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Old 04-05-2013, 02:30 PM   #86
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I don't think I would DD either car, but he probably said that bc the Z06 at least has A/C standard, radio, some creature comforts. Probably meant it would be more pleasant to drive
I'm also talking about what it's going to cost for some of the consumable items that are going to wear faster in a DD use than just for track only. I'm sure some will, but, this isn't going to be like owning a ZL1.

GM built this car for a reason.. and it wasn't getting groceries or going to car shows with lambo doors and leds.
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Old 04-05-2013, 03:05 PM   #87
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People who spend Z/28 - Z06 - GT500 or greater money, and decide to DD it/them, have already taken costs into account. My neighbor DDs his '12 Porsche GT3 RS (short commute), and puts a new set of tires on it every 6 months or so. "Oh well, the cost of doing business..."

BTW, it's never seen a track, either.
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Old 04-05-2013, 03:13 PM   #88
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I would DD it but understand that it's gonna cost me
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Old 04-05-2013, 03:20 PM   #89
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You can find low miles used Z06's for $40,000 - $45,000. And mod the heads for reliability and interior if that bothers you, with the price difference. You can do a lot with $20K- $30K of mod money. Look what I got for around or even less than the price of a Z28. (guessing)

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=235911
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Old 04-05-2013, 03:35 PM   #90
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All anybody has to know is who's in charge of this project... MARK STIELOW. If HE says it will do it, it will do it because he most likely personally drove it at those levels. This guy is a hardcore enthusiast, engineer, driver. I would have nothing but confidence in a car produced by him and his team.
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Old 04-05-2013, 03:46 PM   #91
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All anybody has to know is who's in charge of this project... MARK STIELOW. If HE says it will do it, it will do it because he most likely personally drove it at those levels. This guy is a hardcore enthusiast, engineer, driver. I would have nothing but confidence in a car produced by him and his team.
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Old 04-05-2013, 03:48 PM   #92
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My initial first-hand experience with Stielow was at One Lap '00 when, with Cameron Evans (then-Popular Hotrodding Editor), he ran an early Pro Tour Camaro iteration...with a NASCAR-inspired SBC. His driving has improved immensely.

http://onelapofamerica.com/event/Res...7&res=OVL_CL04
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Old 04-05-2013, 03:51 PM   #93
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http://www.caranddriver.com/features...to-2012-page-8

Around VIR...The ZL1 (2:57) is already faster than the standard Z06 (2:58)...this in the hands of Car and Driver...erm...drivers. It's not quite as fast as a Z06 Z07 Carbon, though (2:53).

However...interestingly, Chevy says the Z/28 is at least three seconds faster around the Milford Road Course than the ZL1. VIR is longer than MRC, so it stands to reason it should be even faster around there...but regardless...we're looking at a time of at least 2:54....right on the bumper of the Carbon-package Z06...which is the fastest car GM produces south of the ZR1 Vette...

Don't doubt the Z/28 because of paper numbers about weight, etc...it's the real deal.
Oh the Z/28 is definitely the real deal, but a not insignificant portion of that real deal is certainly in the tires IMHO. Those Pirelli PZero Trofeo R tires the Z/28 will be sporting will outclass those Goodyear runcraps on the standard Z06 six ways from Sunday...especially if you want to magazine race against Z06 times that incidentally had 1st Gen F1 supercar tires on them.

Similarly, I am willing to wager that a sizeable portion of the Z06/Z07 performance gain is in those awesome Michelin PS Cup Tires. Nothing wrong with that, its just tires play a HUGE role that really can't be underestimated.

As I alluded to, that 2:58 VIR time was on Generation 1 Goodyear F1 Supercar tires in 2007. You should hear Corvette's chief engineer Tadge Juechter's comments on the vast improvement of the Gen 2s (which are on the ZL1 BTW) over the Gen 1s. In fact, according to Juechter, if Goodyear didn't step up the performance capabilities of the Gen 2 F1 supercar tires like they did, Corvette would have gone over to Michellin tires for all corvettes; instead of just to the Michellin PS2 ZPs for the ZR1 and PS Cups for the Z06/Z07.

So I too wouldn't be surprised that the Z/28 beats a now defunct, no longer in production, standard C6Z06 on whatever track du jour, but I think the reasons for that will be pretty straight forward when you get down to it.

I'm just glad they are keeping the LS7 around a little longer, that means parts will be available to me longer if needed. Besides, the C6Z06 is old anyway. The damn thing had a run of 8 model years! You should see how my 2007 C6Z06 stacks up against a 2001 Ferrari 360
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Old 04-05-2013, 03:54 PM   #94
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Oh the Z/28 is definitely the real deal, but a not insignificant portion of that real deal is certainly in the tires IMHO. Those Pirelli PZero Trofeo R tires the Z/28 will be sporting will outclass those Goodyear runcraps on the standard Z06 six ways from Sunday...especially if you want to magazine race against Z06 times that incidentally had 1st Gen F1 supercar tires on them.

Similarly, I am willing to wager that a sizeable portion of the Z06/Z07 performance gain is in those awesome Michelin PS Cup Tires. Nothing wrong with that, its just tires play a HUGE role that really can't be underestimated.

As I alluded to, that 2:58 VIR time was on Generation 1 Goodyear F1 Supercar tires in 2007. You should hear Corvette's chief engineer Tadge Juechter's comments on the vast improvement of the Gen 2s (which are on the ZL1 BTW) over the Gen 1s. In fact, according to Juechter, if Goodyear didn't step up the performance capabilities of the Gen 2 F1 supercar tires like they did, Corvette would have gone over to Michellin tires for all corvettes; instead of just to the Michellin PS2 ZPs for the ZR1 and PS Cups for the Z06/Z07.

So I too wouldn't be surprised that the Z/28 beats a now defunct, no longer in production, standard C6Z06 on whatever track du jour, but I think the reasons for that will be pretty straight forward when you get down to it.

I'm just glad they are keeping the LS7 around a little longer, that means parts will be available to me longer if needed. Besides, the C6Z06 is old anyway. The damn thing had a run of 8 model years! You should see how my 2007 C6Z06 stacks up against a 2001 Ferrari 360
Can't, and not going to argue with anything you've said. I think you're right on!
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Old 04-05-2013, 04:07 PM   #95
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The Carbon Ceramic Brakes alone is like $10-$15k by its self!
Um no, not even close. Every day the number people pull out of their butt adds another $1k over the day before. Rotors can be had for close to 900, calipers 450. People are just incapable of using google and a parts fiche. Maybe if you want to pay MSRP and throw in a few thousand you can hit those numbers.
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Old 04-05-2013, 04:29 PM   #96
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Um no, not even close. Every day the number people pull out of their butt adds another $1k over the day before. Rotors can be had for close to 900, calipers 450. People are just incapable of using google and a parts fiche. Maybe if you want to pay MSRP and throw in a few thousand you can hit those numbers.
What is the MSRP price, new?
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Old 04-05-2013, 04:49 PM   #97
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rotors are 1780 each for the fronts
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:07 PM   #98
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You can also Daily Drive a Z06 Vette... You're not going to want to DD a Z28.
I've had the good fortune to spend a bit of seat time in a Z06. It is a daily driver with a LOT of compromises. The only thing that might make a Z06 a better daily drive would be the radio. Now if you add the MR shocks and some of the options that they now allow that add weight, the Z06 can be pretty pleasant.

But both will be harsh and noisy. JMO
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:34 PM   #99
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Um no, not even close. Every day the number people pull out of their butt adds another $1k over the day before. Rotors can be had for close to 900, calipers 450. People are just incapable of using google and a parts fiche. Maybe if you want to pay MSRP and throw in a few thousand you can hit those numbers.
I think you are way low on this brake estimate. Even the cheapest Wilwood brakes are $999 and they are no where near this exotic. If as reported above the rotors are 1800 each thats $7200 in just rotors... Not to mention 4 six piston calipers. I think $10k is a fiar estimate. I just wish they had that option for my ZL1, I would have found a way to buy it.
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Old 04-05-2013, 08:02 PM   #100
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Um no, not even close. Every day the number people pull out of their butt adds another $1k over the day before. Rotors can be had for close to 900, calipers 450. People are just incapable of using google and a parts fiche. Maybe if you want to pay MSRP and throw in a few thousand you can hit those numbers.
So you think the Z/28 is going to have basically the same braking system the other Camaros do except for a swap to carbon rotors and ordinary 6 piston calipers? I respectfully disagree.

I think this is an entirely custom system designed for and produced for the Z/28 specifically. I know when I'd looked at upgrading to a 6 piston Brembo system on my 2010 SS it was over $7k and that was not carbon. Even with the cost reductions of economy of scale I'm still thinking this system will be close to a $10k upgrade over the stock SS brakes. It's going to be more than just rotors and calipers.
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Old 04-05-2013, 08:44 PM   #101
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I think you are way low on this brake estimate. Even the cheapest Wilwood brakes are $999 and they are no where near this exotic. If as reported above the rotors are 1800 each thats $7200 in just rotors... Not to mention 4 six piston calipers. I think $10k is a fiar estimate. I just wish they had that option for my ZL1, I would have found a way to buy it.
I priced it out last week, I'm not estimating, you can believe it or not. The only question is if its unique part numbers with lower volumes than the corvette that drive up the price. It takes a year or two after the parts come out to find the deals I find but they're still there for people who know how to look.
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Old 04-05-2013, 08:55 PM   #102
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So you think the Z/28 is going to have basically the same braking system the other Camaros do except for a swap to carbon rotors and ordinary 6 piston calipers? I respectfully disagree.

I think this is an entirely custom system designed for and produced for the Z/28 specifically. I know when I'd looked at upgrading to a 6 piston Brembo system on my 2010 SS it was over $7k and that was not carbon. Even with the cost reductions of economy of scale I'm still thinking this system will be close to a $10k upgrade over the stock SS brakes. It's going to be more than just rotors and calipers.
I was looking at carbon rotor/calipers/pads from a corvette, not the ctsv calipers that I have now. I know there will be other upgrades as well like brake ducting but thats not needed to make these work. The questions I've been trying to get answered are if its a unique hub to get the right caliper/rotor offset, unique caliper, and/or unique aluminum hat on the rotor to get the right offset. I would think they'd try to share as many corvette parts as possible to keep prices down but you never know on a car like this. Eventually I will have these brakes and aint no way I'm paying $10k

I got my complete 6 piston conversion for 1425 that people are paying a vendor on here 2400 for and call it a great deal. People are just scared to piece anything together and do their homework to get some part numbers. I'm sure if you buy a kit from a GM dealer you'll pay a price like $10k, doesn't mean I will as thats not how I'm getting the parts.
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