Comparison Test, by Proxy: 2010 Chevrolet Camaro vs. 2009 Dodge Challenger SRT8

[Emu the Foo]

SO did this guy just think it was unimportant to ttell us bout the gen V motor and all the stuff happening? i think i might want a billet door. and i dont care bout 500+ hp cuz thats prolly a gas guzzler. but would be nice. but i dont want to have to get rid of my car only after a few years. so i hope a nice gen V comes out. 6.2L 450+hp flex fuel maro. but i thought e85 fuel took away frm performance not gave it some

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by gtahvit

I know this is all eeewey goooeeewey emotional ranting. I know cars aren't engineered with this kind of though at the forefront. Feelings don't build cars. I just hope that where the camaro is concerned emotions will build a better car.

I need to make an appointment to see my therapist...

Don't be so sure about the whole 'cars aren't engineered with this kind of thought' bit. Generally speaking, engineers have a strong emotional attachment to their projects. Its their baby. And sometimes this attachment is stronger than others, few get excited to work on washing machines but working on something like the Camaro is completely different. I'm sure that for them, when they heard the initial requirements they were about as shocked as we will be when we see the specs, probably more so. But by the same token, they would have loved the challenge. Its said that the fastest way to get anything done is to tell an engineer its impossible. The harder the boundaries are pushed, the more determined the engnineer gets. Nearly all the engineering is certainly done on the Camaro by now.

Engineers do care about making the best product, about beating the other guy. Its all well and good to meet or exceed your design requirements, but it puts a smile on your face when its agreed that the thing that you made is the best. It is this strive for excelance that results in things like the Corvette ZR-1, the Apollo program, and the F-22. All of those were born out of the desire to be the best, and in their respective ways they were all impossible. You can't build a supercar for 100k! Man will never walk on the moon! Nobody can achieve total air dominance! But it was done. They are all signicantly better than any possible rival.

The same will hold true for the Camaro. Its not on the same scale as the others, but from what we've been hearing it will hold the same position relative to its competitors. And that comes from having people with passion work on it.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Emu the Foo

SO did this guy just think it was unimportant to ttell us bout the gen V motor and all the stuff happening? i think i might want a billet door. and i dont care bout 500+ hp cuz thats prolly a gas guzzler. but would be nice. but i dont want to have to get rid of my car only after a few years. so i hope a nice gen V comes out. 6.2L 450+hp flex fuel maro. but i thought e85 fuel took away frm performance not gave it some

According to some special 'documents', the GenV powerplants aren't going into production untill 2011 (I hope I'm wrong), and E85 adds horsepower, when taken advantage of. (105 Octane...you decide. )

[GTAHVIT]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Don't be so sure about the whole 'cars aren't engineered with this kind of thought' bit. Generally speaking, engineers have a strong emotional attachment to their projects. Its their baby. And sometimes this attachment is stronger than others, few get excited to work on washing machines but working on something like the Camaro is completely different. I'm sure that for them, when they heard the initial requirements they were about as shocked as we will be when we see the specs, probably more so. But by the same token, they would have loved the challenge. Its said that the fastest way to get anything done is to tell an engineer its impossible. The harder the boundaries are pushed, the more determined the engnineer gets. Nearly all the engineering is certainly done on the Camaro by now.

Engineers do care about making the best product, about beating the other guy. Its all well and good to meet or exceed your design requirements, but it puts a smile on your face when its agreed that the thing that you made is the best. It is this strive for excelance that results in things like the Corvette ZR-1, the Apollo program, and the F-22. All of those were born out of the desire to be the best, and in their respective ways they were all impossible. You can't build a supercar for 100k! Man will never walk on the moon! Nobody can achieve total air dominance! But it was done. They are all signicantly better than any possible rival.

The same will hold true for the Camaro. Its not on the same scale as the others, but from what we've been hearing it will hold the same position relative to its competitors. And that comes from having people with passion work on it.

My comments aren't meant to insinuate that the engineers themselves are keeping the camaro or any other project from being the best it can be. Trust me, I'd rather have an engineer have complete control of what the end result of the camaro will be. Because they will give us a NASCAR with a CTS-V interior. My 'cars aren't engineered with this kind of thought' bit was directed at the bigger picture that at some point you have to consider all the constraints that go into designing, engineering, building and selling a new car. I didn't make that clear, I'm sorry. If the final product were purely based on feelings and emotional commitment, we'd all love it but it might not be a marketable product in the end. The real point of my previous post was to illustrate what I thought the Camaro should be based on everyone's emotional commitment to it. That's all...

Man, I haven't used the words 'feelings' and 'emotions' this much in years. My wife is pregnant and I think her emotional state is rubbing off on me.... Sorry for all the touchy feely...

[Emu the Foo]

well i guess i could live with a fossil fuel camaro till something comes out better. and are you saying e85 is equal to 105 octane or that the 15% they put in is 105 octane???

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Emu the Foo

well i guess i could live with a fossil fuel camaro till something comes out better. and are you saying e85 is equal to 105 octane or that the 15% they put in is 105 octane???

E85 fuel is the equivlant to gasoline with a ~103-105 Octane rating.

[Emu the Foo]

gotcha

[juSStin4171]

LS1, LS6, LS2, LS7,LS3, LS9...

If I remember right, good ol' Scott told us "You haven't seen anything yet!"

The Camaro concept has been the most successful concept car in my existance. It is going to prove to be a substantially profitable vehicle for GM. In 1969, the ZL1 (as limited as it was) was faster then the Corvette. Did sales fall for the Vette because of it. Nay. What would be the outcome if the General placed an EQUIVALENT power plant in the Camaro. It's still going to be heavier, cheaper (it better be) and in a completely different "class" then the Vette. No toes to step on from where I see it. If you ask me, I say Chevy has another car coming that COULD be compared to cars that cost 3 and 4 times as much. GO FOR IT!

[COPO_Chevy]

Originally Posted by juSStin4171

LS1, LS6, LS2, LS7,LS3, LS9...

If I remember right, good ol' Scott told us "You haven't seen anything yet!"

The Camaro concept has been the most successful concept car in my existance. It is going to prove to be a substantially profitable vehicle for GM. In 1969, the ZL1 (as limited as it was) was faster then the Corvette. Did sales fall for the Vette because of it. Nay. What would be the outcome if the General placed an EQUIVALENT power plant in the Camaro. It's still going to be heavier, cheaper (it better be) and in a completely different "class" then the Vette. No toes to step on from where I see it. If you ask me, I say Chevy has another car coming that COULD be compared to cars that cost 3 and 4 times as much. GO FOR IT!

exactly however...the only vette the mighty zl1 couldnt beat was the other mighty... zl1 corvette ...however only 2 were made so it was safe to say the zl1 camaro was faster

[JustinZS]

Curious have any mags tested the Challenger SRT8 for official performance times yet??

Also anyone know its weight?

[AirGoya]

Originally Posted by JustinZS

Curious have any mags tested the Challenger SRT8 for official performance times yet??

Also anyone know its weight?

The srt-8 weighs in at 4140 pounds. 0-60 times are around 5.2 or 5.3 even though Dodge said the got 4.9.
And a quarter-mile run of 13.6 seconds at 105.8 mph.

[drummerstevey]

here's an article i just found on edmunds.....http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=124937

If you're having trouble accepting our conclusion that the 2010 Chevy Camaro wins a comparison test simply because we haven't "tested" them, then perhaps it would help if you imagine, as we are right now, that we're hammering the two cars at our double-top-secret location where all the roads are twisty, all the cops have wooden legs and a man and his muscle cars may lay rubber with total impunity. This would be right next to the beer springs.

Camaro wins!! (although they haven't tested either yet)

[Congoman775]

ha yea i saw that a few months ago.

cant wait for the real one.

[Fandango]

Hmmm, Think I read this. But thank you.