Z/28 MSRP ABOVE 70K

[2001ragtop]

I have not read anywhere that the Z/28 uses different control arm bushings or subframe bushings than any other Camaro.

If that is the case, someone can buy the off-the-shelf Z/28 struts/springs and then their Camaro is Track-ready and should ride the same as a Z/28.

Though I assume the springs/struts would be pricey.

But once you do that, it would seem the only thing really missing would be the LS7 engine.

Does anyone know if the Z/28 has power windows? I just wondered about this, because I do not think the weight savings would be worth it to make the windows hand-crank windows...

[Rapid Runner]

70K???.. this might be the only American car that your buying the name

[LOWDOWN]

Originally Posted by assasinator

your answer illustrates GM's lost vision. making cars the average person cannot obtain = fail. anything chevrolet is supposed to be for the average person.

For purposes of direct comparisons in the Marketplace, Chev = Ford (for argument's sake, which I'm sure is your objective...)

Ford built 750 BOSS LSs, which was their stated plan from the beginning, correct?

Using your logic (?!), Ford FAILED. I guess if you include that handful of Ford GTs from a few years' back (at more than TWICE the Z/28's price, with little/nothing for it on a road course) was EPIC FORD FAIL NUMBER 2! (again, using your well-thought-out logic)

Again, for argument's sake, let's say the Z/28 Program co$t$ $10KK, BEFORE product additions/deletions. Based on a 1,000 units, that's $10 GRAND per car, just to arrive at the dealers' doors, before anyone makes a dime. Now, let's build 2,000...which brings development/certification/validation co$t$ alone all the way down to $5 GRAND per car, before anyone makes a dime...and 2,000 would be 3 TIMES as many as Ford decided to build of the failing BOSS LS...

Now, add in the additions/deletions (and yes, deletions co$t!)...

Now, the target for the Z/28 is NOT the defunct BOSS LS. THAT was accomplished by the lowly, and much less-expen$ive, 1LE...game, set, match, trophy!

No, the Z/28 has bigger fish to fry...and the wok is warming up...

What's Ford's answer? A whole new Generation of car is necessary...and even THAT may not be enough... Hell, a GT 500 with similar weight and 230-some extra ponies can't trounce a 1LE on a road course, as per Lightning Lap...[heads hang in Dearborn]

Hail the ULTIMATE CORNER-CARVING STREET-LEGAL PONY CAR, the all-conquering Z/28! Line up for yours, now...if it's not already too late...

EDIT:

BTW, $10KK for total Program co$t$ for something akin the Z/28 would be LOW...as I'm sure some here can confirm...

[cbass]

Originally Posted by LOWDOWN

For purposes of direct comparisons in the Marketplace, Chev = Ford (for argument's sake, which I'm sure is your objective...)

Ford built 750 BOSS LSs, which was their stated plan from the beginning, correct?

Using your logic (?!), Ford FAILED.

Again, for argument's sake, let's say the Z/28 Program co$t$ $10KK, BEFORE product additions/deletions. Based on a 1,000 units, that's $10 GRAND per car, just to arrive at the dealers' doors, before anyone makes a dime. Now, let's build 2,000...which brings development/certification/validation co$t$ alone all the way down to $5 GRAND per car, before anyone makes a dime...and 2,000 would be 3 TIMES as many as Ford decided to build of the failing BOSS LS...

Now, add in the additions/deletions (and yes, deletions co$t!)...

Now, the target for the Z/28 is NOT the defunct BOSS LS. THAT was accomplished by the lowly, and much less-expen$ive, 1LE...game, set, match, trophy!

No, the Z/28 has bigger fish to fry...and the wok is warming up...

What's Ford's answer? A whole new Generation of car is necessary...and even THAT may not be enough...

Hail the ULTIMATE CORNER-CARVING STREET-LEGAL PONY CAR, the all-conquering Z/28! Line up for yours, now...if it's not already too late...

I wonder if it will come with OnStar. Delete the AC, radio, speakers, but leave big brother OnStar.

[LOWDOWN]

Originally Posted by cbass

I wonder if it will come with OnStar. Delete the AC, radio, speakers, but leave big brother OnStar.

Yes...OnStar will automatically contact the local/national media every time a Z/28 sets a New Lap Record (can't you just hear that, from that baritone-voiced announcer from Indy?)

[KKreme15]

Originally Posted by backtotintops

nope...we all know NOTHING. I suggest 3...2...1...type in "Multimatic" to google and start there. Don't forget geometry and pick up points have changed too. The z/28 will easily best a c7 and likely best any zo6 on a road course and yes a better ring time is coming to youtube...until the next version zo6 with the same suspension technology...this is my "know nothing" prediction.



this z/28 pulled me in and I never would have considered a camaro or vette before and if you think there aren't many many more PCA, FCA, VCA, BMWCCA folks like myself very interested for track day fun you have missed the point…this is the meanest track car gm has ever made…btw….the C6-Rs are made by Pratt & Miller.

and if it does wipe up the competition with a blistering ring time under 7:19 can they sell every one for @100k...I think yes. What do you think?

3/sec lap faster than zl1 at Milford last time I heard. About 1 sec per mile. No way it will lap Nurburgring in 7:19, even if they are still making tweaks.

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by KKreme15

3/sec lap faster than zl1 at Milford last time I heard. About 1 sec per mile. No way it will lap Nurburgring in 7:19, even if they are still making tweaks.

I'm not feeling the 7:19 either (I'm thinking mid 7:20's), however the 3 seconds mentioned was months and months ago...they're still developing it.

[ParisTNDude]

Originally Posted by DuskSS

And that means exactly... Squat.
2 different drivers and that is a very old z06 2005 model.

Put the same driver in both with same year car and that vette will trounce that heavy camaro.

I'm sorry stock for stock you can't compare the 2.
One is a street brawler and the other a sports car made for the higher speeds and better handing.

Sure you shove enough aftermarket crap in anything it can be fast.. but it's going to cost you.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2

I'm pretty sure that's what Ford tried to do with the GT500...mod it with a lot of HP. Surely by now they're embarrassed at the lack of all around performance it has shown.

C5 cried for a couple years for a faster Camaro and got the ZL1 that ate it's targeted competition (the 2011 GT500) alive. And we continued asking for a Z28. Chevy and GM made sure we didn't do what Ford did with the GT500 by developing a "whole" car using the current platform. I think they did well and whatever the cost, it will be ok with many.

Chevy made a wide variety of Camaros back in the day including SSs, RSs, COPOs and a bunch of others, including 6 cylinders, 2 barrel V8s and lots of increments all the way up to a 454, I think. If the 1LT, SS, ZL1, 1LE, Z28 doesn't fit your needs, buy the next best thing...if there is such a thing...but, Corvette comes to mind.

[JPC]

Originally Posted by LOWDOWN

For purposes of direct comparisons in the Marketplace, Chev = Ford (for argument's sake, which I'm sure is your objective...)

Ford built 750 BOSS LSs, which was their stated plan from the beginning, correct?

Using your logic (?!), Ford FAILED. I guess if you include that handful of Ford GTs from a few years' back (at more than TWICE the Z/28's price, with little/nothing for it on a road course) was EPIC FORD FAIL NUMBER 2! (again, using your well-thought-out logic)

Again, for argument's sake, let's say the Z/28 Program co$t$ $10KK, BEFORE product additions/deletions. Based on a 1,000 units, that's $10 GRAND per car, just to arrive at the dealers' doors, before anyone makes a dime. Now, let's build 2,000...which brings development/certification/validation co$t$ alone all the way down to $5 GRAND per car, before anyone makes a dime...and 2,000 would be 3 TIMES as many as Ford decided to build of the failing BOSS LS...

Now, add in the additions/deletions (and yes, deletions co$t!)...

Now, the target for the Z/28 is NOT the defunct BOSS LS. THAT was accomplished by the lowly, and much less-expen$ive, 1LE...game, set, match, trophy!

No, the Z/28 has bigger fish to fry...and the wok is warming up...

What's Ford's answer? A whole new Generation of car is necessary...and even THAT may not be enough... Hell, a GT 500 with similar weight and 230-some extra ponies can't trounce a 1LE on a road course, as per Lightning Lap...[heads hang in Dearborn]

Hail the ULTIMATE CORNER-CARVING STREET-LEGAL PONY CAR, the all-conquering Z/28! Line up for yours, now...if it's not already too late...

EDIT:

BTW, $10KK for total Program co$t$ for something akin the Z/28 would be LOW...as I'm sure some here can confirm...

hmmm
please check some facts:
I understand 750 Boss LS and 3500 Boss 302 per year was built
so a total of 8500 Boss over 2 years
....epic failure???

I have yet seen a Camaro 1LE at the track I go to
...I run about once a month

I'd love to see a 1LE at the track
I run at Eagles Canyon Raceway just north of Dallas

yes the Z28 so far sounds impressive, now lets see the price?
I know MSRP on Bosses were in the low to mid 40's

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by JPC

hmmm
please check some facts:
I understand 750 Boss LS and 3500 Boss 302 per year was built
so a total of 8500 Boss over 2 years
....epic failure???

I have yet seen a Camaro 1LE at the track I go to
...I run about once a month

I'd love to see a 1LE at the track
I run at Eagles Canyon Raceway just north of Dallas

yes the Z28 so far sounds impressive, now lets see the price?
I know MSRP on Bosses were in the low to mid 40's

I think the Boss LS's were almost $50K if you could get one at MSRP.

[SEVEN-OH JOE]

Originally Posted by JPC

hmmm
please check some facts:
I understand 750 Boss LS and 3500 Boss 302 per year was built
so a total of 8500 Boss over 2 years
....epic failure???

I have yet seen a Camaro 1LE at the track I go to
...I run about once a month

I'd love to see a 1LE at the track
I run at Eagles Canyon Raceway just north of Dallas

yes the Z28 so far sounds impressive, now lets see the price?
I know MSRP on Bosses were in the low to mid 40's

Well, well, now we're playing tag-team, Texas-style, are we?

Ford built 750 BOSS LSs per year, as mentioned. BUT, and it's a not-so-inconsequential one, they diluted the Brand by building a bunch of clones for clowns who wanted the look and style, relatively, but NOT the ultimate experience of a BOSS LS. In other words, they built about 8500, total, BOSSes for poseurs. And 1500, total, REAL BOSS LSs.

BOSS clones started @ $42,200 + Freight/PDI + Options which, as poseurs will, were added to the vast majority of those cars. Sunroofs, for instance. Very popular with poseurs. Super Duper Sound, again for the faint-of-heart who are terrified of mechanical sounds.

BOSS LS started @ $49,195 with, thankfully, few options. Other than a Friendly Ford dealer's $5,000 detailing, in many cases.

Value: Checking my GM website, I see you can build a 1SS 1LE with Dual Mode Exhaust and Short Throw Shifter for $36,710 + Freight/PDI. No secret handshake required. In fact, reasonable expectation of a DISCOUNT. Maybe even a rebate or super-rate financing; things the LS was exempt from.

When the magazines rounded up their Pony Car Comparo victims, which BOSS was used? The Real Deal, or the poseur? Real Deal, every time. So it's a wee bit disingenuous to suggest the "low-$40s" BOSS (or should that be boss) is the halo-wearer. It's NOT. It's the non -poseur $50+ version that earned the accolades. Which, with its expensive dealer detail job (in many cases) knocks on the door of the $54,995 ZL1. Which beat it.

But wait, there's more: That same $50+ BOSS LS was beat, at VIR in the Lightning Lap, by the abovementioned $36,710 1LE. The one that's $5,000+ LESS than the POSEUR. And $12,485 LESS than (we better italicize this) the REAL DEAL.

Z/28 Pricing: If Ford hadn't diluted the BOSS Brand with those 8500 poseur ponies, what do you think the price of a REAL DEAL BOSS LS would have been? More than the Chili Sauce salesman's GT 500? More than 5 times as many poseurs were "marketed" as real LSs (kind of like the 1LE vs. Z/28?). How much did that additional volume dilute the Brand AND price?

GM could have done the same: 1LE as the "Base" Z/28. At $45K or so. 1,000s would have lined up. Even MORE than lined up for the almost-BOSS and the LS. The REAL DEAL would then have the hotter engine (like a Track Key, only better!), the really-really- great brakes, the better seats, and the R-compound tires. And less weight (remember, the LS weighs 5 lb more than the poseur). But, as Ford should have known, GM diluted the Z/28 a time or two before, to their shame. THIS TIME? No poseurs need apply. At any price, high-low-otherwise.

Only one Texas Tall Tail, but NO longhorn cattle, were killed in the making of this movie. Sorry, SPCA.

PS:

Last I checked, Ford expected to make 10,000, total, BOSS Mustangs: 5000/yr, with the split 4250 poseur/750 real deal. If this breakdown in inaccurate, contact Ford. It was their p.r.

[Deki]

^ You make no sense at all.

[shaffe]

Seven oh joe

www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKjxFJfcrcA

[SS 376]

Originally Posted by SEVEN-OH JOE

Well, well, now we're playing tag-team, Texas-style, are we?

Ford built 750 BOSS LSs per year, as mentioned. BUT, and it's a not-so-inconsequential one, they diluted the Brand by building a bunch of clones for clowns who wanted the look and style, relatively, but NOT the ultimate experience of a BOSS LS. In other words, they built about 8500, total, BOSSes for poseurs. And 1500, total, REAL BOSS LSs.

BOSS clones started @ $42,200 + Freight/PDI + Options which, as poseurs will, were added to the vast majority of those cars. Sunroofs, for instance. Very popular with poseurs. Super Duper Sound, again for the faint-of-heart who are terrified of mechanical sounds.

BOSS LS started @ $49,195 with, thankfully, few options. Other than a Friendly Ford dealer's $5,000 detailing, in many cases.

Value: Checking my GM website, I see you can build a 1SS 1LE with Dual Mode Exhaust and Short Throw Shifter for $36,710 + Freight/PDI. No secret handshake required. In fact, reasonable expectation of a DISCOUNT. Maybe even a rebate or super-rate financing; things the LS was exempt from.

When the magazines rounded up their Pony Car Comparo victims, which BOSS was used? The Real Deal, or the poseur? Real Deal, every time. So it's a wee bit disingenuous to suggest the "low-$40s" BOSS (or should that be boss) is the halo-wearer. It's NOT. It's the non -poseur $50+ version that earned the accolades. Which, with its expensive dealer detail job (in many cases) knocks on the door of the $54,995 ZL1. Which beat it.

But wait, there's more: That same $50+ BOSS LS was beat, at VIR in the Lightning Lap, by the abovementioned $36,710 1LE. The one that's $5,000+ LESS than the POSEUR. And $12,485 LESS than (we better italicize this) the REAL DEAL.

Z/28 Pricing: If Ford hadn't diluted the BOSS Brand with those 8500 poseur ponies, what do you think the price of a REAL DEAL BOSS LS would have been? More than the Chili Sauce salesman's GT 500? More than 5 times as many poseurs were "marketed" as real LSs (kind of like the 1LE vs. Z/28?). How much did that additional volume dilute the Brand AND price?

GM could have done the same: 1LE as the "Base" Z/28. At $45K or so. 1,000s would have lined up. Even MORE than lined up for the almost-BOSS and the LS. The REAL DEAL would then have the hotter engine (like a Track Key, only better!), the really-really- great brakes, the better seats, and the R-compound tires. And less weight (remember, the LS weighs 5 lb more than the poseur). But, as Ford should have known, GM diluted the Z/28 a time or two before, to their shame. THIS TIME? No poseurs need apply. At any price, high-low-otherwise.

Only one Texas Tall Tail, but NO longhorn cattle, were killed in the making of this movie. Sorry, SPCA.

PS:

Last I checked, Ford expected to make 10,000, total, BOSS Mustangs: 5000/yr, with the split 4250 poseur/750 real deal. If this breakdown in inaccurate, contact Ford. It was their p.r.

Can we try that again?