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Camaro V8 LS3 / L99 Engine, Exhaust, and Bolt-Ons Bolt-Ons | Intakes | Exhaust

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Old 12-12-2012, 03:55 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IndeedSS1 View Post
Not if you have a temp probe directly in front of the throttle body (or in the intake manifold) and check. But hey there are those that don't believe people should actually try stuff for themselves, think out of the box, or even suggest it out loud.
And who's put a probe there to check the IAT's from all the different CAI's? Since the PCM adjusts fuel/timing based off the IAT's from the MAF, that's the big one. Seeing how fast the air is moving in the intake, I don't see how you could get a appreciable change in temps in the ~1.5ft of tubing from the MAF to the TB.
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Old 12-13-2012, 05:20 PM   #27
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I decided to do some testing today

I mounted my LS3 head/intake/tb to the flow bench and tested the stock airbox w/ stock filter, and stock tube, then I swapped the tube out for a tube similar to that which you would find in most intake systems (4" OD 16GA aluminum tube, ~16" long, 6" CLR)... Much to my surprise the stock intake tube with it's baffles & accordion section flowed more than the tube without that stuff...

The stock tube flowed ~0.75% more (~2 CFM) than the aluminum tube did. While I didn't compare the stock tube to a Blackwing because I don't have one, I imagine the results would be similar (little to no change).

After doing this and seeing the results, IMO the tube is a waste of money, all you'd get is more intake sound due to the lack of the baffle box.

The filter: I did compare the stock filter vs an S&B filter @ .500" lift on cyl#3 through the top end assy.

The S&B filter flowed roughly 1% better through the intake system/tb/intake/head @ .500" lift... (appx 3 CFM more)...

Quote:
Originally Posted by axis View Post
And who's put a probe there to check the IAT's from all the different CAI's? I don't see how you could get a appreciable change in temps in the ~1.5ft of tubing from the MAF to the TB.
I have... And you'd be surprised at the results.
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Old 12-13-2012, 05:26 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by RacnJsn95 View Post
I have... And you'd be surprised at the results.
Post em up. The more data we have the better.
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Old 12-13-2012, 07:01 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RacnJsn95 View Post
I decided to do some testing today

I mounted my LS3 head/intake/tb to the flow bench and tested the stock airbox w/ stock filter, and stock tube, then I swapped the tube out for a tube similar to that which you would find in most intake systems (4" OD 16GA aluminum tube, ~16" long, 6" CLR)... Much to my surprise the stock intake tube with it's baffles & accordion section flowed more than the tube without that stuff...

The stock tube flowed ~0.75% more (~2 CFM) than the aluminum tube did. While I didn't compare the stock tube to a Blackwing because I don't have one, I imagine the results would be similar (little to no change).

After doing this and seeing the results, IMO the tube is a waste of money, all you'd get is more intake sound due to the lack of the baffle box.

The filter: I did compare the stock filter vs an S&B filter @ .500" lift on cyl#3 through the top end assy.

The S&B filter flowed roughly 1% better through the intake system/tb/intake/head @ .500" lift... (appx 3 CFM more)...



I have... And you'd be surprised at the results.

Wow... thats pretty intresting, so it appears that an intake for the camaro comes down to two things... filter and temp of the air. I'm thinking a blackwing, green filter, and a ceramic coating on the tube/box would be pretty ideal for "most" people trying to gain 10 to 15hp.
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Old 12-13-2012, 07:27 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RacnJsn95 View Post
I decided to do some testing today

I mounted my LS3 head/intake/tb to the flow bench and tested the stock airbox w/ stock filter, and stock tube, then I swapped the tube out for a tube similar to that which you would find in most intake systems (4" OD 16GA aluminum tube, ~16" long, 6" CLR)... Much to my surprise the stock intake tube with it's baffles & accordion section flowed more than the tube without that stuff...

The stock tube flowed ~0.75% more (~2 CFM) than the aluminum tube did. While I didn't compare the stock tube to a Blackwing because I don't have one, I imagine the results would be similar (little to no change).

After doing this and seeing the results, IMO the tube is a waste of money, all you'd get is more intake sound due to the lack of the baffle box.

The filter: I did compare the stock filter vs an S&B filter @ .500" lift on cyl#3 through the top end assy.

The S&B filter flowed roughly 1% better through the intake system/tb/intake/head @ .500" lift... (appx 3 CFM more)...



I have... And you'd be surprised at the results.
Very interesting test. Now how does that compare to Janetty's dyno testing with all the different cold air intake systems?
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Old 12-13-2012, 07:47 PM   #31
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So for the Blackwing system, are y'all talking about this http://www.pfyc.com/pc/CA5061/CASRCH...FQ2znQodqWgAbw for a 2013 SS?

And this filter? http://www.carid.com/2013-chevy-cama...s-4131509.html
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Old 12-13-2012, 07:52 PM   #32
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The Blackwing appears to just replace the funky looking stock intake tube. They get a nice price for a simple plastic elbow... ($180)
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:10 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PalmerGA View Post
So for the Blackwing system, are y'all talking about this http://www.pfyc.com/pc/CA5061/CASRCH...FQ2znQodqWgAbw for a 2013 SS?

And this filter? http://www.carid.com/2013-chevy-cama...s-4131509.html
Yeah that's the two items. Best flowing filter and the blackwing tube can't hurt. Just wish SLP had an option to just get the tube and not their dry filter... It's better than the stock one but not by much.
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:12 PM   #34
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The Blackwing appears to just replace the funky looking stock intake tube. They get a nice price for a simple plastic elbow... ($180)
You can find them for 130 to 150 on amazon.
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:22 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruuzin LV View Post
Wow... thats pretty intresting, so it appears that an intake for the camaro comes down to two things... filter and temp of the air. I'm thinking a blackwing, green filter, and a ceramic coating on the tube/box would be pretty ideal for "most" people trying to gain 10 to 15hp.
Very doubtful you will pick up 10-15 hp from that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1989GTA View Post
Very interesting test. Now how does that compare to Janetty's dyno testing with all the different cold air intake systems?
Hard to say. Ted says he saw no gain from going from a stock filter to a k&n.

I'd say the tube is mostly about looks after today, at least in regards to keeping the stock airbox.
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Old 12-13-2012, 09:29 PM   #36
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One main reason I picked my CAI,Inc was the lower IAT's.

Bill
I will say this, its hard to argue with a 0 tempature rise. Has anyone tested the Vararam for this. The worst thing about my Fastlane is that it heat soaks something fierce and pulls all kinds of timing while stageing or sitting at a red light. The amout of power it pulls from heat soak probably negates any gains the intake gives and then some. It does perform really well from a roll and before it gets hot though.
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Old 12-13-2012, 10:54 PM   #37
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Whole heartedly disagree. The stock system is ok for what it is, but there are several places that can and have been improved upon. The silencers and accordian section are killer for laminar flow. Add in that it gets air from one source and you have a somewhat restrictive system. I don't see your meaning about moving the MAF to get lower IAT's. ADM is the only one that moved theirs to the box but the rest of them are pretty much in the same place in relation to the filter. They get lower IAT's because they get more fresh air from several places instead of just one. The stock one gets ALL it's air right off the radiator. If the OEM system was as good as the aftermarket ones, someone would have shown a nice increase from just adding a aftermarket replacement filter. To date, no one has. There was one article from HPTV, I think, that showed it gained several HP but that same article showed the K&N typhoon making 25whp 20+tq with no tune.
Didn't someone post a test of all the aftermarket filters and the difference in CFM?

Dammit... I always forget to read the 2nd page. RacnJsn95 is who I was thinking of :/
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Old 12-13-2012, 11:05 PM   #38
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Didn't someone post a test of all the aftermarket filters and the difference in CFM?

Dammit... I always forget to read the 2nd page. RacnJsn95 is who I was thinking of :/
Yes, I did test them in the stock intake itself, however, when tested in the stock intake through the stock tb/intake manifold/head, there isn't as much of a difference as I had reported, although things still seem to flow from least to most in the order that I had reported.

Although I don't have all of the filters any more to repeat the complete test, from stock to the #2 best in my test without testing through the tb/intake manifold/head I show a 3 CFM difference... So from stock to the best, probably a 3.5-4 CFM difference.

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Old 12-14-2012, 03:10 AM   #39
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Didn't someone post a test of all the aftermarket filters and the difference in CFM?

Dammit... I always forget to read the 2nd page. RacnJsn95 is who I was thinking of :/
As Jason posted below yours, testing airflow of a filter through the intake with a flowbench is vastly different than testing it on a car. There are some similarities but to get the true picture, you have to put the engine into the equation.
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Old 12-14-2012, 07:35 AM   #40
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And who's put a probe there to check the IAT's from all the different CAI's? Since the PCM adjusts fuel/timing based off the IAT's from the MAF, that's the big one. Seeing how fast the air is moving in the intake, I don't see how you could get a appreciable change in temps in the ~1.5ft of tubing from the MAF to the TB.
There is a big difference on the street that a novice could tell. Remember back in the day when I offered to drive 6 hours to let you try out the Vararam? And you don't even have one of my least favorite street tested intakes.

And the IAT test was done, but the information wasn't left out for people to see. It's not hard to do since there are breakouts for the IAT sensor. For some reason people like to put those in the box itself to trick the computer versus accurately tuning or getting a better performing intake.

Hmmm, if I had any plans for more modding, I know what the VR spacer might be good for. Temp probe access.

I may be testing one more item but after that I'm done. No point spending money to research a particular product catagory, when in the end no one really cares how it compares. Most are going to get whatever and assume they got best for their application. As long as they have nothing to compare it to, then it is the best in their own mind. Ignorance is bliss (not meaning that in a bad way). Had I kept the first CAI I bought and never had the urge for something better, I'd be money ahead and content with the lack luster results, and assuming that all intakes were like that.

Not in may nature be like that though. It may be a curse.
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Old 12-14-2012, 09:19 PM   #41
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Actaully my questions have been pretty much answered. Via this thread and other searchs. A good intake has good flow and low IAT's and since Vararam seems to back up their claims according to quite a few people I'm going to pull the trigger and select what makes sense to me cost/performance wise. Which is a ceramic coated blackwing tube/ intake box and a green filter.
Nice!
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Old 12-15-2012, 07:38 PM   #42
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Don't be confused by manufacturer "claims" (marketing). Focus on real world results.
That's a pretty key statement.

You only have to make one car hit one number on one dyno, and BAM you can claim xx+ hp gains lol

Outside that, I like how the theory of the vararam intake works. Im not a fan of their spacer though.
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Old 12-15-2012, 08:25 PM   #43
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That's a pretty key statement.

You only have to make one car hit one number on one dyno, and BAM you can claim xx+ hp gains lol

Outside that, I like how the theory of the vararam intake works. Im not a fan of their spacer though.
And there are numerous "methods" to help you make those one time wonders.
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Old 12-16-2012, 09:12 AM   #44
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You guys act like vararam is the only company that markets hp gains like that. Lol, your dissing your own products while at it because they all do it from cam swaps, spiral tbs, headers, other intake companies.
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Old 12-16-2012, 12:36 PM   #45
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I think that is their point. Marketing departments often live in a different world. Don't listen to them, listen to real world data... Like the kind you find lots of in threads like these.
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Old 12-16-2012, 12:38 PM   #46
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When you think about it, 80% of the people buying their stuff probably wouldn't understand the catch anyways...
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Old 12-16-2012, 12:48 PM   #47
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You guys act like vararam is the only company that markets hp gains like that. Lol, your dissing your own products while at it because they all do it from cam swaps, spiral tbs, headers, other intake companies.
Did you happen to notice what the title of this thread is?

You are correct that many companies do it. There are a few that don't. If you were to go back and read many of my posts in the different threads, you'd notice that I ALWAYS say "ignore the manufacturers claims".
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