05-07-2011, 05:06 PM | #57 |
Drives: 2018 LS Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: poconos,pa
Posts: 187
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Hey, the new Mustangs a great car. But bottom line - park em both in a parking lot, and nobody notices the Mustang.
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05-08-2011, 12:45 AM | #58 |
Drives: 2011 RS/SS Camaro M6 Synergy Green Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Powell Wy
Posts: 138
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3 pages of excuses of why the Mustang is getting beat in Sales,um..... My guess is because a few thousand people thought the Camaro is a nicer car. Seems pretty simple to Me and only took one paragraph.
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05-08-2011, 04:11 AM | #59 |
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395,000 pony cars have been sold since April 2009... 222,000 of those sale were not Camaros and is far more than the majority. 55% of new car buyers chose to buy the competitions offerings and putting them side buy side in a parking lot (almost as they were sold on the lot) would see almost a 50/50 split between the two... add in the Challenger and the numbers would be smaller. That is until the Mustang III comes out and then Ford will reclaim a majority of the market again and attract the most attention... This is natural for a new product and claiming 45% of the market is really good... it just isn't permanent...
Edit: The ZL1 will not make a very big dent in the sales. By the time the ZL1 is released the sales numbers of the Camaro will be back down to the 5000-6000 average if not lower. The ZL1 will increase the monthly sales by 5-10%.... 10% is being generous and assumes that there will be close to 10,000 2012 ZL1's produced over a 6 month period. I believe that there will only be about 3000-5000 2012 ZL1's produced. Those 3000-4000 units would be taken directly from the regular production numbers and could easily be managed in 6 months without affecting regular production. |
05-08-2011, 07:40 AM | #60 | |
Say "when"...
Drives: 11 2LT Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Venice, FL
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05-08-2011, 08:51 AM | #61 | |
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I will argue that the Camaro is a better car hands down and I'm sure that will upset some people. It depends on what makes the car a better car... To some it would be sales volume and the volumes of sales for the Mustang happened way before the Camaro was even thought of. Some would say that performance is primarily the key factor when comparing cars. Then you have cost and quality and as subjective as looks are, that is another factor in which cars are said to be "better". I personally give the Mustang the performance edge, on average the Mustang is about $1500 dollars cheaper, each of the cars have their quality issues and the 5th Gen didn't win me over in the looks department when I tested one in 2009. So, I will lean to sales to determine if it is "better". If the Camaro wasn't outselling the Mustang right now it would be a very bad situation. The Camaro is only 2 years old and sales actually peaked last spring for the coupe and then declined almost 50% in the fall and winter. With the introduction of the convertible, sales returned back to the spring 2010 sales numbers but sure enough, the numbers will return back to normal late summer and on into 2012. Right now, the brand new Camaro convertible is making up about 50% of sales and was strategically released to sustain sales... if it wasn't for the strategic release of the convertible.. the Mustang may have very well been the sales leader this month. Typically, convertible's are not a very big seller. Ford only sold 15,703 2011 Mustang's combined, this includes the 9,645 V6's, the 5,126 5.0 GT's and the 932 GT500's. The Mustang convertible initially accounted for almost 30% of Mustang's sold in 2005. At that time, 1 out of every 2 sports coupes/sports cars sold in the US was a Mustang. Now, the Mustang convertible is down to about 21% production volume... another example of the more successful a product sales in the beginning, the less it will sell tomorrow... http://www.carmemories.com/cgi-bin/v...erience_id=957 240,000 people chose not to buy a Mustang and elected to buy another pony car since April 2009... but, almost 800,000 people have already purchased a S197 new since 2005. Most of those 800,000 Mustang's were undoubtedly sold by their original owners and perhaps another percentage were sold again... making the S197 Mustang pretty circulated automobile. It's still pretty early to tell but it is safe to assume that the 5th Gen Camaro will never reach the sales volume that the S197 Mustang did. Even if GM decided to push the 5th gen Camaro out to 2017, at the rate of current sales, the 5th gen Camaro will not sell even half of what the S197 did. Ford will be capitalizing from the S197 sales for another decade in the aftermarket. This is something GM has to consider when the Alpha steps on deck, should they prematurely end the life of the 5th gen Camaro just to chase the Mustang III? or should they tough it out and build an aftermarket around the LS3/L99? Regardless, sales are a factor when determining superiority. Right now, the Camaro and Mustang are about 54/46 in sales since the Camaro came back April 2009. Even though there were 675,000 Mustangs on the streets when the first Camaro was sold, I don't think it is fair to ignore those sales. Every statistic is centered around the Camaro's release date and has a negative effect on the Mustang and Challengers numbers. I don't think the competition should be made to look like fools because the Camaro couldn't stay in production... Is it fair that the Camaro wasn't around between 2005 and 2009? No... but I sure the hell are not going to pat them on the back for it... |
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05-08-2011, 10:26 AM | #62 | |||
Drives: 2010 SS Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: So Cal
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This is a debate of opinions since there are not figures on why people picked one over the other. Quote:
Your assumptions are that the Market will widen with the eco-4 cyl., that people that currently drive Prius' will say "hey... i want a mustang because it gets the same gas milage." I don't think that is true. These cars are symbols that Eco people hate, no matter how eco-friendly you make it. That will never change, and I just don't see the market for these cars growing. There are too many other options out there if Fuel Efficiency is your concern. "The day they make a hybrid Camaro is the day Fun died!" Again, more a debate of opinion since we are talking about the future which isn't here yet. Quote:
As far as the Z28... no one said it isn't still in the works. Probably on the next platform, when they change... since the Z28 is the 'track' Camaro it will be lighter then and better for the Z28 moniker. The ZL1 answered the call for a GT500 challenger, that was also a call from the customers. It has always been painful to see a GT500 blow away any Camaro. It will not enhance sales that much as you point out... so it has to be for the enthusiasts, period (just as the GT500 is). I like that they didn't call the ZL1 a Z28... it just wouldn't have been right. This debate of opinions could go on forever, and has. You've got a pretty sharp Mustang, I've got a sexy Camaro. I don't think either will force the other out (again) if both companies continue to put in their heart and soul into it as they are currently!
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05-08-2011, 02:08 PM | #63 | |||||
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Incentives are coming soon for the Camaro. The R&D dollars and initial cost of production are beginning to be covered by sales profits. It's no secret that there are still 2010 Camaro's left on the lots and there is an up coming opportunity to offer incentives on those models. Production of the new 2012 Camaro's will start in mid-July, when the order banks open in a month or so, the Camaro will hit a small sales slump unless they offer incentives on the unsold stock. The Camaro's cost of production should have decreased by now and for the most part, factory incentives are a simple MSRP adjustment to keep sales rolling. When profits are made and the product is in the green and naturally, the cost of production begins to decrease then a factory cash back bonus isn't far off. Within a month or so is the perfect opportunity to get those incentive out there to stabilize sales while customers wait for the new 2012 (about a 3-5 month wait). GM used a factory incentive on the Camaro in January and February 2011 because of the alarming sales drop in the months prior but ended it in March. It's pretty intelligent if you think about it, you would be surprised how many people would buy a 2010 Camaro in 2011 when the right amount of incentives are attached... just as long as the dealers play along. Advertising is important, but if GM can get away with not spending the money to do big advertisements then why waste the money. They did pitch out the money for the Superbowl and there are a lot of internet and magazine ads.. just not many TV spots. Quote:
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Again, thanks for the post.. It gave me a lot to think about.... and I love your SS's color, I've always been a sucker for any gun metal color. My Kimber 1911 Stainless II is that color... love it... Last edited by thePill; 05-08-2011 at 04:00 PM. |
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