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Chevy Camaro vs... Comparison of Chevy Camaro versus its competition. *NO STREET RACING STORIES*

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Old 06-25-2013, 08:38 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Deki View Post
It doesn't matter how many models of Corvettes there are that would "kill" a 911S, or any 911, OP wasn't comparing the two. And performance is the only thing that matters when comparing two cars against each other in PERFORMANCE tests. That's why they compare the 911 Turbo to the GTR, and the Z06/ZR1 to Ferraris, Lamborghinis, and Porsche. Does value matter to people that are looking at buying one? Yes. To Average Joe's and keyboard commandos, price only matters for the sake of an argument. If someone is looking at a 911S, most of the time they are not cross shopping a Corvette, of any kind. Different driving experience, different type of car, and totally different market segments. The GT-R was supposed to slay the 911 Turbo, and it a lot of performance tests it did. Do you know how much market share it took from the 911 Turbo? Exactly 0%. GT-R got released, and 911 numbers still went up that year, and the following year, and last year, and they are up again this year.
Because 911s are the SH$%#$$#t
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Old 06-25-2013, 08:44 PM   #27
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Compare the Lambo to an SS all you want, it's faster in every way. It's not ludicrous to conpare cars with a vast price difference. I just listed you some examples above. Corvette is conpared all the time to cars 2, 3, and even 4 times it's price. Cars are expensive for different reasons, such as technology, exclusivity, pedigree, and cost to manufacture. Corvette vs 911, they are close in performance. 911S does 0-60 in under 4 seconds and runs the 1/4 in 12 flat. And the 911 Turbo beats anything Corvette has to offer, all while not wearing 60 tread wear tires like the Z06 or the ZR1. And lol@ Porsche being corvette's and GT-R's bitch hahaah
Funny how he put that Deki. A few weeks ago I met a guy at the track who drove a GTR R35 for a street car and a Porsche Cup car on the track. He told me that yeah the GTR is faster but the Porshe cup car would waste the GTR on the corners. His lap times were noticeably faster than the times any stock GTR driver puts down at that same track by like 3 to 4 seconds faster. His is a 996 cup car not even a 997. Also I took a Porsche 911 carrera S around a corner faster than many other modded cars I owned by like 20 mph faster. That rear 60%+ bias really keeps the rear wheels planted.
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Old 06-25-2013, 10:25 PM   #28
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Porsche def offers a better driving experience. But the newer 991s are nothing like the 993s or even better '73RS.
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Old 06-26-2013, 12:33 AM   #29
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If you can prove to me that a 911 Turbo has gone faster than 10.6 in the 1/4 bone stock and 10.2 in the 1/4 mile bone stock with drag radials then I will agree with you there. As far as road courses go, you know the type of racing GM built the car for, there is plenty of hard facts to prove the ZR1 is the faster car. Here is just a few of them.

VIR -Corvette holds the record at #1. 911 Turbo #17
Willow Springs- Vette #2. 911 Turbo #12
Laguna Seca- Vette hold the record on this as well at #1. 911 Turbo #14
Spring Mountain-ohh look another Vette record holder. 911 Turbo #8

Home court advantage? Ok, lets go over to the cars home country of Germany.

Hockenheim Short-Corvette #6. 911 turbo #40.
Autozeitung-Vette #2. 911 Turbo #11
Nordschleife- Vette #13. 911 Turbo #24
Sorry bud but I'm not seeing a lot of evidence to support your claim. Don't bother posting excuses or opinion in response. I want facts.

As it looks to me model for model in the performance only category the Porsche is in fact Corvette's little biatch.

Base Corvette>Cayman
Grand Sport>Cayman S
ZO6>911
ZO6/ZO7>911 S
ZR1>911 Turbo
ZR1>=<911 Turbo S. Really close but huge price difference.
Porsche has gone 2.6 to 60 and 10.7@129 in the 1/4 bone stock. As for lap times, nice mag racing, but same day same driver tests are hard to find. And since when are you the authority to decide what model from the Porsche line up gets compared to the Corvette line up? Since when is a Cayman/Boxter a competitor to the Corvette? You're basing everything on price again. I've seen these 10.6xx zr1 runs made in -1400 DA, big deal. Like I said, ZR1 and the Z06 got toppled as kings of the hill by both the GT-R and the 911T, that's why Chevy put the PSS Cups on them. In fact, especially on the Nurburgring, the ZR1 couldn't crack a 7:38, just like the 911T, when it was in stock trim. Once they started using safety equipment", as in roll cages, in turn stiffening the car, and then throwing the "optional" DOT competition tires on them did they start "winning" that battle. Ring times are a marketing gimmick, and GM releasing track times that people can't seem to replicate is another one. In the end, like I said, you would be hard pressed to find anyone cross shopping the two. Porsche guys and Corvette guys are equally passionate about their own brands. I like both, but I prefer the 911 for it's every day livability and blend of performance and luxury.
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Old 06-26-2013, 01:44 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by Deki View Post
Porsche has gone 2.6 to 60 and 10.7@129 in the 1/4 bone stock. As for lap times, nice mag racing, but same day same driver tests are hard to find. And since when are you the authority to decide what model from the Porsche line up gets compared to the Corvette line up? Since when is a Cayman/Boxter a competitor to the Corvette? You're basing everything on price again. I've seen these 10.6xx zr1 runs made in -1400 DA, big deal. Like I said, ZR1 and the Z06 got toppled as kings of the hill by both the GT-R and the 911T, that's why Chevy put the PSS Cups on them. In fact, especially on the Nurburgring, the ZR1 couldn't crack a 7:38, just like the 911T, when it was in stock trim. Once they started using safety equipment", as in roll cages, in turn stiffening the car, and then throwing the "optional" DOT competition tires on them did they start "winning" that battle. Ring times are a marketing gimmick, and GM releasing track times that people can't seem to replicate is another one. In the end, like I said, you would be hard pressed to find anyone cross shopping the two. Porsche guys and Corvette guys are equally passionate about their own brands. I like both, but I prefer the 911 for it's every day livability and blend of performance and luxury.
I clearly said dont come on here spouting your excuses and opinions and what do you do? You post opinions and excuses. Get back to me with some hard facts on performance. Until a bone stock 911 Turbo does 10.5 ET in the 1/4 and beats the ZR1 records on all those tracks you need to admit your WRONG. Why do you keep bringing up cross shopping? How is it relevant? I'm talking about performance between 1 car to the other. Both cars have been compaired to each other since 1965 in this regard. They are CONSTANTLY tested against each other. When GM builds the Corvette they have a target model Porsche to beat. I'm not the one who decides that. That was GM. You can try to make all the excuses you want for Porsche but the numbers don't lie. Ohh and I didnt even list Nurburgring. LOL. Many of the ones I listed were done independantly from GM so how again could it be a marketing gimmick? Your other excuses about tires and what not is just that its excuses. I get told alot of those too when I beat someone.
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Old 06-26-2013, 05:30 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Deki View Post
Porsche has gone 2.6 to 60 and 10.7@129 in the 1/4 bone stock. As for lap times, nice mag racing, but same day same driver tests are hard to find. And since when are you the authority to decide what model from the Porsche line up gets compared to the Corvette line up? Since when is a Cayman/Boxter a competitor to the Corvette? You're basing everything on price again. I've seen these 10.6xx zr1 runs made in -1400 DA, big deal. Like I said, ZR1 and the Z06 got toppled as kings of the hill by both the GT-R and the 911T, that's why Chevy put the PSS Cups on them. In fact, especially on the Nurburgring, the ZR1 couldn't crack a 7:38, just like the 911T, when it was in stock trim. Once they started using safety equipment", as in roll cages, in turn stiffening the car, and then throwing the "optional" DOT competition tires on them did they start "winning" that battle. Ring times are a marketing gimmick, and GM releasing track times that people can't seem to replicate is another one. In the end, like I said, you would be hard pressed to find anyone cross shopping the two. Porsche guys and Corvette guys are equally passionate about their own brands. I like both, but I prefer the 911 for it's every day livability and blend of performance and luxury.
Funny how when the 5.0 vs SS mag reports came out certain people seemed to scoff at them, now in regards to the the Corvette their Gospel?
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Old 06-26-2013, 05:38 AM   #32
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the porche is quicker....than a vette!
HOLD ON!

First of all.. its spelt Porsche.

2ndly, you have to specify what model was the 911...? ranges from 911 , 4, 4S, Turbo. There is a difference from a standard C2 to a CS (350-400hp, turbo with 500hp).

Its like me saying Chevrolet beats the Mustang GT .

Was it a 997 or 991? the 991 has an additional 15hp to its previous.

In conclusion, the 911 Carrera 3.4 & 3.8 models can NOT beat the Vette Z06 nor ZR1s.
However, the 911 Turbo is a tight competitor with the Z06.





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Old 06-26-2013, 06:05 AM   #33
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What year 911?
True, the 911S has been around since the 60's, I do agree with the comment about somebody not cross shopping them, probably not, unless bang for the buck were at the top of the list. I could be wrong, but in certain circles a Ford, Dodge or Chevy would not even come close to being considered in a vehicle purchase against one of the more costly German autos. Wouldn't matter if the American beat it in every performance category. Oh well, their loss!
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Old 06-26-2013, 06:18 AM   #34
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Same mentality can be found in the gun world. Years ago the Xd was imported by Interarms, it didn't generate nearly the sale #'s until Springfield Armory decided to market the gun with their name on it. They even asked more $ for it than when first introduced, today it is a pretty popular piece.
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Old 06-26-2013, 07:53 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by Camaro_h View Post
HOLD ON!

First of all.. its spelt Porsche.

2ndly, you have to specify what model was the 911...? ranges from 911 , 4, 4S, Turbo. There is a difference from a standard C2 to a CS (350-400hp, turbo with 500hp).

Its like me saying Chevrolet beats the Mustang GT .

Was it a 997 or 991? the 991 has an additional 15hp to its previous.

In conclusion, the 911 Carrera 3.4 & 3.8 models can NOT beat the Vette Z06 nor ZR1s.
However, the 911 Turbo is a tight competitor with the Z06.





Best regards,

Technical & Training Manager at Porsche Centre Kuwait.

i hate grammar nazis, AND the model was in the 1st post:

"I know a guy who raced a 911 Carrera S recently."
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:26 AM   #36
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In all fairness, he did say, "the Porsche is quicker. . . "

as far as I'm concerned, this is the Porsche

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Old 06-26-2013, 11:52 AM   #37
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i hate grammar nazis, AND the model was in the 1st post:

"I know a guy who raced a 911 Carrera S recently."
Whew, glad English class is over. Never know when you might speell something wrong.
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Old 06-27-2013, 03:29 AM   #38
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I clearly said dont come on here spouting your excuses and opinions and what do you do? You post opinions and excuses. Get back to me with some hard facts on performance. Until a bone stock 911 Turbo does 10.5 ET in the 1/4 and beats the ZR1 records on all those tracks you need to admit your WRONG. Why do you keep bringing up cross shopping? How is it relevant? I'm talking about performance between 1 car to the other. Both cars have been compaired to each other since 1965 in this regard. They are CONSTANTLY tested against each other. When GM builds the Corvette they have a target model Porsche to beat. I'm not the one who decides that. That was GM. You can try to make all the excuses you want for Porsche but the numbers don't lie. Ohh and I didnt even list Nurburgring. LOL. Many of the ones I listed were done independantly from GM so how again could it be a marketing gimmick? Your other excuses about tires and what not is just that its excuses. I get told alot of those too when I beat someone.
Like I said, mag racing. And the fact that you did list the Nurburgring and you don't even realize that you did just shows me that you copy and paste times without knowing the details of the test, what tires were ran on the cars, who drove them, where, and if optional tires were used or not.

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Originally Posted by VADER SS L99 View Post
Nordschleife- Vette #13. 911 Turbo #24
^ That's the Nurburgring.

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Funny how when the 5.0 vs SS mag reports came out certain people seemed to scoff at them, now in regards to the the Corvette their Gospel?
lol yep. Use the "facts" when they are convenient for you <- Creed of the magazine racer.
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I dont get bringing tires up. Can't any manufacture use cup tires or does GM own the exclusive rights to these?
No, they don't have exclusive rights to them by any means, but when the Z06 and the ZR1 started getting beaten in tests and reviews by cars that should be slower based on horsepower and weight, GM fixed the problem by sticking competition DOT approved tires on the car. They have between a 60 to 80 tread wear rating and are not very good for street use. They typically last less then 5k miles.


That is the exact same reason that I don't buy all these "lap times" that everyone throws around. They add "safety equipment" which stiffens up the car, and they use optional near race tires to do them. It's not something that someone who buys the car is going to use or exploit themselves. It's also funny that when independent tests are done, the cars typically don't even come close to what the manufacturer is claiming their "stock" car did. I think the GT-Rs were notorious for this when they first came out. That is also why the LF-A is one of my favorite super cars ever. Yes it's a Lexus, but Toyota was pretty successful in JGTC and that car was developed by engineer that were working for the Toyota F1 team while it was still around. That car holds the record at the "ring", and it's the fastest car ever tested there on standard Bridgestone Potenza RE070.
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Old 06-27-2013, 04:37 AM   #39
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i hate grammar nazis, AND the model was in the 1st post:

"I know a guy who raced a 911 Carrera S recently."
I pity you.
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Old 06-27-2013, 09:48 AM   #40
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Well I walked my buddies 04 Gallardo. Even he was impressed. With a bone stock ZL1 vs bone stock Gallardo!
04 gallardo and 05 gallardo were slugs for lamborghini. real 0-60 times were more in the 4.2-4.4 range
try 07 Gallardo, they are quick off the line 3.7 -3.8 to 60. in the end it's a friggin' LAMBO i'd rather be rolling in regardless if it's the fastest car on the planet or not. BEAUTIFUL

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Old 06-27-2013, 02:49 PM   #41
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Like I said, mag racing. And the fact that you did list the Nurburgring and you don't even realize that you did just shows me that you copy and paste times without knowing the details of the test, what tires were ran on the cars, who drove them, where, and if optional tires were used or not.



^ That's the Nurburgring.



lol yep. Use the "facts" when they are convenient for you <- Creed of the magazine racer.


No, they don't have exclusive rights to them by any means, but when the Z06 and the ZR1 started getting beaten in tests and reviews by cars that should be slower based on horsepower and weight, GM fixed the problem by sticking competition DOT approved tires on the car. They have between a 60 to 80 tread wear rating and are not very good for street use. They typically last less then 5k miles.


That is the exact same reason that I don't buy all these "lap times" that everyone throws around. They add "safety equipment" which stiffens up the car, and they use optional near race tires to do them. It's not something that someone who buys the car is going to use or exploit themselves. It's also funny that when independent tests are done, the cars typically don't even come close to what the manufacturer is claiming their "stock" car did. I think the GT-Rs were notorious for this when they first came out. That is also why the LF-A is one of my favorite super cars ever. Yes it's a Lexus, but Toyota was pretty successful in JGTC and that car was developed by engineer that were working for the Toyota F1 team while it was still around. That car holds the record at the "ring", and it's the fastest car ever tested there on standard Bridgestone Potenza RE070.
Again all excuses. The ZR1 with those tires is a production option. I'm pretty sure Porsche has that type of option on cars like the GT2 and GT3.

You are right about the Nurburgring. My bad on that. See, I can admit when I'm wrong. You should do the same because the 911 turbo is not faster than a ZR1.
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:43 AM   #42
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i raced a porsche 911 carrera from a rolling start 60mph and stopped at 130mph we were dead even the entire time. all i have is BBK cold air intake and Borla ATAK cat-back exhaust. i made a thread about it http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=304227
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Old 06-28-2013, 12:43 PM   #43
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Again all excuses. The ZR1 with those tires is a production option. I'm pretty sure Porsche has that type of option on cars like the GT2 and GT3.

You are right about the Nurburgring. My bad on that. See, I can admit when I'm wrong. You should do the same because the 911 turbo is not faster than a ZR1.
Yes I was wrong, and you were right The ZR1 did run faster in the 1/4 then the 911 Turbo. It also beat it on most of the tracks you listed. See I can do that too lol

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i raced a porsche 911 carrera from a rolling start 60mph and stopped at 130mph we were dead even the entire time. all i have is BBK cold air intake and Borla ATAK cat-back exhaust. i made a thread about it http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=304227
It's got 80hp less then you
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Old 06-29-2013, 07:48 PM   #44
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I was the kid in the 1st. grade spelling bee. K-A-T! Can I sit the F&#K down now?
So you were the kid that passed me and said "I know there are two t's."
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Old 06-30-2013, 03:55 AM   #45
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I pity you.

I find it hysterical that the point was completely lost.... oh well.... How's things in KWT....???
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Old 06-30-2013, 07:25 AM   #46
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I find it hysterical that the point was completely lost.... oh well.... How's things in KWT....???
man, im having the longest day at work preppin Air Conditioning training for tomorrow mornings class. i need more coffee
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