Please keep calling GM and complaining about AFM!!! - Page 3 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

Darin Morgan · 11-01-2009, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwoEcho

I have never had a dealer turn down a test drive. Hell, I was 22 years old, stationed in Germany, and was able to test drive a 97 Dodge Viper on the Autobahn with nothing more than a drivers license and a 500 dollar "insurance" deposit (which they refunded when I brought the car back in one piece). I test drove both the M6 and the A6 before I bought my car. Took it on the interstate and the dealer told me to go as fast as I wanted...

had to order mine with NO TEST DRIVE because there where no dealers around here who would let us. This is quite common for this car. Surprised you have no heard that.

Darin Morgan · 11-01-2009, 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speedfreak

There is no reason it should not have an off setting.

Look at CAGS they claim it helps mileage (which is not true) and what does everyone do? Drive past it, ie drive the car harder so you don't have to deal with it...or CAGS elimiator

I agree. Mike at New Era Performance helps me tune with the HPtuner software. He gave me a tune to effectively kill the AFM below 55mph. I was amazed at how much more enjoyable the car is to drive with that damn AFM kicking in and out in city driving. I dont mind it a bit on the highway because that's what its for. I went ahead and modified the tune so it wont kick in under 60mph and is dead up to 5th and 6th gear. I put up with it for weeks then my wife (Prostock69) complained about it and that was it. I had to tune it out. The aggravation grows on you until you cant stand it anymore! They need an on off switch that allows the driver to either make it far less agressive or so it shuts off for city driving.

ORANGE U NV · 11-01-2009, 11:43 AM

I gotta agree, it only seems to aggravate me more and more. I missed the TSB....what was GM's spin?

ORANGE U NV · 11-01-2009, 11:54 AM

I live on a 25 mph street. I back my car out, shift to drive, and after I pass like 5 houses I let off the gas only to hear that unholy buzzing and vibration of the AFM. I get 30 secounds of driving pleasure before I wanna punch a engineer right in the mouth!

Thanks for letting me vent.......my wife has cut me off on this topic.

Darin Morgan · 11-01-2009, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ORANGE U NV

I live on a 25 mph street. I back my car out, shift to drive, and after I pass like 5 houses I let off the gas only to hear that unholy buzzing and vibration of the AFM. I get 30 secounds of driving pleasure before I wanna punch a engineer right in the mouth!

Thanks for letting me vent.......my wife has cut me off on this topic.

I also live on a 25mph street so I know EXACTLY what you mean.

Tomato · 11-01-2009, 01:09 PM

Glad I'm not the only one! It definitely seems like an engineering glitch or oversight. Why on earth would anyone want it to come on at such low speeds? There's no way that's going to save gas, as it bounces in and out at the slightest touch of the throttle.

The bulletin basically instructs dealers to "use the paddles and shift down." It's ridiculous, but at least we know we have their attention.

I even posted on "Ask Fritz."

My post: Please have your engineering team update the active fuel management program in the new Camaro. Should activate only under certain conditions-today, it comes on at any speed and any transmission or Stabilitrak setting.

Response: The information will be passed along to our product team. If you believe your new Camaro is not operating correctly, we would encourage you to visit your Chevrolet dealer and ask that they perform a diagnostic review. -Brent Dewar, GM Vice President, Chevrolet

ORANGE U NV · 11-01-2009, 01:34 PM

If you believe your new Camaro is not operating correctly, we would encourage you to visit your Chevrolet dealer and ask that they perform a diagnostic review. -Brent Dewar, GM Vice President, Chevrolet[/QUOTE]

That IS the problem.... GM designed it to work like that. Do the vettes have this AFM trash on them?

*DGthe3* · 11-01-2009, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ORANGE U NV

That IS the problem.... GM designed it to work like that. Do the vettes have this AFM trash on them?

no because they are efficient enough to avoid the gas guzzler tax without it

Darin Morgan · 11-01-2009, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DGthe3

The reason why everything would heat up is because coolant circulates through the entire engine and aluminum (well, any metal) conducts heat very good. The actual pistons themselves might not get up to temp as fast, but the walls won't know the difference. Each de-activated cylinder is adjacent to 1 active cylinder. Overall, the engine won't be terribly different than one with all 8 cylinders firing. If it didn't have an integrated thermal management system it might be a bit different.

This is completely wrong. If you run DOD/AFM to long or on a cold engine or at high load it can and does do damage over time. If the DOD/AFM is operating outside certain parameters It warps the cylinders adjacent to the active ones and increases bore, piston ring wear substantially! Any thermal gradient in an engine will do the same thing. Its not something that happens instantly. It will eventually cause the engine to use more oil, leak down cylinder pressure and make far less power over time. Activate the DOD/AFM for extended periods on an engine that is to cold or in a high load scenario and your going to damage the cylinder in short order! Below are the tuning parameters tuned into my AFM. I have it coming on at 55mph and not 1 mph sooner. It is deactivated in 1st,2nd and 3rd gears as well. You can see by the pictures below that there are many variables involved. Nothing very complex mind you. Its just load (MAN pressure TPS position) and preset parameters but get them wrong, hold it in to long for extended periods and damage occurs.

AFM/DOD active on a cold engine (high thermal gradient) is the worst thing I can think of.

P.S. I will be the first to admit that I am a newb at tuning the Camaro and especially AFM/DOD. Thanks to Mike at New Era Performance for helping out with this piece of shit AFM.

ORANGE U NV · 11-01-2009, 01:53 PM

Ok, so GM wants to avoid a "gas gussler tax" to keep the MSRP down...makes sense. But how much cheaper would a LS3/Auto be to produce than the more complex L99?

(The LS3 stick is 16/24 w/ no added tax compared to the L99/auto at 16/25.)

9c1ny · 11-01-2009, 02:12 PM

Mike at New Era tuned mine out, no regrets here

Tomato · 11-01-2009, 02:25 PM

Can't comment on the MPG for the Camaro, but I can attest to the amazing job GM has done withOUT AFM. Cases in point: My '03 Z06 would get 31 MPG cruising on the highway in 6th gear. My '06 Z06 got 28 MPG, same scenario. A 7.0 liter, 505 HP motor getting that is amazing. Flip side - had a SLK55 AMG for a while, and paid a $1300 guzzler tax on it. It's 5.5 liter, 355 HP motor only got 18 MPG on the highway in 7th gear...

Ject · 11-01-2009, 02:26 PM

In the end, I would assume the only way to get what we are asking... is to have our cars tuned.

Darin Morgan · 11-01-2009, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ject

In the end, I would assume the only way to get what we are asking... is to have our cars tuned.

I think your right.

11-01-2009, 11:43 AM	#31
ORANGE U NV Drives: The Wife Crazy Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: TAMPA BAY Posts: 550	I gotta agree, it only seems to aggravate me more and more. I missed the TSB....what was GM's spin? __________________ "God is great, beer is good and people are crazy" 2010 2SS IOM/IOM L99 Black Rally Stripes, Polished Wheels, Loudmouth II, Rotofab CAI, IOM Heritage Grille,Tune by Jeremy Formato (Fasterproms Tuning).

11-01-2009, 11:54 AM	#32
ORANGE U NV Drives: The Wife Crazy Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: TAMPA BAY Posts: 550	I live on a 25 mph street. I back my car out, shift to drive, and after I pass like 5 houses I let off the gas only to hear that unholy buzzing and vibration of the AFM. I get 30 secounds of driving pleasure before I wanna punch a engineer right in the mouth! Thanks for letting me vent.......my wife has cut me off on this topic. __________________ "God is great, beer is good and people are crazy" 2010 2SS IOM/IOM L99 Black Rally Stripes, Polished Wheels, Loudmouth II, Rotofab CAI, IOM Heritage Grille,Tune by Jeremy Formato (Fasterproms Tuning).

11-01-2009, 01:34 PM	#35
ORANGE U NV Drives: The Wife Crazy Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: TAMPA BAY Posts: 550	If you believe your new Camaro is not operating correctly, we would encourage you to visit your Chevrolet dealer and ask that they perform a diagnostic review. -Brent Dewar, GM Vice President, Chevrolet[/QUOTE] That IS the problem.... GM designed it to work like that. Do the vettes have this AFM trash on them? __________________ "God is great, beer is good and people are crazy" 2010 2SS IOM/IOM L99 Black Rally Stripes, Polished Wheels, Loudmouth II, Rotofab CAI, IOM Heritage Grille,Tune by Jeremy Formato (Fasterproms Tuning).

11-01-2009, 01:53 PM	#38
ORANGE U NV Drives: The Wife Crazy Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: TAMPA BAY Posts: 550	Ok, so GM wants to avoid a "gas gussler tax" to keep the MSRP down...makes sense. But how much cheaper would a LS3/Auto be to produce than the more complex L99? (The LS3 stick is 16/24 w/ no added tax compared to the L99/auto at 16/25.) __________________ "God is great, beer is good and people are crazy" 2010 2SS IOM/IOM L99 Black Rally Stripes, Polished Wheels, Loudmouth II, Rotofab CAI, IOM Heritage Grille,Tune by Jeremy Formato (Fasterproms Tuning).

11-01-2009, 02:12 PM	#39
9c1ny Drives: C6 Zed-oh-six Join Date: May 2009 Location: Buffalo NY Posts: 677	Mike at New Era tuned mine out, no regrets here __________________

11-01-2009, 01:09 PM	#34
Tomato G-Force Addict Drives: 2010 SS/RS A6 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Escalon, CA Posts: 196	Glad I'm not the only one! It definitely seems like an engineering glitch or oversight. Why on earth would anyone want it to come on at such low speeds? There's no way that's going to save gas, as it bounces in and out at the slightest touch of the throttle. The bulletin basically instructs dealers to "use the paddles and shift down." It's ridiculous, but at least we know we have their attention. I even posted on "Ask Fritz." My post: Please have your engineering team update the active fuel management program in the new Camaro. Should activate only under certain conditions-today, it comes on at any speed and any transmission or Stabilitrak setting. Response: The information will be passed along to our product team. If you believe your new Camaro is not operating correctly, we would encourage you to visit your Chevrolet dealer and ask that they perform a diagnostic review. -Brent Dewar, GM Vice President, Chevrolet

11-01-2009, 02:25 PM	#40
Tomato G-Force Addict Drives: 2010 SS/RS A6 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Escalon, CA Posts: 196	Can't comment on the MPG for the Camaro, but I can attest to the amazing job GM has done withOUT AFM. Cases in point: My '03 Z06 would get 31 MPG cruising on the highway in 6th gear. My '06 Z06 got 28 MPG, same scenario. A 7.0 liter, 505 HP motor getting that is amazing. Flip side - had a SLK55 AMG for a while, and paid a $1300 guzzler tax on it. It's 5.5 liter, 355 HP motor only got 18 MPG on the highway in 7th gear...

11-01-2009, 02:26 PM	#41
Ject aka Patrick Drives: '10 Camaro 2SS '04 Silverado Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Derby Kansas Posts: 3,072	In the end, I would assume the only way to get what we are asking... is to have our cars tuned. __________________ Current Modifications: Your average Bolt-ons & Suspension Upgrades GForce Engineering: 9" Rear End, Strange Pro Iron Case w/Moser Nodular 3.70:1 Detroit locker, 3.5" Solid Drive Shaft