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Camaro Z/28 Forum - Z/28 Specific Topics Discussions related to the 5th gen Camaro Z/28 model

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Old 03-28-2013, 05:48 PM   #226
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nope.
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Old 03-28-2013, 05:55 PM   #227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Lung Jimmy View Post
This thread is great.

It is really easy to tell who grew up in the age of entitlement and those who did not. For those of you who did, here's some harsh reality:

Just because you can't afford something does not mean it is overpriced.

Just because something is not the way you would do it does not mean it is wrong.

Big companies do not care about you specifically.

The world did not start when you were born.

Nobody owes you anything and you do not deserve anything other than what you earn.

If you work hard you can be rich and buy anything you want... everybody has that opportunity.

Nobody likes a whiner.



The new Z/28 is awesome... absolutely f'n awesome. It will own any car it is tested against and will lift the status of all Camaros.

You are living in performance car nirvana right now. Enjoy it.
You sir have my deepest respect...thanks for posting this.
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Old 03-28-2013, 06:19 PM   #228
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No, if you read in between the lines from all these posts, the only way the LS7 was going to be able to be put in a 5th gen, is to price it out of the range of an average buyer so that only lets say 2000/yr would be built. GM needs to meet stringent CAFE standards and the LS7 Camaro drops their ratings considerably. What it did do however is allow GM to build a car that put them on top and build it how they wanted to similar to the original concept of the '67 Z/28 and the bean counters wouldn't have to care. There are quite a few LS7's waiting for a home in a warehouse, and they're not making money sitting there.
Yep. that why it was a wish
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Old 03-28-2013, 06:36 PM   #229
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That's not why the price will be high. Are they removing a few things? Yes but it's peanuts in terms of cost savings. The real cost is in the brakes, engine, rear-end, wheels and tires. It costs money to design, build, acquire and test this stuff.

Please stop thinking this is a stripped down car. The car is going to be expensive and rightfully so.
Ok I understand the parts involved cost money. But my point is the very ppl that asked for this are the ones who won't get a chance to get one. Many of these cars will be purely collectors items. Dust collectors if you will, kind of like the COPO. I wanted a stripped down ls7 camaro. But not at the cost of a Vette. Not that I can't afford one, just that it's not the highest priority on my list to dump 60000+ on a car. And yes I understand not many at all actually go to a track. It's expensive to race, I get that. It's cheap to build a race car though no? Maybe not using the highest quality parts but still affordable. Just not factory warrantied. And as for CAFE, I understand the gov stepped in. I don't know the consequences of not following them if car companies united though. It stand the same if ppl united. If they had the government couldn't do much about anything. That's the problem. No unity. I think the car is an amazing build without a doubt, just a disappointment at the price they're going to ask. That's all.
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Old 03-28-2013, 06:54 PM   #230
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Originally Posted by Wizard1183 View Post
Ok I understand the parts involved cost money. But my point is the very ppl that asked for this are the ones who won't get a chance to get one. Many of these cars will be purely collectors items. Dust collectors if you will, kind of like the COPO. I wanted a stripped down ls7 camaro. But not at the cost of a Vette. Not that I can't afford one, just that it's not the highest priority on my list to dump 60000+ on a car. And yes I understand not many at all actually go to a track. It's expensive to race, I get that. It's cheap to build a race car though no? Maybe not using the highest quality parts but still affordable. Just not factory warrantied. And as for CAFE, I understand the gov stepped in. I don't know the consequences of not following them if car companies united though. It stand the same if ppl united. If they had the government couldn't do much about anything. That's the problem. No unity. I think the car is an amazing build without a doubt, just a disappointment at the price they're going to ask. That's all.
To your first point, there are many people who wanted this car, not just those with your beliefs or value system. Who cares what people decide to do with the car once they own it? It's none of my business or yours and it really shouldn't matter. Like others have eluded to, this thread has been great to illuminate the difference in thinking between those of us who grew up before 1985 and those who grew up after then (not saying you are wrong). Even though you are.
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Old 03-28-2013, 06:57 PM   #231
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Not at all. Although, GM could have gone further. Should have announced a R (race/track) & S (sport) version. The S model would be the car GM announced but have optional MyLink. The R model would be a "balls out" version with a/c delete, radio replaced by extra gauges, center console delete, cross bracing in place of rear seat, full-race seats, light-weight door panels with manual windows, light-weight titanium exhaust & true headers. One last thing. If the original was limited to 302 ci for racing, then shouldn't the new one have a super high-revving 302 based off the new LT1 (no crappy DoD of course)?
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:05 PM   #232
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Originally Posted by Iron Lung Jimmy View Post
If you work hard you can be rich and buy anything you want... everybody has that opportunity.
One would be wise not to over generalize. Hard work does not guarantee wealth, and not everyone has the opportunity to become wealthy. In fact, for most in the U.S., except a very small percentage at the very top, economic success has become more difficult to achieve over the last four decades than it was in the quarter century immediately following WWII.

Regardless, the new Z/28 appears as if it will be what many people on this forum have asked for it to be for quite some time. Accordingly, I believe that those fortunate enough to obtain one will be quite satisfied.

The good news is that people got what they asked for, and the bad news is that people got what they asked for. The fact is that high performance today costs a fair amount of money, and, in fact, relatively more so than it did in the 1960's.
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:11 PM   #233
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Originally Posted by G8GTJav View Post
...The R model would be a "balls out" version with a/c delete, radio replaced by extra gauges, center console delete, cross bracing in place of rear seat, full-race seats, light-weight door panels with manual windows, light-weight titanium exhaust & true headers...
Add a roll-cage and you have my PERFECT Z/28...
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:17 PM   #234
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My son has been waiting for them to bring out a Z/28 since he blew up his 98....
He wants one but does not think he will be able to afford it. He is probably going to try to sell his 2011 2SS/RS if he can get on the list to get a Z/28.
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:19 PM   #235
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Originally Posted by Wizard1183 View Post
Ok I understand the parts involved cost money. But my point is the very ppl that asked for this are the ones who won't get a chance to get one. Many of these cars will be purely collectors items. Dust collectors if you will, kind of like the COPO. I wanted a stripped down ls7 camaro. But not at the cost of a Vette. Not that I can't afford one, just that it's not the highest priority on my list to dump 60000+ on a car. And yes I understand not many at all actually go to a track. It's expensive to race, I get that. It's cheap to build a race car though no? Maybe not using the highest quality parts but still affordable. Just not factory warrantied. And as for CAFE, I understand the gov stepped in. I don't know the consequences of not following them if car companies united though. It stand the same if ppl united. If they had the government couldn't do much about anything. That's the problem. No unity. I think the car is an amazing build without a doubt, just a disappointment at the price they're going to ask. That's all.
How do you know that no one asked for this stuff? Obviously there are people out there that want it or GM wouldn't build it. I don't see why that is so hard for you to comprehend.
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:23 PM   #236
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Great car, but not for me.That's why they give you so many packages there something for everyone. So i don't think gm missed the ball they just gave everyone another chioce.
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:28 PM   #237
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To your first point, there are many people who wanted this car, not just those with your beliefs or value system. Who cares what people decide to do with the car once they own it? It's none of my business or yours and it really shouldn't matter. Like others have eluded to, this thread has been great to illuminate the difference in thinking between those of us who grew up before 1985 and those who grew up after then (not saying you are wrong).
edited for obvious reasons lol

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Old 03-28-2013, 07:28 PM   #238
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Originally Posted by GoldenBear View Post
One would be wise not to over generalize. Hard work does not guarantee wealth, and not everyone has the opportunity to become wealthy. In fact, for most in the U.S., except a very small percentage at the very top, economic success has become more difficult to achieve over the last four decades than it was in the quarter century immediately following WWII.

Regardless, the new Z/28 appears as if it will be what many people on this forum have asked for it to be for quite some time. Accordingly, I believe that those fortunate enough to obtain one will be quite satisfied.

The good news is that people got what they asked for, and the bad news is that people got what they asked for. The fact is that high performance today costs a fair amount of money, and, in fact, relatively more so than it did in the 1960's.
Great post!
Six figures is not what it used to be.
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:35 PM   #239
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I hear you..but a 3800 lbs stripped down version, with a huge 7.0 V8 does not a Z28 make.

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They built the Z/28 just as it should be. If you add all the other crap then it's not a true Z/28..

If anything they left to much in it..

You have the ZL1 if you want the comfort and performance..

If you want the badge buy it and slap it on your car, it will be cheaper in the long run and just as fake if GM put in all the luxury crap..
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:41 PM   #240
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I hear you..but a 3800 lbs stripped down version, with a huge 7.0 V8 does not a Z28 make.
Why?
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:47 PM   #241
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Ok it's GM's decision not ours, a Z/28 is what they decide it will be. They took input from enthusiasts and then decided what was the best way to bring this ICON back and this is what they chose to do.. You can accept it or not. Nobody is forcing anyone to buy one.
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:58 PM   #242
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Six figures is not what it used to be.
No kidding. One has to be rich today to live a middle class lifestyle of the 1950s and 1960s. In the San Jose area today a household income of $300,000 per year just barely puts one in the top 5 percent of household incomes in the region.

If one adjusts for inflation, a base 1967 Z/28 retailed for just over $23,000 in 2013 dollars, which is just a bit less expensive than the MSRP of a base 2014 Z/28 is likely to be. Of course, a 2014 Z/28 is a much more sophisticated and superior vehicle than the 1967 Z/28 was.

In 1967 Chevrolet sold 602 Z/28s. It will be interesting to see how many 2014 Z/28s will actually be sold. I guess that it will be more than 602.
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Old 03-28-2013, 07:58 PM   #243
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It would be funny if the nearly 600hp car (ZL1) is a more streetable version than the 500hp car.
The Corvette ZR1 is a more "streetable" car than the Z06. At least in base form. Now you can get MR on the Z06 that makes it essentially a ZR1 with the LS7. But when they were both just introduced? The ZR1 was far more comfortable as far as options, insulation and comfort.
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Old 03-28-2013, 08:04 PM   #244
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Why?
the whole point of the first gen Z28 was to compete in SCCA Trans-Am Challenge Series. The engine requirements to race in SCCA was limited to 305 cubic inches. IMHO a 427 would belong in a different package. And I think a fat 3800 lbs "stripped" version is silly. just me.
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Old 03-28-2013, 08:23 PM   #245
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the whole point of the first gen Z28 was to compete in SCCA Trans-Am Challenge Series. The engine requirements to race in SCCA was limited to 305 cubic inches. IMHO a 427 would belong in a different package.
Since today there is no SCCA Trans-Am series with a 5.0 liter engine displacement limit, why isn't a high revving dry sump small block 427 (LS7) with forged internals a good choice for today's Z/28 package?
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Old 03-28-2013, 08:33 PM   #246
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Since today there is no SCCA Trans-Am series with a 5.0 liter engine displacement limit, why isn't a high revving dry sump small block 427 (LS7) with forged internals a good choice for today's Z/28 package?
Just curious, what road race class would the Z/28 be in these days? Is there even any venue for a buyer to actually race in? and get it wide open?...dunno...just wondering...thanks if anybody knows....
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Old 03-28-2013, 09:02 PM   #247
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No. We asked for this. When they released the 1LE people were upset that you could get a 2SS 1LE with options like a sun roof and AC and navigation. They said if it was suppose to be a track car, then it should have been stripped down. Here comes the Z28 that is stripped down and people are upset that it's stripped down.

You have many choices right now with the lineup. If you want a track car with comforts, then get a 1LE.

If you need more horsepower in your track car and still want your comforts, then get a ZL1.

If you are willing to live without them and want a lighter car with less of that stuff, then get a Z28.

Out of all those and other options like the SS and the V6 models there is something for everyone in the lineup.
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Old 03-28-2013, 09:05 PM   #248
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the whole point of the first gen Z28 was to compete in SCCA Trans-Am Challenge Series. The engine requirements to race in SCCA was limited to 305 cubic inches. IMHO a 427 would belong in a different package. And I think a fat 3800 lbs "stripped" version is silly. just me.
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Since today there is no SCCA Trans-Am series with a 5.0 liter engine displacement limit, why isn't a high revving dry sump small block 427 (LS7) with forged internals a good choice for today's Z/28 package?
Exactly GoldenBear. These are different times calling for an evolution in car design, yet the car can have the same recipe just updated. A Z28 is coupe designed for the track wether it's 1967 or 2014. Name me one racecar that is exactly like its original design? Dragster, Funnycar, Stockcar, FIA GT, Le Mans, Formula?
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Old 03-28-2013, 09:54 PM   #249
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No kidding. One has to be rich today to live a middle class lifestyle of the 1950s and 1960s. In the San Jose area today a household income of $300,000 per year just barely puts one in the top 5 percent of household incomes in the region.

If one adjusts for inflation, a base 1967 Z/28 retailed for just over $23,000 in 2013 dollars, which is just a bit less expensive than the MSRP of a base 2014 Z/28 is likely to be. Of course, a 2014 Z/28 is a much more sophisticated and superior vehicle than the 1967 Z/28 was.

In 1967 Chevrolet sold 602 Z/28s. It will be interesting to see how many 2014 Z/28s will actually be sold. I guess that it will be more than 602.
Bear, I swear to God I just saw this post. Consider a wander over to the HouZe for my version of what you so well-said, here...
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Old 03-28-2013, 09:55 PM   #250
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And I think a fat 3800 lbs "stripped" version is silly. just me.
EXACTLY!
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