CTS-V spares as front runners on GINGER

[SUX2BU]

11/05/11 Ginger gets some 18x4 CTS spares to use as skinnies.

I wasn't really planning on getting skinnies for the track but I ran across a set of wheels that I thought would fit for relatively cheap. They didn't, but since I had already bought them I decided to make them work with a little extra work. I did not want to simple run a spacer (not very safe especially for racing) and I also didn't want to run a huge adapter (didn't want to spend all this money to reduce the rotational mass and then add a heavy spacer with extra studs and lugs. I took a TON of measurements of everything involved and calculated that I needed 11mm of extra room to make the wheel fit and have adequate clearance for the brakes. Like I said earlier I did NOT want to run a regular spacer, I would only run a spacer that was hub centric on BOTH sides. I searched and searched but no one had what I needed. A couple companies would make custom hub centric spacers for me but they wanted an arm and a leg. Then I found a pair of 12mm hub centric spacers on Ebay for cheap, BUT they were 5x114.3mm bolt pattern and 67.1mm hubs. As you know our cars are 5x120mm bolt pattern and 66.9mm hubs. This wasn't the first time I had to make stuff fit so I ordered them and just figured I would wallow out the holes a bit (the important part is that they were hub centric inside/out and 67.1mm was VERY close to 66.9mm, .2mm is less than .008").

I also ordered longer studs to make up for the spacer I was going to add. There are a few choices for longer studs but the most affordable by far were replacement truck studs. They are exactly like ours except they are 7 mm longer. The spacer I was ordered was 12mm so I was giving up 5mm of threads going with this set up. It was going to be close on if I had enough threads to be safe. I calculated that I would have 7 full thread turns. Some places on line said the minimum was 6 turns and others said 9 turns, so this is where you have to make a judgement call. I actually ended up with about 7 1/2 turns, but I'll say 7 just to be safe.

Since the spacer was 12 mm thick and the hub "hat" was 11.53mm tall I knew the spacer was not going to sit flush. My remedy was to bevel the edge of the hub just enough for the spacer to fully seat on the rotor hat. I knocked out my studs and put in my longer ones. I had to grind a little notch in the aluminum part of the knuckle to be able to slide the longer studs in without having to remove the whole wheel bearing hub assembly. Since I am only getting 7 turns on the lugs I went ahead and used my stock GM wheel lugs from my Escalade for a little added safety.

When it was all said and done I think it came out pretty good. I lost ANOTHER 11.1 lbs off of each front wheels from my already VERY light street set up (44.4 lb 18x8.4 Forgestar F14 & 245/45 18 and 33.3 lb CTS 18x4 spare with M&H 185/50 18). If you are running stock 20" wheels you will lose almost 29 lbs off of each front wheel, that's a total loss of almost 58 lbs! The wheels are about 16.5 lbs each and the tires are about 16.8 lbs.

One thing you must also be aware of is that these tires are very short. my car is already VERY low because of my lowering springs and lightweight 18" Forgestar F14s. I'm sitting at about 2.5" lower than a stock SS. With these front runners I am another .6" lower up front. That's OVER 3" lower on the front of my car, so you have to be very careful when you drive on these. Since my car is already very low I'm already used to scanning the road when I drive to see what I have to avoid. I took some measurements and my front quarter fairs "mud flaps" were about 1.75" off the ground and my header flanges were even lower than that, about 1 5/8" off the ground. Also, these tires are made for a 5" wheel. These CTS wheels are only 4" wide, the rim lips are very tall and so are the bead shoulders. The tires were a HUGE pain in the ass to seat. I had to go to a specialty race tire shop to get them mounted and even he struggled a bit.

Finally, the last little thing about this set up I like is that one of these front runners can also double as a spare! Now, it doesn't fit perfectly in the spare tire well in the trunk. You can't actually put the flat cover over it, but you can put the carpeting back over and it's not that noticeable. I'm not going to drive around with this in my trunk all the time, but I will throw it in there when I go on road trips.

I looked up the part number for the stock length studs and its Dorman 610-434 (http://www.dormanproducts.com/p-15986-610-434.aspx). They are 57.93mm long. The 610-428 (http://www.dormanproducts.com/p-8116-610-428.aspx) are 65.4mm long.

Total cost of today's mods: $561.97
two CTS 18x4 wheels: $180.00
two M&H 185/50 18 radials: $327.08
Dorman 610-428 longer truck studs: $14.90
hub centric spacers: $39.99

[Camarowguy]

That's awesome !!!

[Eric Baker]

Sweet. Nice mod.

[Bad70supreme]

Awesome, were do I get those wheels! They look like weld rts wheels almost!

[SUX2BU]

Originally Posted by Bad70supreme

Awesome, were do I get those wheels! They look like weld rts wheels almost!

They are hard to come by. I bought then off a member here for $180 shipped, but he got them from a wholesale place for $120 shipped. I called them and they were already sold out of them.

I have a picture of the part number I will part when I get home.

[J-Rod6410]

Is there a taller tire available? You have a link for the spacers?


Thanks,
J-Rod.

[Speed Depot]

Originally Posted by SUX2BU

11/05/11 Ginger gets some 18x4 CTS-V spares to use as skinnies.

I wasn't really planning on getting skinnies for the track but I ran across a set of wheels that I thought would fit for relatively cheap. They didn't, but since I had already bought them I decided to make them work with a little extra work. I did not want to simple run a spacer (not very safe especially for racing) and I also didn't want to run a huge adapter (didn't want to spend all this money to reduce the rotational mass and then add a heavy spacer with extra studs and lugs. I took a TON of measurements of everything involved and calculated that I needed 11mm of extra room to make the wheel fit and have adequate clearance for the brakes. Like I said earlier I did NOT want to run a regular spacer, I would only run a spacer that was hub centric on BOTH sides. I searched and searched but no one had what I needed. A couple companies would make custom hub centric spacers for me but they wanted an arm and a leg. Then I found a pair of 12mm hub centric spacers on Ebay for cheap, BUT they were 5x114.3mm bolt pattern and 67.1mm hubs. As you know our cars are 5x120mm bolt pattern and 66.9mm hubs. This wasn't the first time I had to make stuff fit so I ordered them and just figured I would wallow out the holes a bit (the important part is that they were hub centric inside/out and 67.1mm was VERY close to 66.9mm, .2mm is less than .008").

I also ordered longer studs to make up for the spacer I was going to add. There are a few choices for longer studs but the most affordable by far were replacement truck studs. They are exactly like ours except they are 7 mm longer. The spacer I was ordered was 12mm so I was giving up 5mm of threads going with this set up. It was going to be close on if I had enough threads to be safe. I calculated that I would have 7 full thread turns. Some places on line said the minimum was 6 turns and others said 9 turns, so this is where you have to make a judgement call. I actually ended up with about 7 1/2 turns, but I'll say 7 just to be safe.

Since the spacer was 12 mm thick and the hub "hat" was 11.53mm tall I knew the spacer was not going to sit flush. My remedy was to bevel the edge of the hub just enough for the spacer to fully seat on the rotor hat. I knocked out my studs and put in my longer ones. I had to grind a little notch in the aluminum part of the knuckle to be able to slide the longer studs in without having to remove the whole wheel bearing hub assembly. Since I am only getting 7 turns on the lugs I went ahead and used my stock GM wheel lugs from my Escalade for a little added safety.

When it was all said and done I think it came out pretty good. I lost ANOTHER 10 lbs off of each front wheels from my already VERY light street set up (44.4 lb 18x8.4 Forgestar F14 & 245/45 18 and 34.4 lb CTS-V 18x4 spare with M&H 185/50 18). If you are running stock 20" wheels you will lose almost 28 lbs off of each front wheel, that's a total loss of almost 56 lbs!

One thing you must also be aware of is that these tires are very short. my car is already VERY low because of my lowering springs and lightweight 18" Forgestar F14s. I'm sitting at about 2.5" lower than a stock SS. With these front runners I am another .6" lower up front. That's OVER 3" lower on the front of my car, so you have to be very careful when you drive on these. Since my car is already very low I'm already used to scanning the road when I drive to see what I have to avoid. I took some measurements and my front quarter fairs "mud flaps" were about 1.75" off the ground and my header flanges were even lower than that, about 1 5/8" off the ground. Also, these tires are made for a 5" wheel. These CTS-V wheels are only 4" wide, the rim lips are very tall and so are the bead shoulders. The tires were a HUGE pain in the ass to seat. I had to go to a specialty race tire shop to get them mounted and even he struggled a bit.

Finally, the last little thing about this set up I like is that one of these front runners can also double as a spare! Now, it doesn't fit perfectly in the spare tire well in the trunk. You can't actually put the flat cover over it, but you can put the carpeting back over and it's not that noticeable. I'm not going to drive around with this in my trunk all the time, but I will throw it in there when I go on road trips.

Total cost of today's mods: $561.97
two CTS-V 18x4 wheels: $180.00
two M&H 185/50 18 radials: $327.08
longer truck studs: $14.90
hub centric spacers: $39.99




Pics are here: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=104

Very nice set-up

[SUX2BU]

Originally Posted by jrrod6410

Is there a taller tire available? You have a link for the spacers?


Thanks,
J-Rod.

I don't know, a taller tire would be heavier and my whole point for doing this was to lose as much weight as possible.

Originally Posted by jrrod6410

Is there a taller tire available? You have a link for the spacers?


Thanks,
J-Rod.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/330626701168...84.m1423.l2649



Attached is the wheel's part number.

[SUX2BU]

A small kink in my plans was when I tried to put my F14's back on. The studs were actually too long for my short black lugs. I was just going to cut off the non threaded excess, but I decided to instead just run the F14s with the 12mm spacer. The front wheels now sit out flush with the fender and it looks PERFECT! Exactly how I wanted it to look.

[Cam 427]

Nice fit. As for the truck studs, what make and model? Thanks

[SUX2BU]

Originally Posted by Cam 427

Nice fit. As for the truck studs, what make and model? Thanks

I used my 2003 Cadillac ESV, but they come on almost all trucks. You can buy the GM studs that are part number 11588810, but they were too pricey for me so I got the Dorman 610-428 replacement studs.

[SUX2BU]

There was some confusion on the wheel studs so I added the links. You are supposed to measure the length from the base of the shoulder, not the whole stud.

I looked up the part number for the stock length studs and its Dorman 610-434 (http://www.dormanproducts.com/p-15986-610-434.aspx). They are 57.93mm long. The 610-428 (http://www.dormanproducts.com/p-8116-610-428.aspx) are 65.4mm long.

[Cam 427]

Originally Posted by SUX2BU

I used my 2003 Cadillac ESV, but they come on almost all trucks. You can buy the GM studs that are part number 11588810, but they were too pricey for me so I got the Dorman 610-428 replacement studs.

Thanks for the info.

[SUX2BU]

Just a bump since I have gotten a few questions on my skinnies in the last couple days.