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Camaro Z/28 Forum - Z/28 Specific Topics Discussions related to the 5th gen Camaro Z/28 model

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Old 06-02-2013, 06:25 AM   #51
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Man...some dicks in the thread
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Old 06-02-2013, 06:47 AM   #52
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how is that nit-picky?


we're talking about the street versions.
the first generation Z/28 was designed to get parts homologated for racing. namely the 302 engine. it was hardly a stripped down barely- legal -for the street car. the Rally Sport package was available, and even vinyl roofs!
the only difference between a Z/28, a Z28 or a Z-28 was the style of the badge.
While it may not have been "stripped down, barely legal for the street", first gen. Z/28s could not be had as a vert or with A/C or auto tranny. As for your vinyl roof comment, Penske ran some full bore race Z/28s in the Trans Am sedan series with a vinyl roof. And the RS option was not much more than foldaway headlights. So your point would be??
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Old 06-02-2013, 07:47 PM   #53
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Question for the z historians, when the badge first changed from z/28 to z28, did GM do it knowingly bc the car was changing or did it just kind of happen?
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Old 06-02-2013, 08:10 PM   #54
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I've followed he Camaro closely for (too ) many years, and I can say I've never heard of this before now???

Anyone else?
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Old 06-02-2013, 10:04 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by shaffe View Post
Question for the z historians, when the badge first changed from z/28 to z28, did GM do it knowingly bc the car was changing or did it just kind of happen?
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Originally Posted by 2cnd chance View Post
I've followed he Camaro closely for (too ) many years, and I can say I've never heard of this before now???

Anyone else?

Good read....

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Let’s take a walk down memory lane, shall we?

The ONLY reason for the original Z/28…

(note I once again used ‘Z/28’ and not ‘Z28)

….. was to go road racing. SCCA Trans Am racing had a rule that no competing car in the series could have an engine displacement larger than 305 cubic inches.

Our Camaro SS-396 was FAST…..but it wasn’t really a ‘track’ car. So the purpose of the Z/28 was to compete in Trans Am Racing – meaning it had to stick to the road like Velcro. Tidbit: None of the 602 1967 model year Camaros with option code Z28 had a nameplate that said Z/28 on them. It really wasn’t meant to be a main-stream entry.

As we moved into the 2nd gen years, the SCCA engine rule went by the wayside…….. And with increasingly stringent fuel and emissions standards, performance was on the wane……at a startling rate. Fast-rising insurance rates certainly didn’t help things…… And by the early 70s, there really wasn’t room for both a Camaro SS and a Z/28 as we knew them. By 1974, performance was so diminished that the Z/28 was dropped at the end of the model year because it had become to many of us a ‘caricature’ of what it once had been. The SS had been taken from the line up at the end of 1972…….

When the Z28 came back in 1977 (note the difference in the name…..there was no “/”….) it was definitely a road hugger – and it DID offer more performance than any other From then on – whether right or wrong, the Z28 was the ‘performance’ Camaro….until the IROC came along. The Z28 was then relegated to ‘2nd fiddle’ and that didn’t set well with Z/28 purists. But – on the other hand, the Camaro was the “International Race Of Champions” chosen brand – and one could go down to their Chevy Dealer and buy a new Camaro – an IROC Camaro – that sure looked a lot like the real race car.

…….And then Chevy pulled out of IROC racing -- and the Z28 was once again the ‘ultimate’ Camaro…that is, unless you ordered one with 1LE.

Fast forward once again to the advent of the 4th gen. We offered a Camaro Sport Coupe with a V6 engine – or a V-8 Camaro Z28 with an LT1 small-block with a ‘blistering’ 275 horsepower.
(to some of you young-uns – that was a LOT of horsepower in 1993….)

Yes – the Z28 was the ‘ultimate’ Camaro back then………and then Ed Hamburger at SLP Engineering came to us and said something along the lines of: “….Chevy -You’ve done a magnificent job with the Z28 – but I’ve got plans to take it to the next level…”

and we said “Sure!” …and the Camaro SS roared back to life. That also put the Z28 as ‘second-in-line’ and again, Camaro Z/28 purists were not happy! I very much remember getting several phone calls, letters, and emails that weren’t –shall we say – ‘charitable’ in their content…..

It all became moot when the Camaro went onto Hiatus in the late summer of 2002……..and I continued to say to you, our Camaro Enthuiasts – to “keep the faith…” - -that GM understood the importance of the Camaro nameplate. Yes, there were a few people within the corporation that proposed moving the name to the J-car platform.

(Blasephemy!)

(….they were last seen being shoved into a fleet of black suburbans – never to be seen again…….)

As John Heinricy said in a meeting that I attended: “The ugliest sight I can imagine would be tire smoke coming from the FRONT tires of a Camaro!..”)

As I’d said before, as Custodians of the Brand, it was crucial that we ensure that the 5th gen Camaro build upon it’s rich 35 year heritage. And yet, as I mentioned earlier in this article, we were questioned at every step of the way. And that’s not a bad thing, I suppose.

We felt so strongly about the heritage of Camaro and ensuring that the new Camaro would “check all the boxes” that were important to Camaro Enthusiasts - that we drafted the 15 members of the Camaro Enthusiast Advisory Board (better known as ‘The 12 Disciples of which there are 15’)

So—after all that: The 5th gen Camaro hit the streets and blew people away…..it’s still #1 in the segment – so I think the team did a pretty good job, don’t you agree?

At the same time, we’d been working on a Camaro that took performance way past our SS. It had been in the product plan for some time – but with the Housing Melt-down of the mid to late 2000s – and the resultant Bankruptcy of GM (and Chrysler and many vendors) the “HP” Camaro was put on ice. That the “HP” car was put back into the program was a miracle in and of itself. Interestingly, it was internally called the “HP” and kept top secret….. but the intended name was to be Z28. Talk about controversy. There were emails, letters, threats, banging-on-desks – and perhaps some thinly veiled threats made……and it was finally decided that the original Z/28 had a naturally aspirated V8 engine. The “HP” Camaro was to have a supercharged engine…….so perhaps the Z/28 moniker wasn’t really appropriate. Our President, Mr. Mark Reuss – himself a Camaro Enthusiast since the time he was able to recognize a Camaro – made the final call…..the “HP” would be christened “ZL1.” What you DON’T know is that he had another plan in mind for the Z/28.
(Note the “/”…..)

Volumes will be written about the 2014 Z/28 – but what’s important to understand is that while we made “Z28” enthusiasts happy over the years with 275hp – and then 285hp – and then an LS1 based Z28………we continually disappointed the “Z/28” purist.

The 2014 is dedicated to the “Z/28” purist. This is a track car that makes no excuses. That this car is a full three seconds faster on a track than the mighty ZL1 speaks volumes to its intent. Make no mistake – this isn’t a slap at the mightly ZL1. Far from it. If you want a car that blows other cars off a road course on Saturday and Sunday – and yet will get you to the office in comfort on Monday morning – the ZL1 is the car for you. If you want blistering track performance at a reasonable cost – the 1LE is prescribed. And – if you want to shame exotics on a road course – with an automobile that’s not meant for daily driving, then the Z/28 makes no apologies and may grab you by the collar – shake you silly -- and shout “LET’S GO MAKE HISTORY!”

So—that’s been a lot of words.

And that’s my take on why we’ve done what we’ve done.

Many already understood before I started typing away.

Some others now have a better understanding.

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Old 06-03-2013, 06:49 AM   #56
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The slash, no slash difference is the most significant feature and the cause for all the controversy....The slashed Z/28s were the first built in '67 to the racing specs needed for Chevy to compete at the track...

...They watered it down in subsequent years with the Z28 cars which was a "rip-off" of the original Z/28s purpose...

...The 2014 Z/28 went to great lengths to guarantee that mistake will never be made again...
Thats the only sentence I disagree with. Reason being IF they make a 6th gen Z/28 or Z28, which is very probable considering they've ALWAYS made one regardless of whether or not it stayed true to a '67, it'll be cheaper than a 2014 for more consumers and it wont perform at or better than a 2014. So producing this Z/28, how are you going to stay true to something that won't nearly be as engineered as this car? No way they build ANOTHER Z/28 road race car in the price range of $70-95k. Therefore, I cant see them staying homage or true to the 1st gen or the 5th gen primarily when the cost will be reduced. Not saying they wouldnt build a track worthy 6th gen, but it wont hold a candle to this one. Otherwise, why pay this price tag when you could sell it and get a cheaper 6th gen that'd outperform it?
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Old 06-03-2013, 09:26 AM   #57
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Thats the only sentence I disagree with. Reason being IF they make a 6th gen Z/28 or Z28, which is very probable considering they've ALWAYS made one regardless of whether or not it stayed true to a '67, it'll be cheaper than a 2014 for more consumers and it wont perform at or better than a 2014. So producing this Z/28, how are you going to stay true to something that won't nearly be as engineered as this car? No way they build ANOTHER Z/28 road race car in the price range of $70-95k. Therefore, I cant see them staying homage or true to the 1st gen or the 5th gen primarily when the cost will be reduced. Not saying they wouldnt build a track worthy 6th gen, but it wont hold a candle to this one. Otherwise, why pay this price tag when you could sell it and get a cheaper 6th gen that'd outperform it?
I'd like to know the answer to that too.
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Old 06-03-2013, 10:33 AM   #58
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We'll see in time if they produce a 6th gen Z/28 or Z28. I see history repeating itself and you'll be buying the badge per se rather than a track monster such as the 2014. Im sure if produced, itll have decent track times considering it'll be a lighter platform, but if its more consumer friendly and they build one that pretty damn good at the track? It'll come with a $54k price tag. But will they even have an "SS" for the 6th gen since they're producing a Chevy SS 4 door? Or going back to the LT/Z28 models?
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Old 06-03-2013, 11:09 AM   #59
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Shnomac I have read that from Fbod and it still doesnt really answer my question. The / disappeared after 1969. The 70 was a Z28 the 69 was a Z/28. Fbod doesnt address the lack of the slash until the Z came back in 77.

Was the badge "evolving" or was it really bc they knew it was not like the previous ones(67-69)
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Old 06-03-2013, 05:57 PM   #60
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I think it's fits the plan.
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Old 06-03-2013, 06:00 PM   #61
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Thats the only sentence I disagree with. Reason being IF they make a 6th gen Z/28 or Z28, which is very probable considering they've ALWAYS made one regardless of whether or not it stayed true to a '67, it'll be cheaper than a 2014 for more consumers and it wont perform at or better than a 2014. So producing this Z/28, how are you going to stay true to something that won't nearly be as engineered as this car? No way they build ANOTHER Z/28 road race car in the price range of $70-95k. Therefore, I cant see them staying homage or true to the 1st gen or the 5th gen primarily when the cost will be reduced. Not saying they wouldnt build a track worthy 6th gen, but it wont hold a candle to this one. Otherwise, why pay this price tag when you could sell it and get a cheaper 6th gen that'd outperform it?
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I'd like to know the answer to that too.
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We'll see in time if they produce a 6th gen Z/28 or Z28. I see history repeating itself and you'll be buying the badge per se rather than a track monster such as the 2014. Im sure if produced, itll have decent track times considering it'll be a lighter platform, but if its more consumer friendly and they build one that pretty damn good at the track? It'll come with a $54k price tag. But will they even have an "SS" for the 6th gen since they're producing a Chevy SS 4 door? Or going back to the LT/Z28 models?
It will all be based on demand.

The 1LE is a perfect candidate for a Z28. But I do like the name 1LE.
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Old 06-03-2013, 06:37 PM   #62
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My guess is we won't see a 6thGen Z/28 right off the bat, that will come later on in that Generation like this one did....Nor will there be a 6thGen Z28...

The standard reasoning will be, again and again, ..."We have great 1LEs and ZL1s for those who don't prefer what the Z/28 has to offer or is all about...".....'just sayin...my $.02
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Old 06-04-2013, 07:02 AM   #63
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The ZL-1 is gone come 6 gen. So you'll have v6, 1LE z/28? I don't think SS will be in the mix
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Old 06-04-2013, 12:07 PM   #64
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The ZL-1 is gone come 6 gen. So you'll have v6, 1LE z/28? I don't think SS will be in the mix
SS will have to be in the mix I would think, other wise they would making the same mistake in gen 6 as they did in the 3rd and 4th.

SS would have to stick around as the "base" v-8 model
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Old 06-04-2013, 01:55 PM   #65
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SS will have to be in the mix I would think, other wise they would making the same mistake in gen 6 as they did in the 3rd and 4th.

SS would have to stick around as the "base" v-8 model
How? Theyre coming out with an SS 4 dr. That leads me to believe theyre not going to produce SS models. Though, I'd imagine they'll have one for a 6th gen. I think they discontinue camaros afterwards.(meaning 6th gen)If they use an LT1 in an "SS" camaro fro 6th gen, will they detune it? If so, it'll be no more HP than the SS of today though it'll be a bit faster considering the weight reduction. But that also means the HP will begin to drop in unless theyre going to turbo it or intall S/Cs in them. Naturally aspirated, I see the HP rating drop.
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Old 06-04-2013, 02:03 PM   #66
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How? Theyre coming out with an SS 4 dr. That leads me to believe theyre not going to produce SS models. Though, I'd imagine they'll have one for a 6th gen. I think they discontinue camaros afterwards.(meaning 6th gen)If they use an LT1 in an "SS" camaro fro 6th gen, will they detune it? If so, it'll be no more HP than the SS of today though it'll be a bit faster considering the weight reduction. But that also means the HP will begin to drop in unless theyre going to turbo it or intall S/Cs in them. Naturally aspirated, I see the HP rating drop.
What would they use as the base V8 badge?

The LT1 is rated at 455 HP with non NPP exhaust. The LS3 Camaro put out 5 less HP than the LS3 Vette so that would make an LT1 SS Camaro around 450 HP. That's a nice bump from the LS3.
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Old 06-04-2013, 02:48 PM   #67
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There's ZL1's out there with Z28 on them...rockers, fenderwells, etc., so it really is a marketing decision. Had the bankruptcy not happened, the ZL1 would very likely be named Z28 or Z/28, whichever way they decided to make the emblem official back then.

But, fate being what it was, it may be good that there was a pause (unwelcome or not) to reconsider WHAT Chevy would market as deserving the Z/28 name. So I'm glad it worked out the way it did, actually. Everyone wins!

But to always add controversy to the "battle of the name", one has always remained consistent...all window stickers or Service Parts RPO stickers I've ever seen is listed "Z28" with no slash. Regardless of year. Even when "hidden" on window stickers like 5Z28BA as option codes.

All I know is that if it's a Camaro, Z28 or Z/28, it better be RWD and V8 powered. Anything else just wouldn't be a Z. My opinion only. Yours may differ.
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Old 06-04-2013, 10:09 PM   #68
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How? Theyre coming out with an SS 4 dr. That leads me to believe theyre not going to produce SS models. Though, I'd imagine they'll have one for a 6th gen. I think they discontinue camaros afterwards.(meaning 6th gen)If they use an LT1 in an "SS" camaro fro 6th gen, will they detune it? If so, it'll be no more HP than the SS of today though it'll be a bit faster considering the weight reduction. But that also means the HP will begin to drop in unless theyre going to turbo it or intall S/Cs in them. Naturally aspirated, I see the HP rating drop.
Going off what f bod father said, they won't make the z28 mistake again(3rd and 4th gen) so what would they call the v8 model then
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Old 06-05-2013, 10:31 AM   #69
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How? Theyre coming out with an SS 4 dr. That leads me to believe theyre not going to produce SS models. Though, I'd imagine they'll have one for a 6th gen. I think they discontinue camaros afterwards.(meaning 6th gen)If they use an LT1 in an "SS" camaro fro 6th gen, will they detune it? If so, it'll be no more HP than the SS of today though it'll be a bit faster considering the weight reduction. But that also means the HP will begin to drop in unless theyre going to turbo it or intall S/Cs in them. Naturally aspirated, I see the HP rating drop.
No SS Camaro?...lol...C'mon man...That would be an epic blunder...The 6thGen LT-1 V-8's and S/C ZL1's are gonna be all time hp, lighter weight beasts...That's why I think they'll have to hold off on a 6thGen Z/28 to figure out what powerplant they can use that will be appropriate for the Z/28's purpose...

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Old 06-05-2013, 01:50 PM   #70
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No SS Camaro?...lol...C'mon man...That would be an epic blunder...The 6thGen LT-1 V-8's and S/C ZL1's are gonna be all time hp, lighter weight beasts...That's why I think they'll have to hold off on a 6thGen Z/28 to figure out what powerplant they can use that will be appropriate for the Z/28's purpose...
There wont be a 6th gen ZL-1. It was only made one in '69 and now for 5th gens. I dont see a 6th gen ZL-1 being made at all. THe 6th gen Z-28 will be held off but guaranteed to be made. I do believe there will be a 6th gen SS to add the LT-1 in. Afterwards? I see SS going away. The Z-28s purpose unless installed with an LS7 in 6th gen, will be lessened of purpose considering that if not for that engine; there wont be any competition for 5th gen Z vs 6th gen. THe 5th gen Z/28 will be the be all end all of track monster chevrolets.
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Old 06-05-2013, 02:49 PM   #71
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There wont be a 6th gen ZL-1. It was only made one in '69 and now for 5th gens. I dont see a 6th gen ZL-1 being made at all. THe 6th gen Z-28 will be held off but guaranteed to be made. I do believe there will be a 6th gen SS to add the LT-1 in. Afterwards? I see SS going away. The Z-28s purpose unless installed with an LS7 in 6th gen, will be lessened of purpose considering that if not for that engine; there wont be any competition for 5th gen Z vs 6th gen. THe 5th gen Z/28 will be the be all end all of track monster chevrolets.
That doesn't make any sense. The 1969 ZL1 powered Camaros were special order COPO cars. They only built 69 of them. The 5th gen ZL1 is not a special order car, has been built for more than one year and is not limited.

As long as Ford builds a GT500, Chevy needs the ZL1.

The LS7 is dead after the 5th gen. Any 6th gen Z/28 will be LT powered. I don't get why that is so hard to understand.
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:19 PM   #72
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There wont be a 6th gen ZL-1. It was only made one in '69 and now for 5th gens. I dont see a 6th gen ZL-1 being made at all. THe 6th gen Z-28 will be held off but guaranteed to be made. I do believe there will be a 6th gen SS to add the LT-1 in. Afterwards? I see SS going away. The Z-28s purpose unless installed with an LS7 in 6th gen, will be lessened of purpose considering that if not for that engine; there wont be any competition for 5th gen Z vs 6th gen. THe 5th gen Z/28 will be the be all end all of track monster chevrolets.
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That doesn't make any sense. The 1969 ZL1 powered Camaros were special order COPO cars. They only built 69 of them. The 5th gen ZL1 is not a special order car, has been built for more than one year and is not limited.

As long as Ford builds a GT500, Chevy needs the ZL1.

The LS7 is dead after the 5th gen. Any 6th gen Z/28 will be LT powered. I don't get why that is so hard to understand.
It's "all" based on beating the competition and making money. There are rumors of a LT1 based 427 for the Vette. If this happens it'll be in a 6Gen Z/28.
And Bhobbs is correct as long as there is a GT500 there'll be a ZL1. Bottom line; if it sells, why would you not produce it?
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:23 PM   #73
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That doesn't make any sense. The 1969 ZL1 powered Camaros were special order COPO cars. They only built 69 of them. The 5th gen ZL1 is not a special order car, has been built for more than one year and is not limited.

As long as Ford builds a GT500, Chevy needs the ZL1.

The LS7 is dead after the 5th gen. Any 6th gen Z/28 will be LT powered. I don't get why that is so hard to understand.
So an SS and a Z/28 will both be powered by an LT-1? That makes no sense at all. Might as well call it a 1LE.
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:26 PM   #74
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LT1, LT2, LT4...
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:58 PM   #75
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So an SS and a Z/28 will both be powered by an LT-1? That makes no sense at all. Might as well call it a 1LE.
You believe the LT1 will be the only engine GM produces for all Camaro, CTS, Corvette and any other models that use the GM V8?
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