VW admits to falsifying emissions testing.

[90503]

Yep, there is a difference....one done by the manufacturer, the other done by the buyer....

The result is the same, though. Illegality and the increased pollution. And I think that is the point of what is trying to be achieved. Whatever you do to your own car emissions-wise isn't necessarily just your own business, either.

[FenwickHockey65]

Unless you live in a state with emissions testing, you could remove all emissions controls and nobody would know any wiser. Again, that's your business. If you're unlucky enough to live in a state with the scam that is vehicle inspection/emissions check, you're going to have to deal with the repercussions yourself.

VW, however, must answer to the EPA 100% of the time. If they aren't complying with federal regulations with brand new cars straight out of the factory, that's an issue. The fact that this software was inserted specifically to cheat the EPA tests is downright dishonest, not just to the government, but consumers as well. The TDIs are touted and sold as clean burning, which is apparently an outright lie. Furthermore, it isn't fair to other manufacturers who do comply.

[motorhead]

Are they still selling these cars?

[90503]

Originally Posted by motorhead

Are they still selling these cars?

They should apply for a waiver to continue selling them in the lucky states that have no emissions checks....After all, who'd care?

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by motorhead

Are they still selling these cars?

All stop saled.

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by 90503

They should apply for a waiver to continue selling them in the lucky states that have no emissions checks....After all, who'd care?

The EPA.

You're completely missing the point. A manufacturer has to build and sell a vehicle that complies with all federal regulations. The consumer assumes and trusts that the car they're buying is legal. What you do once you sign the paperwork and drive off, however, is out of the manufacturer's control. It's why warranties are voided when you mod, the manufacturer no longer assumes the liability of whatever you did to the car. If something breaks because of your mods, it's your business. If you can't pass emissions because you removed the cats, that's your business. You can't go to GM and blame them because you modded your Camaro.

But if the manufacturer purposefully installed something from the factory to cheat the EPA regulations, that's a big difference compared to Joe from Springfield who removed his cats last weekend. That's a few millions cars releasing way more pollution than allowed, all in the name of cost savings, a smoother engine, and more power/fuel economy, cars which, as I said, consumers assumed were legal.

[hotlap]

The risk they took is what's most shocking. Nearly 600,000 employee's livelihood was gambled with. It wasn't the act of a desperate company fighting to keep afloat. They just decided to do it.

[Snoman]

Originally Posted by hotlapZL1

The risk they took is what's most shocking. Nearly 600,000 employee's livelihood was gambled with. It wasn't the act of a desperate company fighting to keep afloat. They just decided to do it.

They 'just' decided to do it (intentionally) over a $300 part and what, perhaps a 10% drop in fuel economy? I expect the EPA to levy the maximum fine.

[GretchenGotGrowl]

Originally Posted by Snoman

They 'just' decided to do it (intentionally) over a $300 part and what, perhaps a 10% drop in fuel economy? I expect the EPA to levy the maximum fine.

Plus added weight, increased maintenance and a drop in HP as well. I'm not sure the FE would have dropped much, though. In the end, I can't see how any of this was worth it.

[Red2014SS]

Didn't read the whole thread, so don't know if this has been mentioned. Audi is now being dragged into this. Looks like they might be in trouble too.

[FenwickHockey65]

VAG owns Audi, so they use the same diesel engines as VW.

[Hilflos]

Article I read was unclear on whether it was limited to Audi diesels. I actually stopped by to see if anyone had heard definitively one way or the other.

Will keep looking and see if I can find anything.

Edit: Yep 2.1 million Audi EU5 diesel engine only so far.

[hockeylover86]

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

The EPA.

You're completely missing the point. A manufacturer has to build and sell a vehicle that complies with all federal regulations. The consumer assumes and trusts that the car they're buying is legal. What you do once you sign the paperwork and drive off, however, is out of the manufacturer's control. It's why warranties are voided when you mod, the manufacturer no longer assumes the liability of whatever you did to the car. If something breaks because of your mods, it's your business. If you can't pass emissions because you removed the cats, that's your business. You can't go to GM and blame them because you modded your Camaro.

But if the manufacturer purposefully installed something from the factory to cheat the EPA regulations, that's a big difference compared to Joe from Springfield who removed his cats last weekend. That's a few millions cars releasing way more pollution than allowed, all in the name of cost savings, a smoother engine, and more power/fuel economy, cars which, as I said, consumers assumed were legal.

It seems like this would classify as a fraud case, since it was knowingly done and purposefully to circumvent federal law. Someone should face criminal charges I would think..

[blakjak55]

Pure speculation on my part but I don't see where they probably really did much damage pollution wise. My guess is the government is upset A) because they lost revenue but they'll make up for it now and B) if they let this one slide at all then other auto makers will be more bold about circumventing the already overdone process.

Don't get me wrong, I like protecting the environment but I'm not a fan of the EPA and its rules sometimes.

Sad part is that VW did as much as anyone to bring diesel and acceptance back to America. Can't give them a pass but in my opinion that's worth a lot.