Ed Welburn Calls Out Lincoln - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

mikeyg36 · 12-02-2013, 07:38 PM

http://www.leftlanenews.com/gm-exec-.html

Quote:

"[Lincoln is] not a global luxury brand, "Welburn said. "I don't consider them a competitor. Are they a competitor for Buick? Quite possibly. But not for Cadillac."

CamaroDreams07 · 12-02-2013, 07:46 PM

That's flat out wrong. Lincolns are much, much nicer than Cadillacs in terms of luxury and at a lower price.

We have two, an MKS and MKX. We shopped for GM first including Caddy because we are a GM family. It just wasn't there.

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FenwickHockey65 · 12-02-2013, 08:39 PM

Lincoln is not even close to Cadillac. Or the Germans.

Even Ford has seemed to have given up on barking up that tree.

CamaroDreams07 · 12-02-2013, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

Lincoln is not even close to Cadillac. Or the Germans.

Even Ford has seemed to have given up on barking up that tree.

Whatever you say. When we got ours it wasn't even close.

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Number 3 · 12-02-2013, 08:44 PM

Take his comments in their entirety. Cadillac is also NOT a global brand. Selling a very small number of cars in Europe and China does not make Cadillac a true Global Brand. Audi, BMW and MB all sell 1 meeeelion units in China.......EACH. Cadillac is way behind even Buick in China.

Is Lincoln a competitor to the ATS or CTS or Escalade in the US? No, they have nothing even close. But they have decent competitors to the SRX and XTS and with the upcoming Escape based product they will have an entry Cadillac doesn't compete in.

A Lincoln version of the Fusion......................not so much.

KMPrenger · 12-02-2013, 08:45 PM

If you compare Lincoln to the latest generation from Cadillac...well then I have to agree. I think some of Lincoln's newest stuff (MKC and MKZ I believe) are nice but I consider them a Buick competitor. Not Cadillac.

Cadillac is stepping up the game to challenge many of the bigger luxury brands and their prices are going that direction as well. Lincoln is not pushing as hard if you ask me.

Hamilton2400 · 12-02-2013, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

Lincoln is not even close to Cadillac. Or the Germans.

Even Ford has seemed to have given up on barking up that tree.

+1

KMPrenger · 12-02-2013, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CamaroDreams07

Whatever you say. When we got ours it wasn't even close.

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I respect your opinion on here...id be curious to know what two vehicles and their model years you are referring to. Number 3 mentioned the newest gen of cadillacs im refering to and I dont feel lincoln is on par with them. All cadillacs are moveing further upscale

*DGthe3* · 12-02-2013, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CamaroDreams07

That's flat out wrong. Lincolns are much, much nicer than Cadillacs in terms of luxury and at a lower price.

We have two, an MKS and MKX. We shopped for GM first including Caddy because we are a GM family. It just wasn't there.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2

They're cheaper, sure. And they might offer the same or more options/feature. But ticking a bunch of boxes does not a luxury car make. Most luxury features you can name can be found in entry level brands. Its not the 'stuff' that makes a car luxury. Its the vibe that the car has.

Lincoln is still a few steps behind Cadillac at being a legitimate luxury brand, and Cadillac itself still hasn't quite gotten up to being on par with the Germans. It'll take at least another generation of vehicles to get there, if not two.

And on top of all that, there is no way that it can be argued that Lincoln is a global brand when they're only sold in North America.

CamaroDreams07 · 12-02-2013, 09:07 PM

Lol you guys are right. I'm gonna go down and see if we can trade them in for Caddy's in the morning.

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FenwickHockey65 · 12-02-2013, 09:24 PM

Enough said.

Lincolns are nice. But they're not on Cadillac's level by a long shot.

mikeyg36 · 12-02-2013, 09:27 PM

The only car is the Caddy line up that is sub-par to the Germans is the SRX. The XTS doesn't really compete in a segment and the CTS and ATS are true competitors.

mikeyg36 · 12-02-2013, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CamaroDreams07

Lol you guys are right. I'm gonna go down and see if we can trade them in for Caddy's in the morning.

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You don't need to get mad when someone disagrees with you. If you prefer Lincoln, that's fine and that's all that should matter to you.

FenwickHockey65 · 12-02-2013, 09:32 PM

I see it this way.

ATS/CTS are constantly being compared to the Germans. Every review has the 3-series or 5-series/E-class in it somewhere. And quite often, those reviews include a line like, "Cadillac has out-German-ed the Germans."

Meanwhile, I'll just flip open the MotorTrend magazine I got in the mail today (which is the Car of the Year edition, oh, and has a CTS on the front, by the way) to their segment on the MKZ (which is a fine car).

Quote:

We like: Handsome looks, surprisingly solid handling.

We don't like: Too much Ford left in it. And it costs how much?

Cadillac is being compared to BMW and Mercedes. Lincoln is being compared...to Ford.

12-02-2013, 07:46 PM	#2
CamaroDreams07 Drives: Slow V6 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: East Lansing, MI Posts: 9,361 View My Garage	That's flat out wrong. Lincolns are much, much nicer than Cadillacs in terms of luxury and at a lower price. We have two, an MKS and MKX. We shopped for GM first including Caddy because we are a GM family. It just wasn't there. Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2 __________________ [B]

12-02-2013, 08:39 PM	#3
FenwickHockey65 General Motors Aficionado Drives: 2023 GMC Canyon, 2020 Colorado Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Florida Posts: 37,371 View My Garage	Lincoln is not even close to Cadillac. Or the Germans. Even Ford has seemed to have given up on barking up that tree. __________________ 2023 GMC Canyon Elevation 2020 Chevrolet Colorado W/T Extended Cab (State-issued)

12-02-2013, 08:44 PM	#5
Number 3 Hail to the King baby! Drives: '19 XT4 2.0T & '22 VW Atlas 2.0T Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Illinois Posts: 12,172 View My Garage	Take his comments in their entirety. Cadillac is also NOT a global brand. Selling a very small number of cars in Europe and China does not make Cadillac a true Global Brand. Audi, BMW and MB all sell 1 meeeelion units in China.......EACH. Cadillac is way behind even Buick in China. Is Lincoln a competitor to the ATS or CTS or Escalade in the US? No, they have nothing even close. But they have decent competitors to the SRX and XTS and with the upcoming Escape based product they will have an entry Cadillac doesn't compete in. A Lincoln version of the Fusion......................not so much. __________________ "Speed, it seems to me, provides the one genuinely modern pleasure." - Aldous Huxley

12-02-2013, 08:45 PM	#6
KMPrenger Drives: 16 Camaro SS, 15 Colorado Join Date: May 2009 Location: Jefferson City, Missouri Posts: 13,943	If you compare Lincoln to the latest generation from Cadillac...well then I have to agree. I think some of Lincoln's newest stuff (MKC and MKZ I believe) are nice but I consider them a Buick competitor. Not Cadillac. Cadillac is stepping up the game to challenge many of the bigger luxury brands and their prices are going that direction as well. Lincoln is not pushing as hard if you ask me. __________________ 2016 Camaro 1SS - 8-speed - NPP - Black bowties 2010 Camaro 1LT V6 (Sold. I will miss her!)

12-02-2013, 09:07 PM	#10
CamaroDreams07 Drives: Slow V6 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: East Lansing, MI Posts: 9,361 View My Garage	Lol you guys are right. I'm gonna go down and see if we can trade them in for Caddy's in the morning. Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2 __________________ [B]

12-02-2013, 09:24 PM	#11
FenwickHockey65 General Motors Aficionado Drives: 2023 GMC Canyon, 2020 Colorado Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Florida Posts: 37,371 View My Garage	Enough said. Lincolns are nice. But they're not on Cadillac's level by a long shot. __________________ 2023 GMC Canyon Elevation 2020 Chevrolet Colorado W/T Extended Cab (State-issued)

12-02-2013, 09:27 PM	#12
mikeyg36 Drives: 2015 Z/28 #533 Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: NY Posts: 6,731	The only car is the Caddy line up that is sub-par to the Germans is the SRX. The XTS doesn't really compete in a segment and the CTS and ATS are true competitors.