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Old 06-26-2013, 10:15 PM   #86
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Old 06-26-2013, 11:32 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by Bodih View Post
Still kinda shocks me that they offer Inferno Orange Interior, but no IOM paint in 2014. That interior does look good in other color cars though.

I have always thought the Inferno Orange Interior looks good in a Black Camaro.
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Old 06-27-2013, 11:29 AM   #88
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What is the real dealer invoice though?

I hear the real invoice does not include freight and advertising fees and then I hear the real invoice does include those.

Which is the right invoice? Those make a big difference.

You might as well ask what GM's actual cost is to produce the car, vs how much they sell it for.
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Old 06-27-2013, 11:44 AM   #89
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It doesn't matter because the dealer is only making the holdback on the car as profit. Holdback isn't a lot on a Camaro so the dealers aren't getting rich selling Camaros at invoice. I know everyone wants a good deal but dealers have to make profit or they can't stay in business.

What you want is something that's fair for you and fair for the dealer. Anything under invoice is fair to both.
The difference between invoice and invoice that includes freight and advertising is $1658. Not exactly insignificant.
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Old 06-27-2013, 11:58 AM   #90
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so the invoice price shown doesn't include advertising? I can understand it not including delivery as that's a separate charge shown.
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Old 06-27-2013, 12:17 PM   #91
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Which Price to use

First time ordering a car from the dealer and was checking the prices.

My question is which price do you use List, MSRP, Dealer Invoice, Dealer Price, or GM Preferred?

I am looking to order the following:

2014 Camaro ZL1 (1EY37)

Options:

Floor Mats (UYW)
Exposed Fiver Weave Hood (B92)
Decal Package (DSW)
Gas Guzzler Tax (R8E)
Front License Plate Bracket (VK3)
Navigation System (UHQ)
Power Sunroof (CF5)

MSRP $59,175


I understand that the dual mode Exhaust System and the Rear Vision Package are included in the standard equipment

Thanks

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Old 06-27-2013, 12:50 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by DFA View Post
First time ordering a car from the dealer and was checking the prices.

My question is which price do you use List, MSRP, Dealer Invoice, Dealer Price, or GM Preferred?
MSRP is the one you care about, unless you have employee/preferred pricing. Which if you don't think/know if you have it, then most likely you don't have it.

I am looking to order the following:

2014 Camaro ZL1 (1EY37)

Options:

Floor Mats (UYW)
Exposed Fiver Weave Hood (B92)
Decal Package (DSW)
Gas Guzzler Tax (R8E)
Front License Plate Bracket (VK3)
Navigation System (UHQ)
Power Sunroof (CF5)

MSRP $59,175


I understand that the dual mode Exhaust System and the Rear Vision Package are included in the standard equipment
Yep, as well as the RS package
Thanks

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Old 06-27-2013, 12:51 PM   #93
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so the invoice price shown doesn't include advertising? I can understand it not including delivery as that's a separate charge shown.
Correct. Invoice does not include dealer advertising, nor does it include the delivery charge.
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Old 06-27-2013, 01:24 PM   #94
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Correct. Invoice does not include dealer advertising, nor does it include the delivery charge.
So if your goal is to pay invoice are you trying to pay invoice without advertising and freight or pay invoice including advertising and freight?
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Old 06-27-2013, 01:29 PM   #95
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So if your goal is to pay invoice are you trying to pay invoice without advertising and freight or pay invoice including advertising and freight?
Invoice including advertising and freight. What's listed as "invoice" isn't actually dealer invoice - it's invoice before advertising and freight (kind of misleading IMO)
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Old 06-27-2013, 01:40 PM   #96
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The difference between invoice and invoice that includes freight and advertising is $1658. Not exactly insignificant.
Freight and advertising are not something that is kept by the dealership. It's not profit.

It basically works like this.

There's a number that the dealer pays GM for the car, which is invoice and then there's MSRP. Now, when the dealer sells the car, they get the holdback from GM. So, if a dealer sells a car below invoice, they're eating into the holdback, which is the profit on the car. Therefore, depending on the vehicle, that would be a good deal.

A ZL1 will have roughly $1600-1800 in holdback. So, if you can buy one for less than invoice, say $200-300 less, then that's a fair deal for the dealer and the customer. It's also less than preferred price. So, that's a win for the customer.

Everyone thinks that a dealer making over $1000 on a car deal is too much. It's not. Imagine how much it costs to keep a dealership running.
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Old 06-27-2013, 01:48 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by GearheadSS View Post
Freight and advertising are not something that is kept by the dealership. It's not profit.

It basically works like this.

There's a number that the dealer pays GM for the car, which is invoice and then there's MSRP. Now, when the dealer sells the car, they get the holdback from GM. So, if a dealer sells a car below invoice, they're eating into the holdback, which is the profit on the car. Therefore, depending on the vehicle, that would be a good deal.

A ZL1 will have roughly $1600-1800 in holdback. So, if you can buy one for less than invoice, say $200-300 less, then that's a fair deal for the dealer and the customer. It's also less than preferred price. So, that's a win for the customer.

Everyone thinks that a dealer making over $1000 on a car deal is too much. It's not. Imagine how much it costs to keep a dealership running.
That I understand. It's just that Invoice is actually confusing. Invoice is the goal, but there is Invoice that doesn't include freight and advertising and Invoice that does and the difference between those two numbers is significant. I am just trying to figure out the real invoice.

As for as not making a lot of money that is true of GM dealers. The difference between MSRP and Invoice is a very narrow margin. Ford allows its dealers to make more money.

It's kind of surprising how much more expensive a camaro is compared to a mustang considering the small margin the dealership gets.
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Old 06-28-2013, 12:44 AM   #98
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AOL Autos has a 2014 Camaro car builder up, complete with invoice pricing for those that are interested.

http://autos.aol.com/cars-Chevrolet-...-2014/pricing/
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Old 06-28-2013, 09:42 PM   #99
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Old 06-29-2013, 12:49 AM   #100
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That I understand. It's just that Invoice is actually confusing. Invoice is the goal, but there is Invoice that doesn't include freight and advertising and Invoice that does and the difference between those two numbers is significant. I am just trying to figure out the real invoice.

As for as not making a lot of money that is true of GM dealers. The difference between MSRP and Invoice is a very narrow margin. Ford allows its dealers to make more money.

It's kind of surprising how much more expensive a camaro is compared to a mustang considering the small margin the dealership gets.
I think there is a profit margin that no one sees but GM and the owner of the GM garage. Another big factor is volume sales discount for the dealer. A dealer will sell below invoice to meet the quota for volume sales. Once quota is met GM gives the dealer incentives be it cash or lower buying price on new stock
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:07 AM   #101
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Never understood why people order cars before pricing is announced and then get shocked when they realize they can't afford the car.
This happened to us once. Back in Feb of 08 we ordered our Buick Enclave. While we were waiting for the car to be built GM had a strike. In mid june we received a note that our 08 car would not be built as they retooled for the 09. We talked to the dealer and said fine keep the deal the same and the dealer ordered the 09. The car arrived at the dealer a few days later, and along with it the new pricing. About $1500.00 higher. Because of the timing and strike, the dealership did not have the any of the new paper work until the day after the car arrived.
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Old 06-29-2013, 03:01 PM   #102
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I think there is a profit margin that no one sees but GM and the owner of the GM garage. Another big factor is volume sales discount for the dealer. A dealer will sell below invoice to meet the quota for volume sales. Once quota is met GM gives the dealer incentives be it cash or lower buying price on new stock
Of course there is. I am sure they get big bonuses for meeting certain criteria that make up. However, as a consumer the difference between the two invoices is a good chunk of change so it helps to know which invoice you are aiming for to know if you are getting a good deal or not.
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