Maybe we can agree on this... - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

mkorgan · 06-20-2013, 08:49 PM

So, I have had some extra time today to catch up on my forum reading and post a couple things but as I read I kind of came upon an epiphany of sorts which settles the Z/28 -vs- the ZL1 argument, at least in my mind.

The way I see it, the ZL1 paved the way for the Z/28 and liberated GM from the typical confines of a mass production muscle car so that they could focus on a track purposed car without apology. How?? Well here is my thoughts.

Think about what the ZL1 does for GM. It gives them a response to the GT500, a step up from the SS, with all the creature comforts that the normal weekend cruiser is looking for. It stays true to the ZL1 heritage in that it is the highest HP Camaro of its generation AND it allows them to compete with Porsche, Vette, and other high end performance cars while still giving you a great radio, 4 true seats (yeah, I know the back ones are small), and one hell of a fun engine to tune to your hearts desire.

With the ZL1 in the market, GM is now free to engineer a TRUE, NO COMPRPOMISE track car that it can deliver to the market with absolutely ZERO apologizes. For those that say they want high end performance but need daily drivability, GM does not have to say "sorry, the best we got is the SS". Nope, they can say "The ZL1 is just for you.". The ZL1 allows GM to build a purpose built Camaro in the Z/28 while not alienating us "posers" who are not total track rats but want a world class performing Camaro.

I just think we need to get off the "-vs-" discussion and move on to appreciating what each car does for the other. The ZL1 allow the Z/28 to be exactly what track rats want and the Z/28 allows GM to build the ZL1 with a fantastic performance and comfort for the masses without compromising the Z/28 heritage.

We should appreciate what one car allows the other car to be. Just my thoughts. And yes, I probably have too much time on my hands today but back to work tomorrow.

OldScoolCamaro · 06-20-2013, 09:37 PM

...well Ford did it first. No problem. WE have been asking for a lighter track oriented LS7 based Camaro for some time. Research the Z28 thread for details on that commentary which is extensive. So, since gutting a C5 Camaro from anything structural is not feasible, we have a compromise of subtraction throught addition in technology, both in new ways and old, removal of some non essential items, power plant weight lessing, with an infusion of new trick technology to enhance performance. A little new, a little old, a little borrowed, a little blue...and to that end all bets are off with the advent of the new Mustang and the Camaro shortly thereafter. It's a sure bet the Pony Wars will continue.

2cnd chance · 06-20-2013, 09:47 PM

I don't get why it's so difficult for some to understand they are apples and oranges, appealing to differing customer bases.

LOWDOWN · 06-20-2013, 09:51 PM

One's a Macintosh...and one's a Delicious...and I'll let others fight for which is which.

cvp33 · 06-20-2013, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LOWDOWN

One's a Macintosh...and one's a Delicious...and I'll let others fight for which is which.

Really a bad analogy....

Ones a Golden Delicious and the other is a Valencia. (Apple vs. orange)

mkorgan · 06-20-2013, 10:08 PM

I think you are missing my point. Having two cars allows them to both hit the bull's-eye in there target markets rather than having one car that is close in both but not perfect for either. Neither car compromises because they have the other to cater to what it may not do. You want a weekend track car that can be driven comfortably during the week...you got it. You want a street legal track car that can be driven during the week but may not be as comfortable...you got it. Having both allows neither to compromise. I really think it is just that simple.

2cnd chance · 06-20-2013, 10:23 PM

Without repeating myself...oh what the..

"I don't get why it's so difficult for some to understand they are apples and oranges, appealing to differing customer bases."

OldScoolCamaro · 06-20-2013, 10:31 PM

...and so it goes...

cvp33 · 06-20-2013, 10:36 PM

Apple cobbler with Orange Juice.....God that tastes awful. No wonder people can't agree.

LOWDOWN · 06-21-2013, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cvp33

Really a bad analogy....

Ones a Golden Delicious and the other is a Valencia. (Apple vs. orange)

A Camaro is a Camaro is a Camaro...whether you're in Valencia or Madrid...

mk...

Mister Will · 06-21-2013, 05:11 PM

The one consistant with auto buffs, they will always argue that their car is better than yours.

Mgizzle · 06-21-2013, 05:56 PM

How awesome that chevy built such sick cars and options to meet everyones demands. We can all agree they are both amazing both on street and track.

Anyhow, everyone knows the 1LE is best.

06-20-2013, 08:49 PM	#1
mkorgan Drives: 1970-1/2 Z-28, 2017 ZL1 Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Sanford, Fl Posts: 973	Maybe we can agree on this... So, I have had some extra time today to catch up on my forum reading and post a couple things but as I read I kind of came upon an epiphany of sorts which settles the Z/28 -vs- the ZL1 argument, at least in my mind. The way I see it, the ZL1 paved the way for the Z/28 and liberated GM from the typical confines of a mass production muscle car so that they could focus on a track purposed car without apology. How?? Well here is my thoughts. Think about what the ZL1 does for GM. It gives them a response to the GT500, a step up from the SS, with all the creature comforts that the normal weekend cruiser is looking for. It stays true to the ZL1 heritage in that it is the highest HP Camaro of its generation AND it allows them to compete with Porsche, Vette, and other high end performance cars while still giving you a great radio, 4 true seats (yeah, I know the back ones are small), and one hell of a fun engine to tune to your hearts desire. With the ZL1 in the market, GM is now free to engineer a TRUE, NO COMPRPOMISE track car that it can deliver to the market with absolutely ZERO apologizes. For those that say they want high end performance but need daily drivability, GM does not have to say "sorry, the best we got is the SS". Nope, they can say "The ZL1 is just for you.". The ZL1 allows GM to build a purpose built Camaro in the Z/28 while not alienating us "posers" who are not total track rats but want a world class performing Camaro. I just think we need to get off the "-vs-" discussion and move on to appreciating what each car does for the other. The ZL1 allow the Z/28 to be exactly what track rats want and the Z/28 allows GM to build the ZL1 with a fantastic performance and comfort for the masses without compromising the Z/28 heritage. We should appreciate what one car allows the other car to be. Just my thoughts. And yes, I probably have too much time on my hands today but back to work tomorrow.

06-20-2013, 09:37 PM	#2
OldScoolCamaro Drives: Camaro's, always have, always will. Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Home of the brave Posts: 4,851	...well Ford did it first. No problem. WE have been asking for a lighter track oriented LS7 based Camaro for some time. Research the Z28 thread for details on that commentary which is extensive. So, since gutting a C5 Camaro from anything structural is not feasible, we have a compromise of subtraction throught addition in technology, both in new ways and old, removal of some non essential items, power plant weight lessing, with an infusion of new trick technology to enhance performance. A little new, a little old, a little borrowed, a little blue...and to that end all bets are off with the advent of the new Mustang and the Camaro shortly thereafter. It's a sure bet the Pony Wars will continue. __________________ In Scott We Trust...all others must show proof.

06-20-2013, 09:47 PM	#3
2cnd chance Too Many Great Choices Drives: Grand Sport/Z07 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: A Mountain Road Posts: 7,454	I don't get why it's so difficult for some to understand they are apples and oranges, appealing to differing customer bases. __________________

06-20-2013, 10:23 PM	#7
2cnd chance Too Many Great Choices Drives: Grand Sport/Z07 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: A Mountain Road Posts: 7,454	Without repeating myself...oh what the.. "I don't get why it's so difficult for some to understand they are apples and oranges, appealing to differing customer bases." __________________

06-20-2013, 10:31 PM	#8
OldScoolCamaro Drives: Camaro's, always have, always will. Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Home of the brave Posts: 4,851	...and so it goes... __________________ In Scott We Trust...all others must show proof.

06-20-2013, 09:51 PM	#4
LOWDOWN Downright Upright Drives: Daily Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Cruisin'... Posts: 4,145	One's a Macintosh...and one's a Delicious...and I'll let others fight for which is which.

06-20-2013, 10:08 PM	#6
mkorgan Drives: 1970-1/2 Z-28, 2017 ZL1 Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Sanford, Fl Posts: 973	I think you are missing my point. Having two cars allows them to both hit the bull's-eye in there target markets rather than having one car that is close in both but not perfect for either. Neither car compromises because they have the other to cater to what it may not do. You want a weekend track car that can be driven comfortably during the week...you got it. You want a street legal track car that can be driven during the week but may not be as comfortable...you got it. Having both allows neither to compromise. I really think it is just that simple.

06-20-2013, 10:36 PM	#9
cvp33 America FVCK Yeah! Drives: 2021 ZL1 1LE A10 Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Florence, SC Posts: 1,388	Apple cobbler with Orange Juice.....God that tastes awful. No wonder people can't agree. __________________ 1997 Z28 Anniversary Edition *SOLD* 2004 GTO *ORDER CANCELLED* 2004 CTS-V *SOLD* 2005 CTS-V *SOLD* 2006 300C SRT-8 *SOLD* 2006 300C SRT-8 *SOLD* 2010 CTS-V *SOLD* 2012 CTS-V coupe *SOLD* 2013 ZL1 vert *SOLD* 2016 Callaway Z06 *SOLD* 2019 Z06 *SOLD* "I lived my life by one motto.......mottos are for losers" cvp33

06-21-2013, 05:11 PM	#11
Mister Will Drives: 2021 Camaro ZL1 A10 Join Date: May 2013 Location: San Diego, CA. Posts: 457	The one consistant with auto buffs, they will always argue that their car is better than yours.

06-21-2013, 05:56 PM	#12
Mgizzle Drives: 2013 Camaro 1LE 1SS Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Detroit Posts: 1,252	How awesome that chevy built such sick cars and options to meet everyones demands. We can all agree they are both amazing both on street and track. Anyhow, everyone knows the 1LE is best. __________________ I work for General Motors and am not an official spokes person for General Motors. My views and opinions are my own and not those of General Motors.