shorties with twin turbos?

[IPSjeff]

Originally Posted by Unreal

Small turbos? Which out the 30+ combos you can get are small? I agree, no point on running a tubular header on the base 56mm because stock manifolds and those turbos have made 900+ but you can get the kit with any turbos you want. They have garret and precision in stock if someone wants 66/67s or whatever.

Small housings? Same thing, they probably have 600+ turbine housings sitting on a shelf. I was there today for lunch. Want 1.06 turbine housings, just ask for them. They cast their own housings and have a big range of A/Rs available.

This is the second time I have addressed this but you can't just swap out turbos like you are changing your shoes. If that were the case, we would only have one turbo kit and you could select any number of turbos to go with it. Not possible. The only turbos that you can upgrade to in our kits obviously have to be the same physical size (Same frame size) and then the same style flange type. Changing from journal to ball-bearing adds lines and fittings for cooling and different oil lines / fittings. Changing from a standard T3 housing to a Tial SS V-band requires a different flange which requires a different mid-pipe. Turbos with 4" inlets obviously require different filter or intake tubing than those with only 3".

It is much much more complicated (In terms of selling a kit anyway) than just swapping in/out any one of 100 turbos of any brand to make more/less power.
Jeff

[Unreal]

Jeff, that is true. That being said there are several combos from 51 to 67mm that fit in the housings provided. Ball bearing or not, billet wheels or not. If someone wanted to swap to a water cooled there would be added lines. I was just pointing out that the kits are available with several turbos so saying they are small is misleading since they could be small or big. I know they are doing a set of tiny precision billet ball bearing for a customer that only wants 650rwhp and to spool as quickly as possible. I would say those are small turbos because they are. They will max out around ~700rwhp. A billet 67mm isn't small IMO and available in the housings they use.

[mylftft]

I'm the car that Unreal mentioned, we stopped the car at 1100 rwhp because of my factory 6L90, motor, fuel system, turbos are capable of 1400 rwhp. I have the AGP kit & my car was built by ADM performance, I'm running the ARH shorties. I don't know why random, people seem to knock this kit, I love it & it makes big power, Kevin at AGP sent me a pm with his personal phone number attached to it, I called him & we talked for a long time, he wanted to be sure I was happy with the kit, offered to spec me a converter, answered all my questions about drag racing a turbo car, the dude was cool as hell! Keep in mind I have given him no money, he didn't build my car, ADM built it for me, he just wanted to be sure I was happy with everything because my car was getting so much attention after it went 201.9 at The Texas Mile. I never drove or ran it with the stock manifolds but I can assure it spools pretty damn fast & the shorties look awesome when I lift the hood.

[DKT]

What flange is on the cast pieces that agp uses to go to the turbos?

[SSE 4 2SS]

Originally Posted by kpwalls06

Wow, that's almost a Greek Saga right there!! I've actually followed your build quite a bit, and it's been quite interesting to watch y'all figure things out over time. Thanks for all that info on your car too, it's very helpful.

Since we're on this topic...what A/R's were you running in the 67/66's, and now in your bigger set-up? Also, since I'm rocking a 9ci smaller motor and I'm not looking for your power levels, you think I could get away with the 6766's, and keeping the max boost around 15-16#'s? I'm building my car more for road-racing type stuff, and I definitely want to run the Texas Mile once it's force-fed; 1/4 times and hooking from a dig aren't really the focus for my girl. I'm looking for 1k+ rwhp at the top (once I get there I'll see if I want more), and done in such a way that I can still drive the car regularly.

I understand the need for properly sizing everything from the manifolds to the housings, and the turbos themselves, I just don't have too much experience with winning combinations on these LS motors, so I'm trying to pick the brains of all the knowledgeable people I can find about these types of builds. You may not have guessed it, but this is my first foray into these power levels!

I'll have to check to get the exact A/R specs and other items, I'm offshore and won't be home for a bit, hopefully before new years...
Your motor and 67/66's road racing will probably last, but keep in mind if you come out of a corner and get on it too hard and fast, your spin the car into the next area code... not the tires, but the car... As an example, in a straight line, my rear tires have been known to try and pass my front tires in 5th gear at over 190 mph... Traction is a huge issue across the board...

Road racers with big power are usually in the 600-650 range, though there are exceptions to everything... Typical power levels are usually a bit less than that...

As for having access to big power and driveability... I highly recommend a very good boost controller... I am familiar with two of them and two only... Others will have to speak on different brands since I've never been exposed to them...

AMS 1000 Cadillac... cream of the crop... for a fixed purpose item... It's moderately easy to set up and change... and a knowledgeable wirijng guy can hook you up pretty quickly... This gives you the diversity to run around on the street with low level wastegate springs, and the option to increase boost depening on the driving situation, track/etc... Big wide open road race course, turn it up a bit more, smaller tight track, turn it down... Texas mile, max it out...Bare in mind the car will have to be tuned and fuel available for the various situations... and the fuel schedule must be followed... You can't crank in 16-18 lbs of boost on 93 octane and expect the motor to live... We run C-16 for raing at the mile... and to mix with Nitrous... via a standalone...

I may not be exact here, but if memory serves, you can dial up 2.5 times the boost as the springs that are in the waste gate... I don't know if it capable to be used with a 4 port servo, but if so, you can pretty much dial up whatever boost you want, as I am with the Pro EFI system in my car... We removed the AMS 1000 when we upgraded to ProEFI...

Pro EFI offers tons of capabilities... Traction control, boost control, nitrous control, and myriad other sensors for protecting the motor... fuel pressure monitoring, coolant system pressure monitoring, etc... Why do you care about coolant system pressure, if you are lifting a head and or pushing a gasket, you can over pressurize the coolant system... Ask me how I know... if the ProEFI system sees this pressure increase, it immediately puts the motor in a reduced power mode... same with fuel pressure... etc... It freaking amazing what the system will do and we are still trying to dial in all the items...

Traction control, it measures and compares front and rear tire spin/roll rates and will do whatever is needed to keep the speed comparable... This allows you to get the absolute maximum amount the tires are capable of giving in the traction dept... Obviously computers see and react way faster than we can... and I feel comfortable with the protections the ProEFI offers...

Both of thes controllers, the AMS 1000 boost controller and the ProEFI engine management system are expensive... AMS, look at a grand of thereabouts... the ProEFI, look at 6-10 grand depending on the features and sensors etc... for the big boy computer...I'm not sure on the pricing for the smaller puter but it's still a fine piece of equipment....

[DKT]

There is the new AMS 2000 that adds a lot of safety features. It will decrease boost based off afr, oil pressure, fuel pressure, etc.

Love pro efi as well.

[RichP]

Are these the standard ARH Shorty headers or a different part number to work with the AGP & IPS kits?

If it's the standard shorty header, that would be a great upgrade patch for those of us that want a little extra power now with the plan to go twin turbo in the future.

[SSE 4 2SS]

Originally Posted by Jered@DKT

There is the new AMS 2000 that adds a lot of safety features. It will decrease boost based off afr, oil pressure, fuel pressure, etc.

Love pro efi as well.

Did they finally, after what, 3 years release the AMS 2000... We waited for it forever but went with the AMS 1000 and then swapped up to the ProEFI....

[DKT]

Originally Posted by SSE 4 2SS

Did they finally, after what, 3 years release the AMS 2000... We waited for it forever but went with the AMS 1000 and then swapped up to the ProEFI....

Yup. For someone that runs a stock ecu it's a great addition with the extra safety features built in.

[SSE 4 2SS]

Originally Posted by Jered@DKT

Yup. For someone that runs a stock ecu it's a great addition with the extra safety features built in.

Wow, I'll have to check it out after I get home an have a better internet connection... The AMS 1000 is sweet, can't wait to see what all the 2000 has in it for peeps... And I agree, the peace of mine from having all the safeties is amazing...

I hope others realize that spending tens of thousands on a motor is well worth the investment to protect that investment with a good boost controller that has safegaurds...

[mylftft]

I run the PCS D 200, I like it, has a ton of features, combined with the 3 tunes (91, E85, C16) I have at the flip of 3 different switches, I love the versatility. I just add whatever fuel I'm gonna run for the day & flip the switch that goes with it. 91 octane I'm right at 850 rwhp, E85 & C16 are both right at 1100 rwhp. I'd like to see another company offer a kit that comes in at the AGP price & offer their quality of parts, performance & price point. I'm running the Borg Warner S 261's through the stock ZL1 rearend & the stock 6L90 to get my numbers.

[Unreal]

Yes they are standard ARH headers, but it may not be a bad idea to weld some bracing on them for the turbos to help prevent cracking.

[z06-tt]

so i have to ask.

what turbo flange in on the AGP kit???? T3?