02-12-2010, 05:17 PM | #1 |
Drives: '10 LT RS A6 & '04 Acura RSX Type S Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,529
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Trifecta Tune Review.
Well, unlike these other two gentleman, I have not had such a good experience with Vince. True, the tune does help drivability and the tranny does hit harder. But, unlike the other posters here, I have not had the customer service that one would expect as A PAYING CUSTOMER!
Since Vince's return, I've sent numerous E-mails to him with absolutely NO response! I believe I pissed him off by announcing the tune was not ready for release when both Scrming and my self posted little or no results from the tune. As far as I'm concerned, I'm going to find another tuner to work with!
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02-14-2010, 12:17 PM | #2 | |
Drives: '10 LT RS A6 & '04 Acura RSX Type S Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,529
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Quote:
We ( the membership) see claims for new products all the time and it is up to us to test and evaluate these claims. I was providing, what I felt at the time was, a service to the members here by putting the claims to the test. What has surfaced since is, what I believe to be, the true colors of the people involved with this product.
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02-14-2010, 02:31 PM | #3 | |
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So Vince is evil, and it's his diabolical scheme to fleece an entire community with faulty product and unsubstantiated claims...? The only contribution you've made to this product are complaints, and you're complaining about the very caveat that was explained to you before testing began. You're also the only one complaining... We'll have definitive numbers on the 24th. We're testing baseline (untuned), headers (untuned), and headers (tuned). Our tester is currently fitted with JBA shorties/no tune, which should give us solid data for comparison. I'll have results posted that evening. - Nate |
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02-14-2010, 02:54 PM | #4 | |
Drives: '10 LT RS A6 & '04 Acura RSX Type S Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,529
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Quote:
You know, I could be wrong but I think I've seen this business plan before. You know the one where a company rushes a product to market with inflated claims. They know it will sell like hotcakes because there is no other competition (well except for Mac and Unix) then fix the problems latter. Well, I for one am not willing to wait for "Service Pack 2" to have a product deliver what was promised!
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02-14-2010, 03:49 PM | #5 |
You took these risks knowingly...that's how testing works. Slandering everyone involved doesn't change the fact there is nothing wrong with this product. We're dealing with an engine that has been developed to the very edge of its capabilities. If the engine is already at optimum tuning before we try to modify it, there won't be any gains. We’ve proven the ability to modify fuel ratios, ignition timing curves, cam timing profiles, etc. – all the pieces needed for performance-tuning.
- Nate |
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02-14-2010, 04:10 PM | #6 | |
Drives: '10 LT RS A6 & '04 Acura RSX Type S Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,529
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Quote:
I have never stated that this product "does not work". My statement 4 weeks ago was for the membership as an advisory to give process time to "mature" before committing to a purchase that , ultimately, might not yield the claimed results. And, I was "on board" with this process up to the point where you got involved and I had no further responses from Vince. As a paying customer, I have a right to get what I paid for and I don't feel that I did. As to your claims of slander... I have stated my opinions on the matter and, the last time I checked, we still live in America so I am entitled to them. So, I'm done with this discussion and, in my best Forest Gump impression "That's all I have to say about that!"
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02-14-2010, 05:43 PM | #7 | |
Drives: '10 LT RS A6 & '04 Acura RSX Type S Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,529
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Quote:
If you really want to "prove" the performance gains, pick someone in "neutral" territory who has an Airaid CAI installed and give him the tuning service. Let him pick a dyno and get baselines. then tune the car. After he drives the car for a week, go back to the same dyno and get the numbers... and, let's be sure the hood is closed on both sets of pulls.!
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02-14-2010, 06:29 PM | #8 |
Firstly, my tester is participating 100% free-of-charge. I don't agree with how the initial testing was conducted, but what's done is done. There are good reasons to use private owners for testing, and good reasons not to. It depends entirely on what you intend to accomplish. And if you do accept a private owner for testing, you have to eat the costs - it's just good business.
Secondly, the only remaining issues are tuning for forced inducted applications where there is a significant difference between reported MAF and what the PCM calculates should be entering the engine based on normally aspirated conditions. There are no other issues. If you're stock, don't waste your money. If you're modded, you will not realize the full potential of those modifications without tuning. Lastly, everyone knew the risks going in. They accepted these risks. What's silly is later complaining about the risks should they ever surface. However, you do raise a good point about Vince's availability. At present, Vince is the only person with the hardware/software to generate tunes, so this is a valid concern. Eventually, select dealers will have the ability to provide programming support, but I do not know when this will happen. - Nate |
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02-14-2010, 06:56 PM | #9 | |
Red Brick of Vengeance!
Drives: 12 Second Brick Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: at my pulpit
Posts: 7,745
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Quote:
I don't think anyone is voicing any other concern but that... The TRUTH is the GROUP BUY announced while Vince was GONE forced Beauwulf and me to voice our concerns about the tune. We were both waiting for Vince to return and review all the data! But that GROUP BUY FORCED our hand and we posted our experience to that point! We were certainly being patient waiting for 3 weeks... I was all set to give Vince all the time he need to review things.. IMHO all this could have been avoided it the Alpha car has been 100% stock and the OTHER people involved would not have hyped the 24 RWHP / 17 RWTQ gain before THEY had all the details... That being said I look forward to working with Vince improving my tranny and any future mods I do... BUT THE BOTTOM LINE IS I AM LOOKING OUT FOR MY V6 CAMARO5 BROTHERS... NOT THE VENDORS.... it that gets me slapped, banned or worse so be....
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02-14-2010, 07:52 PM | #10 |
13.453 @ 101.90
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2LT Rally Yellow Join Date: May 2009
Location: SE Pa.
Posts: 1,877
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02-14-2010, 07:53 PM | #11 |
I've actually made a conscious effort to exclude you from this, but OK.
The gains are dyno verified, so there's nothing to hype. And there has never been a claim of increased power for stock LLTs. Instead of arguing with either of you, I conceded that there could be a problem, and waited for Vince to return. When Vince contacted me, I discussed your posts with him, and this was his response: "I’m not surprised. I warned them ahead of time that there was no guarantee we’d see any gains in power at all, only that we’d tune it to the best of our ability based on the information we have. The LLT tune is viable now – we’re remote-tuning an LLT Camaro with twin turbos on it. We have dyno sheets proving a 20HP gain on the test car we used." - 01FEB10 Vince was aware of the group buy and ARH testing before he left...but...since the programming was still very new at the time, I took you at your word that there could be an issue with the tune. I later discovered that there wasn't, and that's been my only real gripe with either of you to date. We also discussed not selling the tune to stock LLT owners prior to his vacation, and that has been my position since posting the GB. - Nate |
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02-14-2010, 08:04 PM | #12 | |
Red Brick of Vengeance!
Drives: 12 Second Brick Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: at my pulpit
Posts: 7,745
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Quote:
Problem is every one jumped all over that 20 HP gains ignoring that fact that the car had and aftermarket intake and and possibly crappy gas! And I'm not talking about the ARH/Tune group buy... I'm talking about the original TUNE group buy that was setup... I sure don't remember ANYONE saying oh, by the way might not see ANY gain! I don't remember anyone discussing THAT in THIS forum until Beauwulf and I spoke up!!! I don't think ANYONE was going to plop down $$$$ for no gains! Like I said, Beauwulf and I were completely HAPPY waiting and giving Vince time he to digest everything until IMHO you came in here and stirred every thing up!
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02-14-2010, 08:13 PM | #13 |
Good luck to you
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02-14-2010, 08:19 PM | #14 |
Red Brick of Vengeance!
Drives: 12 Second Brick Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: at my pulpit
Posts: 7,745
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And here's were you put words in my mouth:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...2&postcount=20 and I quote: "Most of you are familiar with comments that have been made regarding the viability of Trifecta's LLT tune. These comments were made by Trifecta's own "beta testers", and did a very good job of convincing everyone that the LLT programming was ineffective/detrimental. I had my suspicions, but instead of waiting to discuss the issue with Vince, I went on the word of his testers. I should have waited:" I NEVER said the programming was ineffective/detrimental! I simply said I saw NO GAINS... which you NOW admit is a possibility! So you tried to paint ME as the bad guy! And now you're back peddling...
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