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Old 05-04-2013, 04:35 AM   #26
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I know how there gonna remove 200lbs from the mustang...there gonna remove the fatty drivers lol

2015 Mustang now on sale= Jumbo paper weight
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Old 05-04-2013, 05:41 AM   #27
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200 pounds less than the current Mustang will be around 3400 pounds. Damn.......that's only 100 pounds more than the new C7 Vette.....
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Old 05-04-2013, 10:46 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by oklapike View Post
Which is pretty much what the next Camaro should be given the ATS's weight range of 3315* to 3461. I realize there will be some weight gain due to Chevy using fewer lightweight components in the chassis itself, but that should be offset by fewer heavy sound deadening and other high-end luxury components. I'd be willing to bet the base model alpha Camaro will come in under 3400 and the V6 under 3500.

* 3315 pounds is the curb weight for the ATS 2.5L, the 2.0L turbo curb weight is 3373 (A) and 3403 (M)
Thats if GM uses the ATS version for the Camaro. All indicators I have from sources I trust put the Camaro on the CTS version of Alpha or a hybrid version thats an in betweener so to speak. The weights for this Alpha chassis have only been seen for the premium luxury version, its a little to early speculate where the Camaro version will end up or if GM will allow all the aluminum and titanium bits to trickle down.

I would like to think a 33xx base and 36xx lb V8 Camaro is a real possiblity this time around. I also know that GM is scared as hell to mess with the success of the 5th gen. My hunch, and thats all it is, a hunch, is that youll see a ever so "slightly" lighter car in roughly similar dimensions to the 5th gen. My jaw would be on the floor if they actually built a ATS sized Camaro with ATS like weight like I would want.
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Old 05-04-2013, 08:00 PM   #29
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Well it's only natural that it gets lighter. Especially as they have a goal to reduce weight by at least 15%. Will it be lighter than the Mustang, likely not. But again, the cars are essentially equal now (and as they have been pretty much throughout history).
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Old 05-05-2013, 02:18 PM   #30
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Which mustang and which camaro?

As for as I know only a pre 2012 camaro ss has been tested. There was a suspension revision since then. Also the camaro was always tested against the track pack mustangs with gearing, suspension, and other improvements.

The track pack camaro pulls over 1g's. The ZL1 pulls over 1g's.

The GT500 pulls 0.98g's
I'm comparing a GT to an SS (not the 1LE). Ultimately, in my mind, the SS vs GT, or LT vs V6 Mustang comparisons are more relevant to the average person, since that is what the majority of buyers are looking at. The ZL1 and 1LE vs the GT500 and Boss are indeed interesting discussions, but for most buyers, they are nothing more than discussions, as most buyers aren't buying those.

The "track pack" you are referring to on the Mustang GT is just the Brembo brake package. So equipped, it puts the Mustang GT on the same compound, but slightly smaller PZero tires, and Brembos only on the front. It basically gives the GT nothing the SS does not have. And yet, a GT out-handles an SS by a significant .05g. The GT will run even with an M3 on a race trace...the SS won't. If anything, the GT should be at a handling disadvantage to the SS, since it is SRA vs IRS, but it is not. Why?...3900lbs.

You are right that the 1LE will out-handle the GT, but since that puts you into Boss money, you can't really compare a 1LE to a GT. And the Boss pulls over 1g as well.

I'll agree that the ZL1 is a much better handler than the GT500. GT500 has never been a track car like the ZL1 was specifically designed to be. It's meant to be more of a drag racer. That's why the Boss is faster than a GT500 on a road course. GT500 also has a serious weight problem of its own.

I agree that the ZL1 is a beast that beats every version of the Mustang ever made. They basically took the Boss 302 philosophy of serious chassis upgrades to make it turn like nothing else, except they added about 150 more horsepower on top of it.

Bottom line, the old saying "more power makes you faster on the straights, less weight makes you faster everywhere" will always be true.
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Last edited by fielderLS3; 05-05-2013 at 02:29 PM.
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Old 05-05-2013, 02:38 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by 94turbolsx View Post
Thats if GM uses the ATS version for the Camaro. All indicators I have from sources I trust put the Camaro on the CTS version of Alpha or a hybrid version thats an in betweener so to speak. The weights for this Alpha chassis have only been seen for the premium luxury version, its a little to early speculate where the Camaro version will end up or if GM will allow all the aluminum and titanium bits to trickle down.

I would like to think a 33xx base and 36xx lb V8 Camaro is a real possiblity this time around. I also know that GM is scared as hell to mess with the success of the 5th gen. My hunch, and thats all it is, a hunch, is that youll see a ever so "slightly" lighter car in roughly similar dimensions to the 5th gen. My jaw would be on the floor if they actually built a ATS sized Camaro with ATS like weight like I would want.
I think they'd be better off basing it on the ATS version. GM has to be aware of the criticism of the weight of the Camaro, and I find it hard to believe they would let themselves arrive 250 lbs heavier than the Mustang again.

I've also had a chance to drive an ATS I think its driving characteristics would be perfect for the phony car segment. It feels relatively light on its feet and nimble without feeling small. In it, GM also (finally) has decent steering feel.
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Old 05-05-2013, 09:46 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by oklapike View Post
Which is pretty much what the next Camaro should be given the ATS's weight range of 3315* to 3461. I realize there will be some weight gain due to Chevy using fewer lightweight components in the chassis itself, but that should be offset by fewer heavy sound deadening and other high-end luxury components. I'd be willing to bet the base model alpha Camaro will come in under 3400 and the V6 under 3500.

* 3315 pounds is the curb weight for the ATS 2.5L, the 2.0L turbo curb weight is 3373 (A) and 3403 (M)
I fully agree based on everything I've read. If the Alpha SWB is used, which is what ATS is on, I'd expect a V6 version in the low to mid 3,400 lb range.

On the other hand, the new 2014 CTS is on the Alpha LWB, and it weighs right around 3,650 lbs. I'd think a Camaro on the same chasis with the same V6 (not the turbo V6) could come in at under 3,600 lbs.

That said, I'll be disappointed if the next V6 (if there IS a V6 version) weighs over 3,500 lbs.
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Old 05-06-2013, 01:58 PM   #33
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That thread is so insulting hahaha. I can take guys calling my baby fat (she is), but everyone in that thread called the camaro ugly.

Well I never!
You know, I never understood why anyone calls the Camaro fat. It's slightly heavier then the Mustang, and if the Mustang had an IRS I'm sure they would be very close in weight. Calling the Camaro ugly is just fanboism at it's worst, and pretty ignorant.
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Old 05-06-2013, 03:02 PM   #34
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You know, I never understood why anyone calls the Camaro fat. It's slightly heavier then the Mustang, and if the Mustang had an IRS I'm sure they would be very close in weight. Calling the Camaro ugly is just fanboism at it's worst, and pretty ignorant.
It's the portly appearance. Compared to traditional sports cars, the Camaro looks overweight - like a fat girl in a prom dress. The Camaro really has to be lowered to look good - stock height makes it look like a sporty sedan.

The main problem is that the sidewalls are just too thick, and the ass looks huge. The slit windows adds to this fatty look. I think part of the reason why the ZL1 looks better is because the black rear diffusers and rocker panels makes it look slimmer and therefore sportier. Ever seen a fat swimmer/runner? Slim looks fast.
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Old 05-06-2013, 03:18 PM   #35
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Camaro actually is a pretty damn big car. It's built off a full size sedan platform.
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Old 05-06-2013, 05:40 PM   #36
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So camaro owners=bbw lovers?
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Old 05-06-2013, 08:55 PM   #37
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A Ferrari 458 weighs north of 3400 lbs, I'd be very surprised if the next Mustang in V8 configuration weighs less than 3500 lbs.
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