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Old 04-22-2014, 02:16 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Col. Brain View Post
doing an honest assesment of this car - i still believe that they could have sold it for 65k range and made a profit.

Which means they are making about 10k over and above because of what it is.

Whether or not my numbers are right - the new GM is here to make profits on everything. If the Z/28 is selling like hot cakes - they will keep making them. They would be stupid not to
Why wouldn't they? Why would the old gm limit production? That's such a stupid business model to not make something that has high demand.
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Old 04-22-2014, 02:18 PM   #19
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CAFE restricts the amount to build.
How so? If it is up to emission standards why does the government care?
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Old 04-22-2014, 02:22 PM   #20
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Aren't they also limited by CAFE though?
in 2013 Chevy sold 1.9M cars/trucks

in 2009 (i couldnt find a 2013 camaro numbers) sold 62,000 Camaros


So 3% of cars are Camaros
It becomes .03% for just the 500 Z/28s

And if 3000 for 2015 it will be .16% of total production.

I am forgetting how CAFE is calculated now but i think the LS7 in the Camaro will be fine......for now

Plus i didnt think the hammer fell until 2016 on new CAFE regulations
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Old 04-22-2014, 02:25 PM   #21
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F@&k cafe standards
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Old 04-22-2014, 02:25 PM   #22
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How so? If it is up to emission standards why does the government care?
Because there are penalties if GM doesn't meet the Corporate Average Fuel Economy rules. Essentially this won't be much of an issue with the Z/28, since the number of units build will be tiny. GM builds a lot of Cruzes, etc., that offset the lower mileage, but the real issue are things like trucks and SUVs -- the huge number of units sold there make a big impact and are much harder to balance out...
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Old 04-22-2014, 02:26 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Skylane765 View Post
CAFE restricts the amount to build.
to a point but even at 3000 total units i don't think it moves the CAFE needle much


going to reread the CAFE standards before i make an ass of myself (if i already did)
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Old 04-22-2014, 02:52 PM   #24
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... [with a few exceptions, like the Ford GT]...
The Ford GT is an interesting case. They made a lot of them as far as limited production goes, over 4,000. And while the MSRP was $150k, very few sold for under $200k, some of them sold for over $250k.

Today, you can pick them up for $150-$250k based on latest Ebay SOLD prices. Hence, some people could have lost money on them.

So even they aren't necessarily collectible.

I would not be surprised if they go back under MSRP in the future due to the high production numbers. Very few modern cars ever become collectible.
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Old 04-22-2014, 03:16 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Col. Brain View Post
in 2013 Chevy sold 1.9M cars/trucks

in 2009 (i couldnt find a 2013 camaro numbers) sold 62,000 Camaros


So 3% of cars are Camaros
It becomes .03% for just the 500 Z/28s

And if 3000 for 2015 it will be .16% of total production.

I am forgetting how CAFE is calculated now but i think the LS7 in the Camaro will be fine......for now

Plus i didnt think the hammer fell until 2016 on new CAFE regulations
I was just going by memory...IIRC Fbodfather himself stated part of the reason for a low build number or high cost or something was CAFE
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Old 04-22-2014, 03:26 PM   #26
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The Ford GT is an interesting case. They made a lot of them as far as limited production goes, over 4,000. And while the MSRP was $150k, very few sold for under $200k, some of them sold for over $250k.

Today, you can pick them up for $150-$250k based on latest Ebay SOLD prices. Hence, some people could have lost money on them.

So even they aren't necessarily collectible.

I would not be surprised if they go back under MSRP in the future due to the high production numbers. Very few modern cars ever become collectible.
I think more people bought Ford GTs and locked them away than almost any other car I've seen. I realize the Z/28 isn't comparable at half the MSRP (far less than half if inflation-adjusted), and I believe that a much higher percentage of Z/28s will be driven.

Though a lot have folks have speculated that most Z/28s will become garage queens, I disagree. I believe that it will be something closer to 75/25 -- 75% of owners will drive, use, and enjoy their Z/28s, while a quarter of owners will lock them away. How could you own one and resist the temptation to drive it?!?
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Old 04-22-2014, 03:34 PM   #27
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I would agree with the 75% 25%
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Old 04-22-2014, 03:46 PM   #28
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I was just going by memory...IIRC Fbodfather himself stated part of the reason for a low build number or high cost or something was CAFE

Sounds familiar

If trucks and SUVs are counted then I can see why GM would want to keep a limit on LS7s. Trucks/SUVs are their bread and butter.

Now if only they can sell more Volts
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Old 04-22-2014, 03:50 PM   #29
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Classic Example of late model collectibility:

2000 Cobra R - Total Production 300, one year only. MSRP $55k. Very high markup past MSRP. Historically significant. The fastest Mustang built up to that point, good race history. Price climbed for years.

Today?

Low mileage = http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Mustang...US_Cars_Trucks
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Old 04-22-2014, 03:59 PM   #30
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Classic Example of late model collectibility:

2000 Cobra R - Total Production 300, one year only. MSRP $55k. Very high markup past MSRP. Historically significant. The fastest Mustang built up to that point, good race history. Price climbed for years.

Today?

Low mileage = http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Mustang...US_Cars_Trucks
Yep, I seriously doubt any new model car will ever become super collectible. Part of what made some cars so collectible from the 60s is that you could have some super rare options in certain combos. Back when you could option out a car exactly how YOU wanted it. that made for some fairly unique and rare cars
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Old 04-22-2014, 04:15 PM   #31
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...

Now if only they can sell more Volts
They need to lend people a Volt for a week and tell them how to use it right.

The Volt is a hellavu car. Way under-rated by the magazines. Nimble, quick, and comfy for an econobox. It's my favorite car to drive on crowded city streets. Power is instant, and carves like a knife.

What the dealer and mags don't tell you:

Always drive in L range. This is not low gear. It is maximum regeneration. Chop the throttle and it slows like high compression manual trans.

Always drive in Sport Mode. More fun.

3585 miles now, and it's used 7.8 gallons of gas, and used $93 worth of electricity.

BUT... It's not the economy that makes it fun to drive. Can you imagine driving for months and never stopping at a gas station?
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Old 04-22-2014, 05:15 PM   #32
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They need to lend people a Volt for a week and tell them how to use it right.

The Volt is a hellavu car. Way under-rated by the magazines. Nimble, quick, and comfy for an econobox. It's my favorite car to drive on crowded city streets. Power is instant, and carves like a knife.

What the dealer and mags don't tell you:

Always drive in L range. This is not low gear. It is maximum regeneration. Chop the throttle and it slows like high compression manual trans.

Always drive in Sport Mode. More fun.

3585 miles now, and it's used 7.8 gallons of gas, and used $93 worth of electricity.

BUT... It's not the economy that makes it fun to drive. Can you imagine driving for months and never stopping at a gas station?
Wow that is pretty good.
convert that $93.00 into gallons of gas. say 3.50 per gallon and you are getting over 100mpg
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Old 04-23-2014, 11:59 AM   #33
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Very few modern cars ever become collectible.
When was an era when a modern car was collectible during in its modern on-the-market timespan? Being serious here, not trying to be an a$$.

In my experience, only time will tell if a car is truly "collectible". Assumptions can be made but only time will tell.
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Old 04-23-2014, 12:07 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Col. Brain View Post
Sounds familiar

If trucks and SUVs are counted then I can see why GM would want to keep a limit on LS7s. Trucks/SUVs are their bread and butter.

Now if only they can sell more Volts
Throw in a Volt with the purchase of every V8 automobile?

Seriously though, we have to give thanks to my buddy who could have purchased an SS Camaro but given that he had just piled on some more student debt he opted for a Cruise because of cheaper up front and usage costs. So he's helping us out with that CAFE nonsense.

Wish I had the change to add a Z/28 to my garage. Just wasn't willing to give up my current car to get one. Collector's value or not, it will be a historic icon.
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