Horsepower Wars - ZL1 now in 3rd Place

[FINALLYSATISFIED]

Originally Posted by Skylane765

If you want all that fancy stuff get a Cadillac.

Mustang and Challenger has it. Fancy stuff? It's called safety, blind spot sensors and adaptive cruise control isn't all that fancy considering alot of cars come equipped with it as an option.

[omegaman]

Originally Posted by 2012 ZL1#1658

There will always be something faster. That's just the way it goes.

True, but as Ricky Bobby says "If you're not first, you're last."

[Skylane765]

Originally Posted by FINALLYSATISFIED

Mustang and Challenger has it. Fancy stuff? It's called safety, blind spot sensors and adaptive cruise control isn't all that fancy considering alot of cars come equipped with it as an option.

True, it will be on the gen 6 car I am sure. The ZL1 was the highest HP when it first came out, and that is what the HP wars are about.

[gm_joe]

Originally Posted by cam99

My .02
1-the hellcat will be very costly, and has a long way to go to be competant performer against the zl1 and gt500 on something more than just hp figures. Not saying it won't be, I hope it is. Keeps everybody pushing the bar up higher

2- where the hell are these 55k 2014 gt500 I see people talking about. Thats a base price and I haven't seen anything close to that in a retail world. Options, transport, dealer markup's, etc. Seems like a stretch to actually pay 55k for one.

3- The first generation gt500 pretty much sucked. Coming from two previous 03 cobra's. those new gen car's took a big step backwards ( again except in the hp rating, which seems to be the main focus of those car's, not overall performance). I had a mildly modified 08 gt500 and would seriously take a new 5.0 over that car if I was buying a mustang. not impressed

The 2013 GT500base price is 55k, add the track pack, to place it on par with the ZL1 and you are over 62.5k.

[i2disturbedSS]

Originally Posted by BlackSun

the hellcat looks good to me

+1

Originally Posted by lbls1

Who says??? Has the Hellcat been tested??? I'll concede nothing until I hear it from the standards (MT, C&D, R&T). The zl established the standard for the high powered pony cars, so IMO its reputation will stand at that (even if its outgunned...which has happened before with the GT500).

I disagree. They made the ZL1 to compete against the GT500-right?
The ZL1 was the standard to have a high hp rating and handle is more accurate imo.

[QUOTE=MEDISIN;7700297]That will be tough to do. Consider current pricing...
2014 ZL1 $55,355
2014 GT500 $55,110
2014 SRT8 $45,685

The ZL1 and GT500 each command a $20k increase over the SS/GT. If they can build the Hellcat for only $10k more than the SRT8, I will be impressed. I suspect we will see a MSRP of at least $60-65k.

Other predictions:

• The GT500 will still be faster in a straight-line.
• The ZL1 will still be faster around a track.
• Both will outsell the Hellcat.

Agree with most of this. I will say the Hellcat will be close to the GT500 in 1/4 times but not as good on the road course.

Originally Posted by lbls1

The ZL1 set the standard of an american 2x2 coupe with a high horsepower engine that can also handle as well as the top echelon of performance cars. To my knowledge, this wasn't accomplished in the pony car segment before the '12 ZL1....at least to a significant degree.

Better said

[Rikki Tikki Tavi]

[QUOTE=i2disturbedSS;7700817]+1



I disagree. They made the ZL1 to compete against the GT500-right?
The ZL1 was the standard to have a high hp rating and handle is more accurate imo.

Originally Posted by MEDISIN

That will be tough to do. Consider current pricing...
2014 ZL1 $55,355
2014 GT500 $55,110
2014 SRT8 $45,685

The ZL1 and GT500 each command a $20k increase over the SS/GT. If they can build the Hellcat for only $10k more than the SRT8, I will be impressed. I suspect we will see a MSRP of at least $60-65k.

Other predictions:

• The GT500 will still be faster in a straight-line.
• The ZL1 will still be faster around a track.
• Both will outsell the Hellcat.

Agree with most of this. I will say the Hellcat will be close to the GT500 in 1/4 times but not as good on the road course.




Better said

The Challenger R/T is Dodges answer to Fords Mustang GT and Chevys SS Camaro. The SRT8 Challenger was Dodges answer to the Zl1 and Shelby.

There's no way that the Helllcat Challenger will start off at $70 Gs. That would mean a fully optioned one will push 90. Thats almost Viper territory. I can see a fully optioned Hellcat going in the mid to high 60s thats 20 thousand more than the the SRT8 Challenger base price.

As far as its niche vs the ZL1 and GT500, I think itll out handle the Shelby and beat the ZL1 in a drag race. They will probably promote it as a best of both worlds car.

[Johnman]

The Hellcat may win on horsepower, but it won't have as sophisticated a suspension, and it won't offer a convertible. The ZL1 should hold the second spot in 2015, because the 662 hp Shelby GT 500 will be gone, and the rumored replacement GT 350 is supposed to be around 500 hp. But I guess we'll see. I'll bet the ZL1 will beat the Hellcat on a track (and the Z/28 will run circles around it on a track).

[hotlap]

Doesn't the name Hellcat sound corny? Like Beaver Cleaver and Larry Mondello got together to name it.

Why not built a car worthy of the name Challenger T/A that can turn, stop and accelerate?

[RealG]

Being able to get the ZL1 with a automatic , really put it in a league of its own. I remember back late 2011 and the first rumors were only a stick and GM listened to us and we also have the auto. Now finally the hellcat auto comes out and that will be a direct competitor for the ZL1 auto.

[joes407]

Iread 2 different ads on the hellcat one said over 600hp and the other said 670hp w forged internals

[i2disturbedSS]

Originally Posted by hotlapZL1

Doesn't the name Hellcat sound corny? Like Beaver Cleaver and Larry Mondello got together to name it.

Why not built a car worthy of the name Challenger T/A that can turn, stop and accelerate?

Ha funny - made me think of Panther for the Camaro. I guess they wanted a name that stands out and it does. New & different.

[MEDISIN]

Originally Posted by Rikki Tikki Tavi

The Challenger R/T is Dodges answer to Fords Mustang GT and Chevys SS Camaro. The SRT8 Challenger was Dodges answer to the Zl1 and Shelby.

Not exactly. Dodge has always sported a "tweener" lineup for the Challenger.
Camaro V6:$24,550
Challenger V6: 26,495
Challenger R/T: $30,495
Camaro 1SS: $34,350
Challenger Core: $40,485
Challenger SRT8: $45,685

The V8 Camaro's fall right between the R/T and SRT Core in price, although performance is closer to SRT for both the SS and GT.

C&D: 0-60 in 4.5, 12.9 1/4mile at 114mph, 4203lbs
MotorTrend: 0-60 in 4.6, 13.0 1/4mile at 111.3mph, 4260lbs
Edmunds: 0-60 in 4.7, 12.9 1/4mile at 111.0mph, 4257lbs
Edmunds: 0-60 in 4.5, 12.6 1/4mile at 112.1mph, 4257lbs

Motor Trend: GT 12.7 sec @ 111.3 mph, SS 13.1 sec @ 110.8 mph
Car and Driver: GT 13.2 sec @ 109 mph, SS 13.0 sec @ 111 mph
Road & Track: GT 13.2 sec @ 109.3 mph, SS 13.0 sec @ 110.7 mph (0-120 mph: GT 16.4 sec, SS 15.4 sec), Willow Springs Lap: GT 1:37.6, SS 1:37.7)
Inside Line: GT 13.3 sec @ 107.3 mph, SS 13.1 sec @ 110.4 mph

Originally Posted by Rikki Tikki Tavi

As far as its niche vs the ZL1 and GT500, I think itll out handle the Shelby and beat the ZL1 in a drag race. They will probably promote it as a best of both worlds car.

That's a tall order. The SRT weighs 300lbs more than the GT500. Unless they can shed some weight, I don't see it getting around a track quicker than the GT500 with track pack - which is always the version Ford delivers for reviews.

[hockeylover86]

Originally Posted by joes407

Iread 2 different ads on the hellcat one said over 600hp and the other said 670hp w forged internals

They are shooting for 700...

The package will be available on the charger also at a later date..

[72MachOne99GT]

Originally Posted by cam99

My .02
1-the hellcat will be very costly, and has a long way to go to be competant performer against the zl1 and gt500 on something more than just hp figures. Not saying it won't be, I hope it is. Keeps everybody pushing the bar up higher


2- where the hell are these 55k 2014 gt500 I see people talking about. Thats a base price and I haven't seen anything close to that in a retail world. Options, transport, dealer markup's, etc. Seems like a stretch to actually pay 55k for one.

3- The first generation gt500 pretty much sucked. Coming from two previous 03 cobra's. those new gen car's took a big step backwards ( again except in the hp rating, which seems to be the main focus of those car's, not overall performance). I had a mildly modified 08 gt500 and would seriously take a new 5.0 over that car if I was buying a mustang. not impressed

1. With upwards of 700 HP and an 8 speed automatic transmission, I wont be surprised to see this car run basement 11s@127-128.

2. Mine is in my garage. 56,xxx with Recaros.. plus tax and title etc.. but 55K isn't a mythical number at all.

3. Who cares how it handled. It didn't have anything in its market to compete with other than to destroy things in a straight line.