How important are good tires for road course racing for a total newb

[chad156]

Get a spare set of rims and get a set of Race Take Offs for track days.

[JDP Sales]

Road racing a heavy car with small brakes isn't going to teach you much more than you already know; you need to upgrade the V6 calipers.

As far as doing better tires, don't go with the best the first go around. Go with something kind of in the middle ground; something not too expensive, but not something that will fall apart on you out on track either.

I would do sway bars before wheels and tires. It is nice to find the limits of the stock setup and upgrade to see what you paid for, but with big mods like sway bars, you almost have to learn how to drive the car again as they will make such a difference.

Best regards,

Tyler
888-308-6007

[rebelyell22]

I have the BFG G-Force Sport Comp2. I haven't had them on a track but I drive hard on the road and love them!

[ZED SLED]

If you have a manual you might want to look into separating the clutch into it's own reservoir. There's several DIYs on here for that.

[SVThis]

I've never quite understood the drive what you have now till you reach the limits theory.If money is not an object I would take advise from people who know how to set up a car correctly and do it from the get go. To me it makes no sense to learn how to drive a crappy set up, upgrade, then have to relearn the car again. Do it right from the beginning, continue to improve, get plenty of seat time, and I believe your learning curve time will be shorter.

[SPCBA]

Originally Posted by SVThis

I've never quite understood the drive what you have now till you reach the limits theory.If money is not an object I would take advise from people who know how to set up a car correctly and do it from the get go. To me it makes no sense to learn how to drive a crappy set up, upgrade, then have to relearn the car again. Do it right from the beginning, continue to improve, get plenty of seat time, and I believe your learning curve time will be shorter.

The curve of learning never ends while driving.

OP...upgrade breaks, get tires your are comfortable with for your DD. Be safe and have fun. My ss was a blast on a road course stock, even more fun now. Glad i got to see how it behaved stock!

[rockrau]

I found the stock Pirellis a little greasy when hot. Now using 1LE tire/wheel package...big improvement! But I'm still a total newb.

[So Cal Camaro]

Originally Posted by rebelyell22

I have the BFG G-Force Sport Comp2. I haven't had them on a track but I drive hard on the road and love them!

They are not good track tires, worse than the Pirelli's in my opinion. I'd run Nitto Invo's before Comp2's.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by SVThis

I've never quite understood the drive what you have now till you reach the limits theory.

Part of it is about not trying to learn two things at the same time. Getting familiar with the track environment and learning the line (and consistently staying on it) are best achieved if you aren't wasting any of your concentration still learning how the new-again-to-you car behaves.

Part of it is that the understeer that the factory generously provided to help keep the street morons and hoons out of trouble at daily-driving street speeds is also going to help the novice track driver at substantially higher speeds. There will be plenty of time to dial some of that out later after your skills have caught up to the car's basic capabilities and the track environment.

Nothing in normal street driving fully prepares you for a 20 minute session out on the track. Two or three seconds of successful extreme avoidance maneuvering is but a snapshot, on track is the feature-length movie.

If money is not an object I would take advise from people who know how to set up a car correctly and do it from the get go. To me it makes no sense to learn how to drive a crappy set up, upgrade, then have to relearn the car again. Do it right from the beginning, continue to improve, get plenty of seat time, and I believe your learning curve time will be shorter.

The factory setup is not exactly crappy, and most times you can trust it to not turn and bite if you make a small mistake. But the closer you get to the pointy end of setup and the closer you get to those limits the less true that becomes. Less understeer is faster only when (and if) you can handle it, otherwise it's a greater risk of 4 wheels off and whatever follows from there. You can't expect the average brand-new novice to hit the track on his first session and demonstrate intermediate or better skills.


Norm

[Synner]

Originally Posted by SVThis

I've never quite understood the drive what you have now till you reach the limits theory.If money is not an object I would take advise from people who know how to set up a car correctly and do it from the get go. To me it makes no sense to learn how to drive a crappy set up, upgrade, then have to relearn the car again. Do it right from the beginning, continue to improve, get plenty of seat time, and I believe your learning curve time will be shorter.

Speed before knowledge =death, or a totaled car.

I've seen plenty of newbs testing tire walls because they went with a super fast car or attempted to exceed their knowledge level. Also the more modified a car the more finicky and less forgiving it can be. Not what a beginner needs when learning the basics and making mistakes.

[stevey_frac]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

The factory setup is not exactly crappy, and most times you can trust it to not turn and bite if you make a small mistake. But the closer you get to the pointy end of setup and the closer you get to those limits the less true that becomes. Less understeer is faster only when (and if) you can handle it, otherwise it's a greater risk of 4 wheels off and whatever follows from there. You can't expect the average brand-new novice to hit the track on his first session and demonstrate intermediate or better skills.


Norm

I'm not worried about the factory suspension. I'm worried about the factory V6 brakes.

If the brakes start to go on me, are they going to give me notice? Or am I just going to hit the brakes, and have the peddle turn to jello under my foot?

I'll switch to good fluid, and probably get a set of HPS pads all around.

I'm still pretty hesitant about it though.

[Synner]

Originally Posted by stevey_frac

I'm not worried about the factory suspension. I'm worried about the factory V6 brakes.

If the brakes start to go on me, are they going to give me notice? Or am I just going to hit the brakes, and have the peddle turn to jello under my foot?

I'll switch to good fluid, and probably get a set of HPS pads all around.

I'm still pretty hesitant about it though.

You would greatly benefit from SS brakes and pads with the proper heat range, I would not classify HPS as a track pad. You'd be better off with the stock brembo pads. Going with the 305's all around will amplify any brake shortfalls since you have a lot more grip than stock and can brake a lot harder and later if you choose to. But this all depends on your comfort level and how hard you push it as well.

You will get some notice but not a ton. They usually feel a bit soft for a lap or 2 and then fully crap out under a heavy braking situation. When you feel them getting soft take it easy for a lap and let your pedal feel and common sense be your guide. Also using the proper fluid will reduce the chance of the brakes giving out very early, I use Motul RBF600 and bleed before every track day.

[White_SS/RS]

Originally Posted by stevey_frac

I'm not worried about the factory suspension. I'm worried about the factory V6 brakes.

If the brakes start to go on me, are they going to give me notice? Or am I just going to hit the brakes, and have the peddle turn to jello under my foot?

I'll switch to good fluid, and probably get a set of HPS pads all around.

I'm still pretty hesitant about it though.

Its your safety and if you feel uncertian about the V6 brakes then upgrade. I see no harm in that. Good brakes are never something to compromise on if your serious about putting some time in at the track.

Go to the track. Get to know your car. Brake a little early and concentrate on a good line lap after lap. Do this and you'll save on brakes and natually pick up speed. Eventually you will find the limits of the car and what needs upgrading, ie tire/wheels. And yes every time you mod the car you will have to relearn its abilities. As a side note, I would assume that you would use the same safe approch to tracking even if you had the most capable car far beyond your abilities, so mod away!!

[Norm Peterson]

I wouldn't run HPS pads much past a first introductory track day, and only then with full-time conscious awareness that those are still street pads. You'll probably gain some confidence pretty quickly, and depending on how favorably you impress your instructor you'll be picking up the pace to where you can't just brush on the brakes to settle the car and lose a few mph like you can when you're "late braking" for a 30 mph posted highway exit ramp.

In the Hawk line, you probably want HP+ (which you can and will outgrow), or XP8 or maybe XP10 in Carbotech.

If you boil the fluid, it's probably a pretty sudden thing (haven't done that and hope not to experience it). Overheated pads leave you with a 'hard' pedal feel without as much deceleration happening, so there is a little warning here at least with track pads - my observation anyway.


Norm