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Old 03-16-2013, 11:45 PM   #1
ZO6 Bryan
 
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ID850 injectors install.

Spent this afternoon putting in ID850's. Not a bad install. Ran into a little snag as the bolt that holds the fuel rail down on the front of the blower won't come out without running into the blower hat. Took a little air chisel and remove a tiny amount of aluminum so the bolt could come out. Then painted it with some black touch-up paint. Put the data in from Injector Dynamics, fired it up, and pig rich at idle. So much for being plug-and-play. Had to tune the injector offsets myself anyway. Now it's pretty close. I'll do more logging and tuning tomorrow.

First pic shows the bolt that wouldn't come out without some "help".

Second pic, see that I had to loosen the last bolt on the hat to allow that last injector to pop out. The fuel rail was hitting the end of that bolt where it stuck thru the blower casting.
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Old 03-17-2013, 09:44 AM   #2
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good job...I had a trick for that front bolt which was exactly the same clearance issue as you show. Turn an open ended 10mm straight up and use a pair of vice grips on the wrench to turn. Once it breaks loose, you can almost get that bolt out with your fingers. Your clearancing was good as it will never present an issue again. My tuner had a slight problem tuning the idle as well because the ID850s flow so much fuel. At minimum pulse width the injectors still flow like a fire hose. Its fine however a hot start will ocassionally belch some black smoke. It's a small trade off to have safe fueling at higher rpms under boost.
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#917 A6. 10.67@126.2 1.53 60' ATI/Lingenfelter balancer (10" ring), stock upper pulley, 90mm TB, ID850s,Rotofab/Lingenfelter intercooler reservoir, Cooler Logic HX, Lingenfelter idler relocation bracket, NGK TR7ix, 160 t-stat, Dewitts Radiator, Texas Speed 1 7/8" headers(no cats). M&H drag radials 325/45-17 & M&H 28x4.5" bias skinnies. Tuning by Frost at Performance Autosport in Richmond, VA (804) 358-2505
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Old 03-17-2013, 10:10 AM   #3
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That stinks about the injector data. That's supposed to be the great selling point on these injectors. Anyway, what offset did you use that worked? I'm getting ready to tune a friend's CTS-V with the same injectors and similar mods.
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Old 03-17-2013, 01:00 PM   #4
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That stinks about the injector data. That's supposed to be the great selling point on these injectors. Anyway, what offset did you use that worked? I'm getting ready to tune a friend's CTS-V with the same injectors and similar mods.

I'll get back to you after I'm done tuning. Suffice to say that at least 10% needed to be removed from the offset data provided.
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Old 03-17-2013, 02:11 PM   #5
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good job...I had a trick for that front bolt which was exactly the same clearance issue as you show. Turn an open ended 10mm straight up and use a pair of vice grips on the wrench to turn. Once it breaks loose, you can almost get that bolt out with your fingers. Your clearancing was good as it will never present an issue again. My tuner had a slight problem tuning the idle as well because the ID850s flow so much fuel. At minimum pulse width the injectors still flow like a fire hose. Its fine however a hot start will ocassionally belch some black smoke. It's a small trade off to have safe fueling at higher rpms under boost.

Where should the A/F be at when at wot. 11- 11.7 ? Is it unsafe to be at 12ish
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Old 03-17-2013, 03:28 PM   #6
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11.0-11.2 is good....we leaned it out on the dyno and lost hp 3 separate times...keep it in the richer zone and all will be happy and safe. Stock was right there in the same range and GM knows best!
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#917 A6. 10.67@126.2 1.53 60' ATI/Lingenfelter balancer (10" ring), stock upper pulley, 90mm TB, ID850s,Rotofab/Lingenfelter intercooler reservoir, Cooler Logic HX, Lingenfelter idler relocation bracket, NGK TR7ix, 160 t-stat, Dewitts Radiator, Texas Speed 1 7/8" headers(no cats). M&H drag radials 325/45-17 & M&H 28x4.5" bias skinnies. Tuning by Frost at Performance Autosport in Richmond, VA (804) 358-2505
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Old 03-14-2014, 05:28 PM   #7
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Zo6bryan, how long does it take roughly to change out injectors?.
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Old 03-14-2014, 07:46 PM   #8
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Depends on your mechanical ability and tools available. I used a small grinder to remove the aluminum above the bolt, gives it a machined look when all done. Install can be done in under an hour if everything needed is at your finger tips, plus tuning.
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Old 03-14-2014, 07:56 PM   #9
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Zo6bryan, how long does it take roughly to change out injectors?.
First time it will take at least an hour...maybe 2 just to get the correct tools out and the fuel line disconnected etc. After you do it once, I could do it in 30-45 min now no problem.
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#917 A6. 10.67@126.2 1.53 60' ATI/Lingenfelter balancer (10" ring), stock upper pulley, 90mm TB, ID850s,Rotofab/Lingenfelter intercooler reservoir, Cooler Logic HX, Lingenfelter idler relocation bracket, NGK TR7ix, 160 t-stat, Dewitts Radiator, Texas Speed 1 7/8" headers(no cats). M&H drag radials 325/45-17 & M&H 28x4.5" bias skinnies. Tuning by Frost at Performance Autosport in Richmond, VA (804) 358-2505
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Old 03-14-2014, 08:00 PM   #10
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Zo6bryan, how long does it take roughly to change out injectors?.
I did it in an afternoon. Not really rushing it, but could be done in little over an hour if you are used to working on engines. As I remember the hardest part was getting the fuel rails back in and aligning 4 injectors per bank to slide back in. Compared to other fuel rails in LS engines it is tight to clear the recess in the intake manifold because of the aluminum directly above the injectors. They have to stand straight up as you push them into the holes in the intake. Most other LT1 LS1 LS6 LS2 intake manifolds don't get in the way and the injectors can pull straight up. With the supercharger manifold it's a tight fit.
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Old 03-14-2014, 08:09 PM   #11
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Thank you
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Old 03-14-2014, 08:35 PM   #12
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How were your short term fuel trims at idle when it was pig rich?
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Old 03-14-2014, 08:35 PM   #13
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Nice write up
Btw who has the best price on these injectors ?
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Old 03-14-2014, 08:40 PM   #14
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How were your short term fuel trims at idle when it was pig rich?
They were hitting -25 STFT but there was alot more to it. I got it sorted out. On reset of the PCM it resets the FPCM also and fuel pressure runs at 65 psi at idle(and all conditions) until it relearns. Once it "relearns" fuel pressure at low load is 50 psi and the fuel trims come back into line where they belong.
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Old 03-14-2014, 09:20 PM   #15
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They were hitting -25 STFT but there was alot more to it. I got it sorted out. On reset of the PCM it resets the FPCM also and fuel pressure runs at 65 psi at idle(and all conditions) until it relearns. Once it "relearns" fuel pressure at low load is 50 psi and the fuel trims come back into line where they belong.
So for somebody who's power goals are 600-650 RWHP, are the 65 pound injectors preferred to keep it from running so rich at idle?
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Old 03-14-2014, 09:23 PM   #16
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So for somebody who's power goals are 600-650 RWHP, are the 65 pound injectors preferred to keep it from running so rich at idle?
The ID850's won't run rich at idle. It idles perfectly like stock. Use the data from ID and they run great at low pulse widths.
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Old 03-15-2014, 07:53 AM   #17
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what can the id850's hand in terms of Hp ? how many lbs do they produce?.
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Old 03-15-2014, 11:11 AM   #18
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Question

Hi guys

I have the ported throttle body and the intake from cai and the sct tuner from jeanett. I will install all soon. Need i upgrade the injectors after the install of the ptb and the cai. I will tune the car, thru the sct and ted.

Which difference it will be with the injectors and my mods?


Thanks in advance

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Old 03-17-2014, 04:38 PM   #19
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So now that you have had a few Days with the id850 injectors installed, how do you like them?. I ordered a set of them today myself. I hope all is going well for you.
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Old 03-17-2014, 05:31 PM   #20
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So now that you have had a few Days with the id850 injectors installed, how do you like them?. I ordered a set of them today myself. I hope all is going well for you.


They work great, I've had them in for about 3 weeks, no problem.
My car runs like a beast, says my wife. ( that's what she calls it )
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Old 03-18-2014, 03:13 PM   #21
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Hi guys

I have the ported throttle body and the intake from cai and the sct tuner from jeanett. I will install all soon. Need i upgrade the injectors after the install of the ptb and the cai. I will tune the car, thru the sct and ted.

Which difference it will be with the injectors and my mods?


Thanks in advance

You shouldn't need injectors with only those mods
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Old 03-18-2014, 03:31 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by ZO6 Bryan View Post
Spent this afternoon putting in ID850's. Not a bad install. Ran into a little snag as the bolt that holds the fuel rail down on the front of the blower won't come out without running into the blower hat. Took a little air chisel and remove a tiny amount of aluminum so the bolt could come out. Then painted it with some black touch-up paint. Put the data in from Injector Dynamics, fired it up, and pig rich at idle. So much for being plug-and-play. Had to tune the injector offsets myself anyway. Now it's pretty close. I'll do more logging and tuning tomorrow.
ID850s ARE plug and play, no matter what if you change injectors you have to change your tune.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen12ZL1 View Post
My tuner had a slight problem tuning the idle as well because the ID850s flow so much fuel. At minimum pulse width the injectors still flow like a fire hose. Its fine however a hot start will ocassionally belch some black smoke. It's a small trade off to have safe fueling at higher rpms under boost.
I would find a different tuner. ABSOLUTELY NO reasons to have tuning issues with ID850s, We run ID2000s with stock starting, idling, etc.
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Old 03-18-2014, 03:32 PM   #23
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Injectors are a supporting mod not a power adder.
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