chevy Malibu hybrid and Saturn Aura Greenline. GM plans to have the new mild hybrid technology on the road starting in the 2010 calendar year (likely 2011 model year). Like other major automakers, GM has a number of high-tech toes in the green car/oil independence pool, and this one takes a number of leading edge, but relatively conventional technologies and combines them for incremental fuel economy gains.

Think of Volkswagen's twincharger technology, which uses supercharging for low-end torque and turbocharging for high-end torque on a small-displacement (1.4-liter) engine, but with Honda's IMA hybrid technology in place of that low-end torque blower. Engineers have moved the hybrid system's control unit from the engine to the hybrid system itself, making it easier to adapt to more engines. Bottom line is this; whether or not you see mild hybrids as worthy to be called hybrids, GM will use them in the coming decade to power a much wider range of cars and trucks, taking an incremental, but substantial leap toward reaching stricter Corporate Average Fuel Economy standards. Look for the new system in everything from the next-generation Saturn Aura to maybe even the Cadillac CTS, Chevrolet Camaro and possibly the Corvette starting in the 2011 model year.
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Old 03-04-2008, 02:33 PM   #2
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BOO!!! Green is bad, M'Kay...
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Old 03-04-2008, 02:45 PM   #3
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BOO!!! Green is bad, M'Kay...
LOL
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Old 03-04-2008, 03:11 PM   #4
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BOO!!! Green is bad, M'Kay...
Not if it saves all the fun cars! Soccer moms and killer SUV drivers don't need huge powerful engines.
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Old 03-04-2008, 03:46 PM   #5
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True 'dat.
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Old 03-04-2008, 08:57 PM   #6
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I wouldn't mind a hybrid Camaro, if it means that I only have to pay a little bit more for the system and it gives a gain of 2 mpg. It might actually pay for itself after a while, unlike a full hybrid system which is a waste of money for cars. Trucks are another story though. Anyhoo, don't take the speculation at the end as anything more than that, speculatoin
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Old 03-04-2008, 11:02 PM   #7
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I'd be up for a mild hybrid Camaro. In fact I think that system should be standard on most GM cars. My only concern is that from what I think I know about how it works, I don't think you can get a manual with it.
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Old 03-04-2008, 11:15 PM   #8
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I'd be up for a mild hybrid Camaro. In fact I think that system should be standard on most GM cars. My only concern is that from what I think I know about how it works, I don't think you can get a manual with it.
Sure you can!

This system is one of my favorites Because I really don't have to think to hard to understand how it works.

It's really only a beefed up Alternator, coupled to a big battery. The engine shuts down on low-speed deceleration (i.e. pulling into a parking space, stoplight, or your driveway), and then starts it right back up again the instant the accelerator is pressed. Now, with Li-ion batteries, this will extend the Hybrid's capability and allow for 5mph speeds on all-electric power, like driving down your driveway, or through a parking lot...It doesn't have anything to do with Manual vs Auto transmission.

Well....except for the starting up part. I hadn't thought of that...though, it wouldn't be much different from any other start from 0 in a manual. You'd press the gas to start 'er up, and lightly ease in with the clutch, right?

Here's a hot-link to GM's writeup of the Aura/Malibu/Vue Hybrid system.
http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en...08_LAT_Car.doc
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Old 03-04-2008, 11:32 PM   #9
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Well....except for the starting up part. I hadn't thought of that...though, it wouldn't be much different from any other start from 0 in a manual. You'd press the gas to start 'er up, and lightly ease in with the clutch, right?

Here's a hot-link to GM's writeup of the Aura/Malibu/Vue Hybrid system.
http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en...08_LAT_Car.doc
Yeah it was the stop/start stuff I was thinking of. It just seems like it might be difficult to start and stop with a manual, but I guess you're right, as long as it turns back on with any gas in or clutch out, you'd be fine.
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Old 03-05-2008, 12:27 AM   #10
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damn i NEED the parking lot idle V8 sound... how am i going to pick up girls with my hot car that sounds like my lego train
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Old 03-05-2008, 10:48 AM   #11
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damn i NEED the parking lot idle V8 sound... how am i going to pick up girls with my hot car that sounds like my lego train
I would have the same problem!
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Old 03-06-2008, 07:54 PM   #12
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damn i NEED the parking lot idle V8 sound... how am i going to pick up girls with my hot car that sounds like my lego train
No problem, just get one of these: http://www.vroombox.com/vroombox/

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Old 03-06-2008, 08:02 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Dragoneye View Post
Sure you can!

This system is one of my favorites Because I really don't have to think to hard to understand how it works.

It's really only a beefed up Alternator, coupled to a big battery. The engine shuts down on low-speed deceleration (i.e. pulling into a parking space, stoplight, or your driveway), and then starts it right back up again the instant the accelerator is pressed. Now, with Li-ion batteries, this will extend the Hybrid's capability and allow for 5mph speeds on all-electric power, like driving down your driveway, or through a parking lot...It doesn't have anything to do with Manual vs Auto transmission.

Well....except for the starting up part. I hadn't thought of that...though, it wouldn't be much different from any other start from 0 in a manual. You'd press the gas to start 'er up, and lightly ease in with the clutch, right?

Here's a hot-link to GM's writeup of the Aura/Malibu/Vue Hybrid system.
http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en...08_LAT_Car.doc
Don't they have a electric system that stays on as long as your under a certain speed??
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Old 03-06-2008, 08:23 PM   #14
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What do you mean?
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Old 03-07-2008, 11:11 AM   #15
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?Perhaps they are asking if the vehicle is propelled with the electric motors under like, say, 50 MPH, instead of running on the gasoline/E85 engine?

I believe the current hybrids alternate electric power/fuel power depending on the load the PCM detects the driver wants. What I mean is, the car will have the electric motors as the default to move the car, and the fuel engine as a supplement when additonal electricty is needed. That's what I noticed in a Prius that I test drove some time ago. The display indicated the electrical enery was constantly propelling the vehicle and only supplemented by the fuel engine when the electrical supply was deminished.
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Old 03-07-2008, 06:45 PM   #16
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What do you mean?
It's something like this (Post below) But I dont think it's 50 I think it's 35MPH and under, and yes the electricity takes over at that speed and runs the car to save gas ......... Im not sure on it though but I have heard of cars using this method. Also, I heard when you tap the brakes it recharges itself for the next go round so it's kind of like a motor/generator? I think

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?Perhaps they are asking if the vehicle is propelled with the electric motors under like, say, 50 MPH, instead of running on the gasoline/E85 engine?

I believe the current hybrids alternate electric power/fuel power depending on the load the PCM detects the driver wants. What I mean is, the car will have the electric motors as the default to move the car, and the fuel engine as a supplement when additonal electricty is needed. That's what I noticed in a Prius that I test drove some time ago. The display indicated the electrical enery was constantly propelling the vehicle and only supplemented by the fuel engine when the electrical supply was deminished.
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Old 03-07-2008, 07:39 PM   #17
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didnt even have to read the post and NO HYBRID CAMARO!! its a muscle car not a prius!
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Old 03-07-2008, 07:47 PM   #18
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Oh, I see what you're talking about now.

Yes. And no.
There are different 'strengths' of Hybrid, per se. The Malibu, Aura, and (currently) the Vue are MILD hybrids. The Tahoe, Yukon, and Silverado are FULL hybrids.

The difference is actually very large between the two types.
As I said above, the mild-hybrid system uses a generator/motor (in the place of an alternator) coupled to a 30V NIMH battery. This system shuts down the car when you stop at a light, or your driveway, ect. And the battery runs your accessories. Then when you get going, the motor starts teh engine back up. It also uses regenerative braking to charge the battery via the motor/generator. On top of all that - the system can compliment the engine and actually ADD power during accel (which helps reduce gas consumption as well. The new Lithium system will allow for very low speed propulsion as well, now.

The Full system, also known as the Two-mode Hybrid, was developed together by BMW, Diamler, and GM. But it was GM's idea.

It uses twin electric motors actually IN the transmission to propel the vehicle on electric only power at speeds under 30mph. And it compliments the engine otherwise. Hence the "two mode". It's really difficult to explain, (I haven't read into it much.) I just know it's expensive, and it kicks Prius a$$! http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en...Hybrid_M99.doc
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Old 03-07-2008, 09:26 PM   #19
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According to this interview with Cheryl Pilcher, they are not planning on making a Hybrid Camaro.

http://www.camarohomepage.com/pilcher/index.htm

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Old 03-07-2008, 10:14 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptianSam View Post
damn i NEED the parking lot idle V8 sound... how am i going to pick up girls with my hot car that sounds like my lego train
Well....I guess you could make it sound like a pissed off bumble bee (ex. Ricers....not the bumble bee camaro). lol
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Old 03-08-2008, 01:38 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragoneye View Post
Oh, I see what you're talking about now.

Yes. And no.
There are different 'strengths' of Hybrid, per se. The Malibu, Aura, and (currently) the Vue are MILD hybrids. The Tahoe, Yukon, and Silverado are FULL hybrids.

The difference is actually very large between the two types.
As I said above, the mild-hybrid system uses a generator/motor (in the place of an alternator) coupled to a 30V NIMH battery. This system shuts down the car when you stop at a light, or your driveway, ect. And the battery runs your accessories. Then when you get going, the motor starts teh engine back up. It also uses regenerative braking to charge the battery via the motor/generator. On top of all that - the system can compliment the engine and actually ADD power during accel (which helps reduce gas consumption as well. The new Lithium system will allow for very low speed propulsion as well, now.

The Full system, also known as the Two-mode Hybrid, was developed together by BMW, Diamler, and GM. But it was GM's idea.

It uses twin electric motors actually IN the transmission to propel the vehicle on electric only power at speeds under 30mph. And it compliments the engine otherwise. Hence the "two mode". It's really difficult to explain, (I haven't read into it much.) I just know it's expensive, and it kicks Prius a$$! http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en...Hybrid_M99.doc
On top of the two mode, there is the technology that is behind the Volt. As far as I know, there are no cars that operate like it. It is always driven electrically, but if the battery gets drained, the gas engine kicks in to recharge the battery. But there is no connection between the engine and the wheels, other than power cables running from the generator to the battery to the electric motors.
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