why are there new fees for re-tuning???

[Smkymts]

I have a question that I haven't found an answer to yet.

I understand that if you want better performance than the stock tune you have to pay a tuner a "fee" to break the code or software user fee. Then you pay the tunner an hourly rate to do a custom tune.

Say your tuner goes out of business or dies. You want more boost and add a pulley and need a re-tune. Since you can not go back to the first tuner you have to go to another.

I find that you have to pay the "user or software fee again" on top of the hourly rate? That doesn't sound fair! If the first tuner and the second tuner uses the same tuning software why must the owner pay the fee a second time. I understand if they used different software, but why the additional fee if the same software is being used to update the tune by a different tuner.

It seems that no tuner wants to build on the previous tune, all the tuners I contacted want to re-invent the tune by starting from scratch.

Can some of you tuners explain why that is?????

I understand that most tuners offer free updates or discounted updates, but if you have to switch tuners you are forced to start over from scratch!!

[SSMickey]

The license fee is so that tuner can use his copy of the tuning software to tune your car. You have to pay the license fee again so the new tuner can use his copy of the software to tune your vehicle. As for reinventing the wheel, from what I understand, most tuners lock there tunes so someone else can't retune, screw it up and then the owner blame the original tuner. Makes sense and I agree with it.

[Tampa Tuning]

I do not lock tunes. I rarely even see or hear about tunes (access to the PCM) being locked anymore, but it only takes a click of the mouse to lock it.

HP Tuners is the best tuning platform being used. EFI is also very good.

When I tune a vehicle with HP Tuners, I pay $100 bucks a vehicle so the VIN is licensed to my HP Tuner interface. You can also purchase unlimited credits at a higher bulk price. Your VIN in now licensed to my interface and not my computer. I can change my computer 100 times, and it doesnt effect cost.

Once your vehicle is licensed to my interface, I can change the tune in your car a million times and it would not cost me anymore, but if you went to another tuner, He would again have to pay the cost to license your vehicle to his interface.

When I retune a car that has been with a differant tuner, depending on who the local tuner is, I do have to start from scratch. Some guys just want a touch up after adding a part. The hand held units I can build on because they did not enhance the configuration enough. They are normally a light baseline tune.

I hope that helps,
Phil

[Steck]

As mentioned, the licensing is applied every time a new cable is use. I paid a lot of money to not have to keep licensing vehicles, so even though I don't incur that expense anymore, I still charge it to recoup my money.

As for starting from scratch, I usually do because after I tune it, I am responsible for it. I don't want to be responsible for something a previous tuner may have screwed up.

Gotta pay to play.

[apeko]

Originally Posted by Smkymts

I have a question that I haven't found an answer to yet.

I understand that if you want better performance than the stock tune you have to pay a tuner a "fee" to break the code or software user fee. Then you pay the tunner an hourly rate to do a custom tune.

Say your tuner goes out of business or dies. You want more boost and add a pulley and need a re-tune. Since you can not go back to the first tuner you have to go to another.

I find that you have to pay the "user or software fee again" on top of the hourly rate? That doesn't sound fair! If the first tuner and the second tuner uses the same tuning software why must the owner pay the fee a second time. I understand if they used different software, but why the additional fee if the same software is being used to update the tune by a different tuner.

It seems that no tuner wants to build on the previous tune, all the tuners I contacted want to re-invent the tune by starting from scratch.

Can some of you tuners explain why that is?????

I understand that most tuners offer free updates or discounted updates, but if you have to switch tuners you are forced to start over from scratch!!

I don’t understand why you would expect someone to work for free or cover your fees? That is just the cost of moding your car. I know i expect to be paid my full wage when I am at work why shouldn’t the tuners?

[Smkymts]

I expect to pay to play. I even expect to pay for a tuners time. I have found that not all tuners are are talented. I say talent because this is not an exact science. I liken it to a painter or a fine musician. It takes an artist to understand the fine strokes it takes to make the engine sing as well as a technician to understand the physical limits of the parts and the engine as a whole.
As such, I am willing to pay the higher cost to get a masterpiece. What is baffeling to me is, why does the masterpiece have to be thrown away and tried to be reinvented just because I want to add a new part and my old tuner /"artist" has retired. Why can't the new tuner recognize the finer points of a master tune that has worked flawlessly and build on it or tweek it to accomidate the new part, say headers. In this example, the tune is running at peak effectiveness but when you add headers it will throw the air pressure and mixture off. I would think this would only require some slight mods. But most if not all want to charge a new license fee and then a hourly rate on top of that fee to rewrite "their tune".

By all means the tuner should charge for his/her time and skill to write or mod a tune for the new part added, but to charge to reinvent the wheel that already works and another license fee when they use the same HP software seems much.

[geaux_tigerss]

Seriously, it's a $100 unlock fee. Nothing to even lose sleep over. You're also paying for an expert's time. Do you work for free? Even if the tuner was okay with modifying someone else's tune, would you want him to make a few modifications to your tune without first verifying what the tune was? There are a lost of fly by night tuners out there. There's no way to really know that yours was done by a "master."

If I was a tuner there is no way in hell I would modify someone elses tune and put my reputation to it. To continue your analogy that would be like someone adding adding another tree to the background of the mona lisa. Sure, it could be done, but whoever does it is going to absolve all liability, charge an arm and a leg, and ultimately may decline anyway, because face it, who wants to be known as the guy that wrecked the mona lisa if something goes wrong?

[Slowhawk]

Find a good tuner/shop that won't close the door's.