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Old 07-24-2013, 05:15 PM   #18
killmode_on
 
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WARNING!!! I am totally biased for AGP so take this for whatever you can get out of it. Could be wrong on some points, but I'm pretty sure.


First of all you are comparing IPS entry level 800whp kit to AGP's full 1000whp kit. Keep in mind when you add fuel, ceramic and powder coating to the IPS entry kit, it's is $650 more than AGP's full kit. And even then still doesn't include as much. What you are getting with the AGP kit is more of an OEM quality kit where you get more for le$$ because the volume manufacturing. AGP has built and shipped thousands and thousands of turbo kits for many years and is in a manufacturing position to invest up front to produce what would be a $12,000 kit, but for much much less.

Differences in the kits-
Like camarostar2010 said above, his IPS kit hangs below the frame of the car and can be problematic on rough roads, especially on lowered cars. The AGP kit is all tucked up higher, nothing hanging lower than the frame.
AGP kit comes with a little bigger, higher flowing turbos w/ 3" v-band outlets that help them spool faster and make more power than the smaller Garrett's in IPS's kit.
AGP kit comes with the larger higher flowing piping and intercooler
With AGP you get a choice of two intercooler sizes, a big one or a HUGE one. Same price.
Cast iron manifold adaptors in the AGP kit are certainly an advantage for heat retention and durability/longevity.
IPS kit has air filters much lower to the ground, right on the turbo. AGP has short intakes that keep the filters up and out of any water.
AGP comes with heat shields, dual PCV breather/catch cans, ZR1 iridium plugs, 3bar map sensor, ceramic coating and powder coating all standard.
The AGP charge pipe has 4 aux npt bungs right before the TB for breakout IAT. Meth inj. etc
AGP kits have been shipping to dealers and fit right, bolt on easy and make power. IPS is still gearing up to be able to ship.

Not sure these details on IPS but-
AGP's kit-
no drilling or tapping any part of the engine for oil feed and return
oil feeds to the turbos are from a filtered oil source off the engine
oil return has secondary filter for the oil returning to your engine



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Old 07-24-2013, 06:19 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killmode_on View Post
WARNING!!! I am totally biased for AGP so take this for whatever you can get out of it. Could be wrong on some points, but I'm pretty sure.


First of all you are comparing IPS entry level 800whp kit to AGP's full 1000whp kit. Keep in mind when you add fuel, ceramic and powder coating to the IPS entry kit, it's is $650 more than AGP's full kit. And even then still doesn't include as much. What you are getting with the AGP kit is more of an OEM quality kit where you get more for le$$ because the volume manufacturing. AGP has built and shipped thousands and thousands of turbo kits for many years and is in a manufacturing position to invest up front to produce what would be a $12,000 kit, but for much much less.

Differences in the kits-
Like camarostar2010 said above, his IPS kit hangs below the frame of the car and can be problematic on rough roads, especially on lowered cars. The AGP kit is all tucked up higher, nothing hanging lower than the frame.
AGP kit comes with a little bigger, higher flowing turbos w/ 3" v-band outlets that help them spool faster and make more power than the smaller Garrett's in IPS's kit.
AGP kit comes with the larger higher flowing piping and intercooler
With AGP you get a choice of two intercooler sizes, a big one or a HUGE one. Same price.
Cast iron manifold adaptors in the AGP kit are certainly an advantage for heat retention and durability/longevity.
IPS kit has air filters much lower to the ground, right on the turbo. AGP has short intakes that keep the filters up and out of any water.
AGP comes with heat shields, dual PCV breather/catch cans, ZR1 iridium plugs, 3bar map sensor, ceramic coating and powder coating all standard.
The AGP charge pipe has 4 aux npt bungs right before the TB for breakout IAT. Meth inj. etc
AGP kits have been shipping to dealers and fit right, bolt on easy and make power. IPS is still gearing up to be able to ship.

Not sure these details on IPS but-
AGP's kit-
no drilling or tapping any part of the engine for oil feed and return
oil feeds to the turbos are from a filtered oil source off the engine
oil return has secondary filter for the oil returning to your engine


Will the turbos on the AGP support up to 1200 rwhp on a big breathing LSX427. See sig line. I was looking at PTE6766 journal bearing units. How do the turbos in the AGP kit compare. No sales pitch please, no BS, just the facts. Looking for 1000rwhp initially at 18psi then up to 1200rwhp with obivously higher boost. Lag time on the PTE6766 should not be an issue with my motor. I am new to the turbo world and am trying to learn before i pull the trigger so to speak (if that offends some.....well you know what you can do)
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Old 07-24-2013, 06:41 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BullF-16 View Post
Will the turbos on the AGP support up to 1200 rwhp on a big breathing LSX427. See sig line. I was looking at PTE6766 journal bearing units. How do the turbos in the AGP kit compare. No sales pitch please, no BS, just the facts. Looking for 1000rwhp initially at 18psi then up to 1200rwhp with obivously higher boost. Lag time on the PTE6766 should not be an issue with my motor. I am new to the turbo world and am trying to learn before i pull the trigger so to speak (if that offends some.....well you know what you can do)

The standard turbos in the AGP kit will not support that level of power. $800 upgrade to get the S261's would. You should contact AGP directly to talk about it. AGP could make PTE turbos fit or whatever you really want. Soooooo many choices in turbos.
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Old 07-24-2013, 07:06 PM   #21
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We are going to be doing a agp kit on a camaro w/ S261 turbo's and it will support 1200rwhp BullF-16 if i can be of any assistance let me know. AGP is literally down the street from me so i'm here to help if i can.
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Old 07-24-2013, 07:14 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Joe@CPR.com View Post
We are going to be doing a agp kit on a camaro w/ S261 turbo's and it will support 1200rwhp BullF-16 if i can be of any assistance let me know. AGP is literally down the street from me so i'm here to help if i can.
Damn, wish i was still at Luke AFB
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Old 07-24-2013, 07:21 PM   #23
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Bull, like Joe said, 261s will, or even bigger. What do you want is the question? If you really want PTEs, just pay the difference. Want GT35rs, or whatever. AGP has their own billet badass turbos that would be my choice if I had a kit. A pair of Zeta 3.0s or something like that.
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Old 07-24-2013, 07:44 PM   #24
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Thanks Nick, now that i am done with my suspension and just added 6 piston calipers and huge rotors i am starting to address the TT. My shop is a distributor for PTE and highly recommends them but i am researching my options.

I know i want the compressor to be 67mm inducer and 87 exducer and turbine to be 77mm inducer and 66mm exducer. Or in the ball park. i figure this is what would make my motor happy and would not require spinning the turbos to crazy levels. This would also allow flexibility for future endeavours. NOw need to figure out the A/R for my 99% street car.

also cast OEM manifolds, shortys or custom fabbed? Thats another issue altogether.
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Old 07-24-2013, 08:49 PM   #25
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See our latest AGP build thread... New 376ci forged motor so we didnt tax on it, 8.8:1 compression made 700+ (12.2psi upstairs) at 6100rpms through an automatic with 17* timing & 10.9:1 AFR. We'll be bringing it back in soon, but the fuel system is limited so we can see mid 700's at 13-15psi. If we had the fuel system I dont see any reason why these "small" turbos won't push 800rwhp through a 6L80E, and that's over 900rwhp in the manual's.. Now add another 5psi and see what else can be done

We are using the S256 turbos on our shop car build, 417ci. Should be seeing 25psi and I don't doubt we'll make 850+ rwhp through a TH400...
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Old 07-24-2013, 09:04 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by BullF-16 View Post
Thanks Nick, now that i am done with my suspension and just added 6 piston calipers and huge rotors i am starting to address the TT. My shop is a distributor for PTE and highly recommends them but i am researching my options.

I know i want the compressor to be 67mm inducer and 87 exducer and turbine to be 77mm inducer and 66mm exducer. Or in the ball park. i figure this is what would make my motor happy and would not require spinning the turbos to crazy levels. This would also allow flexibility for future endeavours. NOw need to figure out the A/R for my 99% street car.

also cast OEM manifolds, shortys or custom fabbed? Thats another issue altogether.
If you don't want to deal with cracking, cast is the only way to go.
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Old 07-24-2013, 09:43 PM   #27
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The factory ls3 manifolds flow extremely well and being cast will provide years of trouble free performance. Don't get me wrong tubular is gorgeous!

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Old 07-25-2013, 01:38 AM   #28
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If you don't want to deal with cracking, cast is the only way to go.
That's not entirely accurate. These manifolds were not designed with Turbo heat or support in mind. Cast manifolds steal and subsequently store a bunch of heat, and then radiate it outwards. Coatings help, heat shields do the same.
If you don't want any cracking, and the least amount of heat stolen from the system, thin wall inconel manifolds with a good coating are best.
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Old 07-25-2013, 07:57 AM   #29
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Bull,

Take it from me, while the 67/66's might live for a while and be happy at moderately high boost levels on a 427, they won't last very long.... They seem to hold up to some of the short runs in drag racing but via the longer hotter runs of land speed racing I have determined at high boost levels they are too small...

I've been through several of them, including blowing two of them up in the same weekend on two different Mile passes. Both of them broke in the center section.... and yes, they were CEA billet wheels with ball bearing upgrades...

We were overspinning the hell out of them to make 25 lbs of boost.... Made one dyno pass at 30 psi.... in addition to the Mile passes at 25... The second turbo of the weekend didn't make it a full pass before it grenaded. I will saythey lasted for well over a year of runs and street driving when limited to only 18 lbs of boost... beyond that, you're on borrowed time...

We are going back together with 76/75 CEA turbos with an "H" cover and T4 outlets.

We've been told point blank, they will handle the cubes and boost.... The difference is we will be notching the frame to make them fit in the same location, next to the bell housing... and doing a HUGE intercooler...

The efficiency range for these is going to be much better, so the IAT's wont be so ridiculous...
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Old 07-25-2013, 09:07 AM   #30
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That is just PTE turbos, nothing to do with size IMO.
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Old 07-25-2013, 09:11 AM   #31
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Damn, wish i was still at Luke AFB


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It's Ok I'll ship you out the kit lol.
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Old 07-25-2013, 03:22 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killmode_on View Post
WARNING!!! I am totally biased for AGP so take this for whatever you can get out of it. Could be wrong on some points, but I'm pretty sure.


First of all you are comparing IPS entry level 800whp kit to AGP's full 1000whp kit. Keep in mind when you add fuel, ceramic and powder coating to the IPS entry kit, it's is $650 more than AGP's full kit. And even then still doesn't include as much. What you are getting with the AGP kit is more of an OEM quality kit where you get more for le$$ because the volume manufacturing. AGP has built and shipped thousands and thousands of turbo kits for many years and is in a manufacturing position to invest up front to produce what would be a $12,000 kit, but for much much less.

Differences in the kits-
Like camarostar2010 said above, his IPS kit hangs below the frame of the car and can be problematic on rough roads, especially on lowered cars. The AGP kit is all tucked up higher, nothing hanging lower than the frame.
AGP kit comes with a little bigger, higher flowing turbos w/ 3" v-band outlets that help them spool faster and make more power than the smaller Garrett's in IPS's kit.
AGP kit comes with the larger higher flowing piping and intercooler
With AGP you get a choice of two intercooler sizes, a big one or a HUGE one. Same price.
Cast iron manifold adaptors in the AGP kit are certainly an advantage for heat retention and durability/longevity.
IPS kit has air filters much lower to the ground, right on the turbo. AGP has short intakes that keep the filters up and out of any water.
AGP comes with heat shields, dual PCV breather/catch cans, ZR1 iridium plugs, 3bar map sensor, ceramic coating and powder coating all standard.
The AGP charge pipe has 4 aux npt bungs right before the TB for breakout IAT. Meth inj. etc
AGP kits have been shipping to dealers and fit right, bolt on easy and make power. IPS is still gearing up to be able to ship.

Not sure these details on IPS but-
AGP's kit-
no drilling or tapping any part of the engine for oil feed and return
oil feeds to the turbos are from a filtered oil source off the engine
oil return has secondary filter for the oil returning to your engine


If i remember correctly if you get the 3in compressor housing on the IPS kit then it it will be above the frame. camarostar has the 4in. j/s
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Old 07-25-2013, 03:25 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by SSE 4 2SS View Post
Bull,

Take it from me, while the 67/66's might live for a while and be happy at moderately high boost levels on a 427, they won't last very long.... They seem to hold up to some of the short runs in drag racing but via the longer hotter runs of land speed racing I have determined at high boost levels they are too small...

I've been through several of them, including blowing two of them up in the same weekend on two different Mile passes. Both of them broke in the center section.... and yes, they were CEA billet wheels with ball bearing upgrades...

We were overspinning the hell out of them to make 25 lbs of boost.... Made one dyno pass at 30 psi.... in addition to the Mile passes at 25... The second turbo of the weekend didn't make it a full pass before it grenaded. I will saythey lasted for well over a year of runs and street driving when limited to only 18 lbs of boost... beyond that, you're on borrowed time...

We are going back together with 76/75 CEA turbos with an "H" cover and T4 outlets.

We've been told point blank, they will handle the cubes and boost.... The difference is we will be notching the frame to make them fit in the same location, next to the bell housing... and doing a HUGE intercooler...

The efficiency range for these is going to be much better, so the IAT's wont be so ridiculous...
that is going to be awesome and very cool. excited to see this completed.
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Old 07-25-2013, 07:37 PM   #34
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Too much drama with turbos. I think i may just stick with the simple centri. Some guys say the turbos are too big, some say too small. Some say Precision Turbo sucks, some say they dont. I know my PC is beastly and im having damn fun and i know the F1c or F1x will meet my goals.

Im not gonna sleep for a few days

This was the hardest decision i have had to make. Stick with what you know works (this has never let me down)

Sorry to sound like a whiny biotch. I think this motor will last forever at 14psi from the dinky D1SC. That is bliss!
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