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Old 12-28-2012, 03:24 PM   #51
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so the ZL1 only got beat by the LFA and 458?? damn
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Old 12-28-2012, 03:39 PM   #52
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Hell ya
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Old 12-28-2012, 03:44 PM   #53
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But it's to fat to be a good track car....







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Old 12-28-2012, 03:56 PM   #54
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way to go GM
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Old 12-28-2012, 04:06 PM   #55
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the zl1 trumped all the LL3's!
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Old 12-28-2012, 04:21 PM   #56
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Hell yea! This is my favorite article. Gonna have to go pick it up! Nice work GM!
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Old 12-28-2012, 04:26 PM   #57
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Wow, what an achievement for GM! An American car, priced within reach for many people that can hang with or beat supercars in the ZL1? Even better, the 1LE which is sub 40K doing nearly as well?


It is a good time to be a car enthusiast.
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Old 12-28-2012, 04:30 PM   #58
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most impressed with the 1LE and the audi rs5
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Old 12-28-2012, 04:35 PM   #59
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Congratulations to GM on the track wins!

I am a diehard Chevy guy. I own a 2010 LS3 Camaro SS. Like most people, I don’t drive my car on a lap track. Ninety nine point nine percent of the battles between Chevys and Fords are fought from traffic light to traffic light or on the drag strip. Unfortunately, stock Ford Mustangs are beating stock Chevy Camaros most of the time. The Mustang GT beats the Camaro SS most of the time with less horsepower but also with less weight. The Mustang GT500 beats the Camaro ZL1 with a much more powerful engine.

I would like to see the Camaro at least 500 pounds lighter. Why does my Camaro weigh more than my full frame cast iron big block Chevelle?

Is GM going to do anything about this? I sometimes wonder if GM has their hands tied because the Camaro would blow away the base line Corvette if they up the power any more on the Camaro.

Like I said earlier, I am a Chevy guy, but I also have to give Ford the respect they are due.
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Old 12-28-2012, 04:50 PM   #60
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Congratulations to GM on the track wins!

I am a diehard Chevy guy. I own a 2010 LS3 Camaro SS. Like most people, I don’t drive my car on a lap track. Ninety nine point nine percent of the battles between Chevys and Fords are fought from traffic light to traffic light or on the drag strip. Unfortunately, stock Ford Mustangs are beating stock Chevy Camaros most of the time. The Mustang GT beats the Camaro SS most of the time with less horsepower but also with less weight. The Mustang GT500 beats the Camaro ZL1 with a much more powerful engine.

I would like to see the Camaro at least 500 pounds lighter. Why does my Camaro weigh more than my full frame cast iron big block Chevelle?

Is GM going to do anything about this? I sometimes wonder if GM has their hands tied because the Camaro would blow away the base line Corvette if they up the power any more on the Camaro.

Like I said earlier, I am a Chevy guy, but I also have to give Ford the respect they are due.
Go play in traffic Ford fanboy. jk
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Old 12-28-2012, 04:53 PM   #61
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If these cars lost 400-500 pounds. unstopable
6th gen. :-)
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Old 12-28-2012, 05:01 PM   #62
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....

I would like to see the Camaro at least 500 pounds lighter. Why does my Camaro weigh more than my full frame cast iron big block Chevelle?

Is GM going to do anything about this? I sometimes wonder if GM has their hands tied because the Camaro would blow away the base line Corvette if they up the power any more on the Camaro.

Like I said earlier, I am a Chevy guy, but I also have to give Ford the respect they are due.
Yes, the Camaro is too heavy...unfortunately the Zeta chasis they used was/is heavy. Its really the only thing that holds this car back from being top dog even with the Mustangs performing as good as they do....I mean look at how well the Camaros are performing even with the additional weight.

As to your question about whether or not GM is going to do anything. I'd say the answer is yes and no. You won't see the 5th gen going on a big weight loss. But I bet we see more tweaks and what not before the 6th gen arrives. (LS7 engine anyone??)

The next generation Camaro...the 6th gen, will be built on a lighter chasis. Most likely the Alpha platform, and based on the Cadillac ATS, which is built on the Alpha platform as well, I think we could see a base Camaro in the 3,300 to 3,400 lb range for sure. A V8 equipped model likely in the 3,500+ lb range. I can't wait!
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Old 12-28-2012, 05:57 PM   #63
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I like how they had the lights and sirens on at all times when they were in the LL "oinks".

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Old 12-28-2012, 06:07 PM   #64
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look at that ZL1 camaro had a faster lap time the the corvette z06 wonder what year
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:13 PM   #65
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I do think that the Ford fans are running out of excuses as to why this happened, really the only thing they have is the fact that the BOSS 302 LS wasn't run this year but last year.

Though this comes down to a difference in philosophy between the two companies, GM really aims for performance cars that excel in all performance areas.
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:25 PM   #66
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I'm more impress with the fact the ZL-1 is 2 secs slower than a 375k base price Lexus LFA 60k > 400k lol lose a few pounds and the ZL1 could shave that margin easily.
The ZL1 is no doubt impressive but I think this is more of a case of the LFA being way overpriced.
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:37 PM   #67
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The ZL1 is no doubt impressive but I think this is more of a case of the LFA being way overpriced.
For sure! SICK looking car but man, for mid 300K's that thing should weight 1,000 nanograms; have like 600million WHP and be hand made by GOD himself.

IF you believe in that mumbo jumbo.
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:42 PM   #68
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The Lexus LFA ran a 2:55.1 nothing to really look down on that is a solid performances. The ZL1 Camaro just performs really well, also its possible that being a customers car they might not have been as hard on it as well.
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:49 PM   #69
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Nice showing for both cars. I usually never look at the SVT forum but had to look. A few comments about the ZL1 beating the GT500 by 3 seconds and they seem to be trying to ignore it. Facts are facts and the camaros ran well. Obviously we all know in the 1/4 mile the GT500 is stronger. All around the camaro shines pretty well.

I cannot wait to get my car to a road track next spring to experiece it like many have.

Chevy Camaro ZL1 - 2.57.5
Ford Shelby GT500 - 3.00.6
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me too!
I love to hear this from ZL1 owners. You guys are in for the best times of your life. Prepare to get addicted, and start saving, cuz it gets expensive

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look at that ZL1 camaro had a faster lap time the the corvette z06 wonder what year
I know, thats what I am most impressed by, we beat a Z06, but what year?
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Old 12-28-2012, 07:03 PM   #70
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ya ever see ALL the mangled 5th gen Camaros... bet those people appreciate the extra 500 lbs
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Old 12-28-2012, 07:45 PM   #71
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Results don't surprise me...

The 1LE was designed RIGHT...to whoop the Boss without the added cost that Ford charged...

And the ZL1 is simply stunning in every way, 'nuff said there.

A couple of you mentioned this already, but I'll re-state: VIR is the closest thing America has to a Nurburgring...very technical, relatively long, and plenty of curves and straights to accommodate a variety of cars. These results (by "regular" drivers, as opposed to a super-star engineers like Aaron Link..) prove that the ZL1 and 1LE Camaros are PHENOMENAL performance bargains compared to any car (as if there was any doubt ).
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Old 12-28-2012, 07:56 PM   #72
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I do think that the Ford fans are running out of excuses as to why this happened, really the only thing they have is the fact that the BOSS 302 LS wasn't run this year but last year.

Though this comes down to a difference in philosophy between the two companies, GM really aims for performance cars that excel in all performance areas.
I don't think it matters that the Boss LS wasn't run this year, it would have just been nice to see what it did on the same day, same track, same drivers. It definitely wouldn't beat the 1LE, since the GT500 barely beat it with 230 more hp.
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Old 12-28-2012, 08:11 PM   #73
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I don't think it matters that the Boss LS wasn't run this year, it would have just been nice to see what it did on the same day, same track, same drivers. It definitely wouldn't beat the 1LE, since the GT500 barely beat it with 230 more hp.
Though running every single performance car ever made on the same day with the same driver just wouldn't be practical. Which is why they have a board showing previous years and the times that the cars run.

You also have to consider that these conditions could have been worse then it was last year when they ran the BOSS 302 LS (or they could have been better). The BOSS 302 LS could have ended up posting a slower lap time then what it did when they ran it.

Though its all just speculation at this point, though from the BOSS 302 vs 1LE Camaro test I have seen showed the 1LE to out lap the BOSS 302 by more then 2 seconds. Honestly the BOSS 302 LS is far too expensive and with things like no back seat really hard to compare against a complete street car like the 1LE is at any rate.
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Old 12-28-2012, 08:12 PM   #74
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First, congrats to GM for a couple of well-engineered Camaro's. Second, the real bang-for-the-buck performer in this test has to be the Focus ST. I mean, it bases for $23,700 and put down a 3.21 time! If you read the article, it might have even managed a sub-3 min time or right at 3.0 if not for an unfortunate key-fob destruction. That's near 1LE performance for $10K less, base price.
I highly doubt that its was going to post a sub 3 minute time, it might have posted a 3:15 lap time or a hair faster then that but sub 3 minutes....

So you think that the Focus ST is faster then the BOSS 302 LS and Shelby GT500 with 662BHP around VIR?..... (want what you are smoking).

The bang for the buck here would be the 1LE Camaro, for $37,000 there is no car that will put down a faster lap time stock that is sold in the US. Not only did every car that has posted a faster lap time then the 1LE Camaro cost more but, on the back end of that you need to drop down by around 25 spots to find a car that is cheaper and slower. Everything on down is more expensive and slower then it........ it beat the Lexus ISF, BMW M3 coupe, even the old Porsche 911 turbo (996 or 997 I am not sure).

Also on the big list, out of the op 10 cars on that list 5 are using small block chevy V-8 engines.......

Last edited by doc7000; 12-28-2012 at 08:35 PM.
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Old 12-28-2012, 08:29 PM   #75
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The bang for the buck here would be the 1LE Camaro, for $37,000 there is no car that will put down a faster lap time stock that is sold in the US. Not only did every car that has posted a faster lap time then the 1LE Camaro cost more but, on the back end of that you need to drop down by around 25 spots to find a car that is cheaper and slower.
x2 could not agree more.
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