* * * OnStar iPhone application - UPDATE * * *

[svtjackal]

I think we are getting upset too soon,
I am pretty sure that this system will be able to be adapted to the 2010 models if not directly by GM/onstar some clever guy will figure out what needs to be done and do it,
but I have a feeling that this is the same song that was being sung about installing the 4 gauge pack on LS, 1LT AND 1SS that it was going to need some special programing by the dealer to make them work and what happen? some guy plug them in and they worked no programing needed.

[Rogue Leader]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

..........

Do you REALLY think that the TI-84 calculator was designed to be able to play "DOOM"? Clever people modified the software to work on a lowly graphing calculator. Clearly, this is something the hardware was never designed to do. Yet it does it reasonably well.

...........

I just have to jump on this comment. First off the DOOM software was NOT modified to play on a TI-84, someone went and wrote a whole new program mimicking DOOM on the TI-84 OS. Not only that it runs like complete shit. Its barely playable. I spent all my college years playing games like that on my TI-84 and TI-92. They did work and they were better than nothing, but they were poor shells of their namesake games. So if you are using this to defend your position you have no defense.

[Captain Awesome]

Originally Posted by Toasty

OnStar doesnt owe you proof of anything.





By your example, I should be able to dig up a TI-84 and use it to create adn render a Pixar like movie scene, simply by writing a program....

but wait! there are.... GASP!!! HARDWARE LIMITATIONS! can't be done!

The problem with YOUR argument is that you are trying to compare two things with such a wide disparity between them that the concept is not practical.

What we're talking about here is where two closely related pieces of hardware can be matched. Not a calculator doing the work of a render farm and HD monitor.

Stick to realistic arguments.

[Captain Awesome]

Originally Posted by Rogue Leader

I just have to jump on this comment. First off the DOOM software was NOT modified to play on a TI-84, someone went and wrote a whole new program mimicking DOOM on the TI-84 OS. Not only that it runs like complete shit. Its barely playable. I spent all my college years playing games like that on my TI-84 and TI-92. They did work and they were better than nothing, but they were poor shells of their namesake games. So if you are using this to defend your position you have no defense.

Who cares if the software was modified or scratch written. The point is that it was written, and it worked. Your review of the "playability" doesn't change the fact it was done and it did work.

You said the magic words: "Better than nothing."

I would rather have an OnStar app that let me do some things rather than having NOTHING.

There's really only one or two things about the app inportant to me: The ability to lock the doors if I think I may have forgotten and the ability to locate the car with GPS in case it gets stolen or I can't find it in a big parking lot. Those features are well within the capabilities of the hardware.

If they have a hardware issue like insufficient RAM or no room left in the flash for the code then they can dump OnStar features I never use to make space for the smartphone app code. (I never use Turn-By-Turn, which they can remove and free up plenty of hardware resources to do smartphone support)

[Rogue Leader]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

Who cares if the software was modified or scratch written. The point is that it was written, and it worked. Your review of the "playability" doesn't change the fact it was done and it did work.

You said the magic words: "Better than nothing."

I would rather have an OnStar app that let me do some things rather than having NOTHING.

There's really only one or two things about the app inportant to me: The ability to lock the doors if I think I may have forgotten and the ability to locate the car with GPS in case it gets stolen or I can't find it in a big parking lot. Those features are well within the capabilities of the hardware.

If they have a hardware issue like insufficient RAM or no room left in the flash for the code then they can dump OnStar features I never use to make space for the smartphone app code. (I never use Turn-By-Turn, which they can remove and free up plenty of hardware resources to do smartphone support)

You work in a business you need to seriously read what you just wrote and think REALLY hard about whether any business would EVER do that. Even offer an option to dump a feature that makes them money for one that is free, Seriously????

Not only that you've been screaming and yelling about how it was not possible there was a hardware issue involving this and now you just brought up two unchangeable deficiencies in the hardware that you believe would make it not work.

I rest my case.

[philipdistefano]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

What was that? Your message was garbled. I think your dial-up connection is bad. Try switching to 1200 baud or try calling in on your Tracfone.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Thank you for that.

[tgdtown]

I hope it works for the 2010!!!!

[Toasty]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

If they have a hardware issue like insufficient RAM or no room left in the flash for the code then they can dump OnStar features I never use to make space for the smartphone app code. (I never use Turn-By-Turn, which they can remove and free up plenty of hardware resources to do smartphone support)

...well would you look at that... you mean that there MIGHT BE HARDWARE LIMITATIONS??

[Captain Awesome]

Originally Posted by Toasty

...well would you look at that... you mean that there MIGHT BE HARDWARE LIMITATIONS??

As I have said before, there do not seem to be any hardware limitations to access any of the standard features. Some of the less technically savvy among us seem to be buying the excuse that there's a hardware limitation preventing this app from running. Lack of memory or "channels" or something along those lines was suggested as an example of a hardware limitation (which I reject outright). I was merely saying that if anyone actually buys that line of crap from the OnStar Spin Team, then I propose a method of working around the "limitation" excuse.

We move fast here. You have to pay attention.

[Toasty]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

As I have said before, there do not seem to be any hardware limitations to access any of the standard features. Some of the less technically savvy among us seem to be buying the excuse that there's a hardware limitation preventing this app from running. Lack of memory or "channels" or something along those lines was suggested as an example of a hardware limitation (which I reject outright). I was merely saying that if anyone actually buys that line of crap from the OnStar Spin Team, then I propose a method of working around the "limitation" excuse.

We move fast here. You have to pay attention.

LOL. You're now just trying backtrack, and change the spirit of what you said.

I don't think I ever said that OnStar couldnt do what is available now via an app, but what I was saying was that the NEW feature (remote start, etc) could not be added to the 2010's, likely due to hardware limitations-which for at least one post, you agreed with.

So perhaps it might be possible to write an app that would interface and lock/unlock and locate via GPS. (though I don't recall hearing if onstar can lock your vehicle remotely in current models)

Voice your thoughts/opinions to GM, but don't expect everyone else that has a 2010 to join in on your rant. Does it suck that you have a 2010 and likely won't get an update? Yeah. Is GM obligated to fix it? NOPE. That's just the way the world works.

Truth is that none of us really know the exact reason why they said it won't work, but in MY opinion, it really kind of pointless to outright INSIST that GM and OnStar are out to screw you. It is what it is.

[Rogue Leader]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

As I have said before, there do not seem to be any hardware limitations to access any of the standard features. Some of the less technically savvy among us seem to be buying the excuse that there's a hardware limitation preventing this app from running. Lack of memory or "channels" or something along those lines was suggested as an example of a hardware limitation (which I reject outright). I was merely saying that if anyone actually buys that line of crap from the OnStar Spin Team, then I propose a method of working around the "limitation" excuse.

We move fast here. You have to pay attention.

BUT you just listed two possible hardware limitations. You reject them outright on what basis? Do you know how much RAM or ROM is in the unit? Have you taken one apart? We see you do have technical knowledge of these things, and now you are eating your own words because your own knowledge of them has caused you to admit inadvertently that it IS possible that they aren't lying. But of course that doesn't further your cause... so slam it into reverse while driving forward. Yeah thats a smart idea.

Nice backtrack!

[scritchy]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

As I have said before, there do not seem to be any hardware limitations to access any of the standard features. Some of the less technically savvy among us seem to be buying the excuse that there's a hardware limitation preventing this app from running. Lack of memory or "channels" or something along those lines was suggested as an example of a hardware limitation (which I reject outright). I was merely saying that if anyone actually buys that line of crap from the OnStar Spin Team, then I propose a method of working around the "limitation" excuse.

We move fast here. You have to pay attention.

Do you even know what a channel is? You claim I don't work with these systems but you make statements that are beyond ignorant like this? Channels are not related to memory, at all. They are a physical connection that a box can connect to a system, similar to the way RC transmitters/receivers work in a RC plane. No amount of firmware upgrades are going to fix a physical limitation.

To think that they would intentionally hold back something as benign as a smart phone app to spur sales of a newer model of car is ridiculous. I'm pretty sure a few people nerd raging on the forums about the injustice of it all isn't part of their business plan to force people to upgrade to a 2011 model from 2010.

[Captain Awesome]

Originally Posted by Toasty

LOL. You're now just trying backtrack, and change the spirit of what you said.

Negative, my good sir. Go back and look at everything I have said in this topic. Why would I change my position going against everything I have said thus far for any reason other than using you as a foil to make my point?

I don't think I ever said that OnStar couldnt do what is available now via an app, but what I was saying was that the NEW feature (remote start, etc) could not be added to the 2010's, likely due to hardware limitations-which for at least one post, you agreed with.

I have said since day one that there MAY be some features that the new hardware interfaced with that were not on our Camaros BUT every feature that we currently have NOW would be available without any new hardware.

This means IF I can do it by:

a) Calling the OnStar advisor on a phone and asking them to perform.
b) Receiving in the monthly OnStar Vehicle Report.
c) Pressing the blue button on the mirror and requesting.

...then it will not need new hardware AND should be TRIVIAL to give us the features we already have using the hardware we have.

I have said THIS much from day one.

You seem to think that I'm complaining because they don't offer the entire suite of functions and I expect them to have all the same features. This is where you are wrong. I object to them stating unequivocably that the Gen 9 hardware is REQUIRED for ANY smartphone access. I have said since this first came up that there's no reason for them to say that you NEED Gen 9 hardware to use a smartphone app. They could make a smartphone app for the features we already have. They just refuse to do it and claim they cannot because of hardware. I object to this explanation.

Let me make this clear... I don't care if they leave out some capability the hardware lacks from the app. I care that they insist that the hardware can't do ANYTHING and that no app is available for any 2010 owner.

Furthermore, the excuse that this is impossible because of the hardware we have is indicative of the plan to NEVER offer an app for us. If they just were sitting around trying to decide which 2010 models to support they would have said "We are working on ways to make other cars work with the app." not "Sorry. Your hardware is not compatible. Please look at our fabulous 2011 models."

Voice your thoughts/opinions to GM, but don't expect everyone else that has a 2010 to join in on your rant. Does it suck that you have a 2010 and likely won't get an update? Yeah. Is GM obligated to fix it? NOPE. That's just the way the world works.

You better check the OnStar facebook page or the comments in the video they put on Youtube... More than just I am unhappy. Maybe if they weren't funneling the tax dollars that were taken from me back into political campaigns and lobbying efforts I would be less enraged at their lack of support for their loyal customers. One could argue that they ARE obligated to fix it for anyone who bought a car in 2010 forward.

Truth is that none of us really know the exact reason why they said it won't work, but in MY opinion, it really kind of pointless to outright INSIST that GM and OnStar are out to screw you. It is what it is.

I'm only insisting because they did screw us. I only insist on factual statements.

[Captain Awesome]

Originally Posted by Rogue Leader

BUT you just listed two possible hardware limitations. You reject them outright on what basis? Do you know how much RAM or ROM is in the unit? Have you taken one apart? We see you do have technical knowledge of these things, and now you are eating your own words because your own knowledge of them has caused you to admit inadvertently that it IS possible that they aren't lying. But of course that doesn't further your cause... so slam it into reverse while driving forward. Yeah thats a smart idea.

Nice backtrack!

I reject them outright because the hardware we have ALREADY DOES most (if not all) the functions which the app claims to be capable of.

Putting aside the features which some people claim cannot be accessed from OnStar (Remote Start... which is something that nobody with a manual can have because it's omitted on purpose for safety reasons in a manual car), let us just look at the features which we do have access to already:

OnStar can locate my car with GPS.
Onstar can unlock doors if I lock the keys inside.
Onstar can tell me the tire pressure.
Onstar can tell me the remaining oil life.
OnStar can tell me what is causing a "Service Engine" light and what action to take.

These functions are built into the car and the "protocol" to do them is in our cars and the software we currently have.

The way this works is the OnStar operator has a computer screen where they access a computer that they input our VIN number or customer ID. The computer periodically calls our car up on the verizon network and sends the command protocol to perform these actions. The car does these things when commanded. The operator at OnStar simply has a computer on their network connected to the Verizon network and they run an "App" that sends the commands to the car.

The only thing we end users lack is the protocol and security info that we need to send//receive the same commands. You see, the problem is NOT that the car cannot do anything, it's that the protocol software needed is not being created for our cars.

I'm going to speculate that OnStar created a totally new protocol for the 2011 models and it's not compatible with the 2010 protocol and they didn't want to write both protocols in their app, so they just coded the 2011 protocol since it's what they will use going forward.

(I'm simplifying this a bit here because they probably don't let the phone call the car directly. They probably have an intermediate program running on their servers somewhere that the phone app sends requests to and then the server on their end sends/receives the commands. But you get the point. The commands to do the majority of functions MUST be in the car already because the OnStar Operators would not be able to access these things in our cars.)

In summary: Anything the OnStar Advisor can do now, a phone application should be able to do by accessing the same computer network that the advisor is using to communicate to our vehicles. They are just intentionally NOT allowing people with 2010 models to access the network. This may be because they invented a new protocol, or some other reason. The main idea is that the app should be able to do the same things the advisor does without a single change in the car itself.