06-12-2013, 09:13 PM | #57 | |
Drives: Toyota Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 79
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06-12-2013, 09:21 PM | #58 | |
Drives: Toyota Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 79
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So there is less than a half inch in the bore size (that is about what I thought). If the coyote used the same bore size (if it could), the head would not have to be more than half inch wider. You make it sound like it would add ten inches and 400 pound to the motor. That is why I said you are overplaying the "packaging" myth. Yes the OHC head is wider, but it fits and it can fit on a 400 cubic inch motor and fit in the Mustang if Ford would have designed it that way. Ford just went all in on a 5.0 without any thought to displacement flexibility, and it got boxed into that size. Ford needs to dump the 5.0 and build a coyote for more cubic inches. |
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06-12-2013, 09:25 PM | #59 |
Drives: Toyota Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 79
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Guys I have enjoyed the spirited debate. I am going to surf around some so I will let you guys have at it for a while. The LS is a great engine and I am thinking of buying one, so I am not some Ford troll. My ex-father-in-law used to work at an auto parts store and he told me he sold more Ford parts than any other make, which told me Ford must have a lot of problems. I did have a Ford truck one time and it was always having mechanical problems of some kind. LOL.
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06-12-2013, 09:38 PM | #60 | |
Drives: 2015 SS 1LE Red Hot, 1970 Chevelle Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Chino, CA
Posts: 6,989
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A DOHC engine would make more power than OHV engine of the same displacement but me a MUCH larger engine overall. OHV and DOHC are two different ways to produce similar results. It just takes OHV engines more displacement to produce equal power while DOHC engines are physically larger. |
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06-13-2013, 01:11 AM | #61 | |
Drives: Exige, Miata, Ghia Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: CA, Bay Area
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LOL. The fact of the matter is that Chevy never had to stray from a pushrod because it works so well. Tell me WHY do they NEED to go to a overhead cam design? I would love to hear this one. The Corvette is one of the best performers out there and still uses the "outdated" design that you tout as being inferior while being one of the most efficient. How many other big displacement V8's out there can get the same MPG with the power output. And do you seriously not know why they use fiberglass for the body? No other car companies use fiberglass besides cheap replicas and boats? Ever heard of Lotus? |
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06-13-2013, 01:19 AM | #62 | |
Drives: Exige, Miata, Ghia Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: CA, Bay Area
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You do understand that just because an engine has bigger displacement does not mean the form factor has to be bigger right? You don't seem to be able to grasp that point. |
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06-13-2013, 03:37 AM | #63 | |
Drives: . Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Phoenix
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06-13-2013, 03:40 AM | #64 | |
Drives: . Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Phoenix
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06-13-2013, 04:24 AM | #65 |
Drives: 2013 A6 GT 5.0 Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Edmond, OK
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This is funny and the whole HP per displacement sounds like a ricer excuse. What does it really matter since the LS3 makes more power.
A. The LS3 makes more power and torque than a Coyote. Period. B. The LS3 gets the same mpg as the Coyote. C. The LS3 weighs less than the Coyote. D. The LS3 has less moving parts than the Coyote. E. The LS3 cost less to mfg than the Coyote. F. The LS3 exterior deminsions are smaller than a Coyote The whole the Coyote makes more power per displacement is a excuse. If GM made a pushrod 8.0 that made 450HP, 450 tq, weighs 450lbs, got 26mpg,and cost 9k vs a Ford DOHC V8 4.0 that made 440HP, 440TQ, weighs 460lbs, 26mpg and cost 10k what does it really matter that the GM engine is twice the displacement. It makes more power, weighs less, exterior deminsions are smaller, gets the same mpg and cost less to produce. GM motor FTW If the Ford marketing team hadn't got their claws into the Coyote all this would be a mute point and there would be no debate. The Ford engineering team wanted to take the aluminum 5.4 that they already desinged, put the Coyote DOHC heads, intake and VVT on it with 11.1 compression but the marketing team in their wisdom said no lets bring back the 5.0 so the car will sell better. If Ford had made a Coyote 5.4 the whole LS3 VS Coyote would be dead. The whole Camaro vs Mustang would have also been dead and well the Camaro would have probably died as well. A 5.4 Coyote would have had a minimum 450HP with much more torque than it has now all while costing the same or less to mfg and alot less to R and D.
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06-13-2013, 11:17 AM | #66 |
I find it pretty funny that TexasChile dismisses the LS and other pushrod motors as obsolete, yet the overhead cam engine has been around for over a hundred years...
There were quite a few reasons why I went with my 5.0 over the Camaro in the end, but the engine sure as hell wasn't one of them. I could give f***-all about whether an engine's pushrod or OHC, as long as it's reliable, affordable and makes the power/torque I want.
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Gone: 2011 Ford Mustang GT Premium (Sterling Gray Metallic, HID/Security Pkg, Brembo Pkg, 6M) Current: 2015 Dodge Challenger R/T Scat Pack (Ivory White Tri-coat Pearl, Driver Convenience Grp, Leather Interior Grp, 8A) Future(?): 2018 Chevrolet Camaro 2SS (Hyper Blue Metallic, NPP, 56R, 6M) or Ford Mustang GT Premium (Lightning Blue Metallic, Active Exhaust, Performance Package, 401A Package, Spoiler Delete, 6M) |
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06-13-2013, 11:56 AM | #67 | |
Drives: . Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Phoenix
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06-13-2013, 08:19 PM | #68 |
Drives: 2013 Ram Express Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Seguin Texas
Posts: 228
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VVT on a pushrod engine (unless it's a Viper) is just for emissions, on a DOHC with dual phasers it allows you to change the overlap and increase the powerband of the engine. Right now why would Ford need more than 5.0 displacement? And do the pro pushrod boy's think a HD is in the same league as the typical DOHC motorcycle engine? I agree about the physical size but LS engines are limited to port size, and spark plug placement, the Chrysler HEMIS are much closer to being the "state of the art" push rod engine being held back by very limited aftermarket support.
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06-13-2013, 09:10 PM | #69 | |
Drives: 2015 Z/28 #533 Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: NY
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06-13-2013, 10:55 PM | #70 | |
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Then I was surprised to learn that an engineer named John Wilkinson had designed and built an overhead cam engine...in 1898. Which would mean that OHC engines had predated OHV engines by four years...
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Gone: 2011 Ford Mustang GT Premium (Sterling Gray Metallic, HID/Security Pkg, Brembo Pkg, 6M) Current: 2015 Dodge Challenger R/T Scat Pack (Ivory White Tri-coat Pearl, Driver Convenience Grp, Leather Interior Grp, 8A) Future(?): 2018 Chevrolet Camaro 2SS (Hyper Blue Metallic, NPP, 56R, 6M) or Ford Mustang GT Premium (Lightning Blue Metallic, Active Exhaust, Performance Package, 401A Package, Spoiler Delete, 6M) Last edited by antimatr; 06-14-2013 at 11:39 PM. |
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