Most, never offer what I want...esp US companies

[Cubanaso]

Hello folks!

Most of you know that I own an Mazda RX8 which overall I just love, but with gas as high as it is and driving 60 miles on the highway daily I need better than 22-23.5mpg on the highway while still having rear seats than can hold at least 2 kids (in the future a rear facing baby seat).

So, for my next car I'll need at least a 2+2 or sadan. Considering that I'm a sports car guy to the core the idea of saving gas with a FWD sadan or coupe just leaves a heartbroken feeling right to my core. LOL

So, my options are limited to something RWD that can carry at least 4 people in relative comfort and save gas at the same time.

I've looked and looked, waited for the Camaro since early 2003, lusted after the G8, BMW 328-335, Genesis coupe, Audi A4, and even that concept from GM Coupe 60.

I've been trying to buy American all my life, but based on what I could afford or my needs at the time I have been unable. Now, looking at a possible 2011 purchase (yes, I have tons of time but I'm Mr. Research and might get something sooner).

Which leaves me in the hole I'm in, GM nor Dodge can offer me something that can work with what I'm looking for. Sure, the Camaro V6 has the looks and appears to be a good product overall but what I wanted was a V8 Camaro and would only sacrifice space if I could own a lovely V8 so I'm leaning away from the car I've lusted for since the Transformers movie.

Which leaves me with the only other thing GM can offer me that I'd love to own, the G8 but they go and screw that up by forcing an automatic on me. Hence...that's also dead in the water also for me because I can't stand auto.

Oh, that lovely Coupe 60 with huge back seats...Well, I've lusted after that also but who knows if that will EVER come here. GM apparently thinks a new El Camino would make more sense....as retarded as that is to me, so that probably wont happen either.

Not to mention that both the G8 and Camaro V8 will get crappy fuel economy because of their mass. Note: Actually because of their mass it's very respectful fuel economy actually but not good enough over my car to make "fuel economy sense".

So, that leaves me disappointed again that I can't buy American nor GM...nor get my V8.

Who is left? Not much...a German company and a Koren. The BMW 328 or 335 (used, I can't afford a new one) and the up and coming Genesis Coupe. Both fit me best.

It leaves me disappointed in the US car companies and GM, whom I so wanted to buy from considering I like the look of the G8/Camaro and love their engines. I guess...they just don't get me as a car enthusiast and I'm forced to look elsewhere.

It's like one way or the other, they don't get me and blow some detail that leaves me looking and buying elsewhere.

Sad state of affairs for me...I'd love the Camaro/G8/Coupe 60 in my garage considering that I can't keep this up, and my next car I'll drive it till the wheels fall off.

:(

[Beelzebubba]

Well, I like my Mazda6

My Mazda6S hatchback looks a bit like what would happen if an RX8 mated with an Acura TL...to me it does anyway.

It handles as well as my old Integra GS-R which is pretty damn good for a FWD car, especially one of this size. Better than the Accord and Altima. A LOT better than the Camry, Optima, Sonata, Sebring..etc... Didn't get a chance to check the Malibu yet.

It's made in Flat Rock, Michigan at Auto Alliance International by UAW workers

I average 22-23 mpg combined. I get a good solid 30mpg with the cruise set at 72 and the air on.

But to get AWD you have to get the Mazdaspeed 6 and they don't make that anymore. Or you have to get the Ford Fusion and that doesn't come in a manual. (not to mention that they threw away the gated auto/manual shifter from the Mazda and put in a dumpy old Taurus style shifter, moved the headlight switch down low on the dash where you'll never find it in the dark...screwed with all the switchgear really... )

And the new 09 Mazda6S is supposed to have 272 hp....but it doesn't come in a hatchback.

I like my Mazda...I just want a Camaro.

Wanting truly is the cause of all suffering :seesaw:

[theholycow]

Originally Posted by Cubanaso

So, my options are limited to something RWD that can carry at least 4 people in relative comfort and save gas at the same time.

I've looked and looked, waited for the Camaro since early 2003, lusted after the G8, BMW 328-335, Genesis coupe, Audi A4, and even that concept from GM Coupe 60.

Sure, the Camaro V6 has the looks and appears to be a good product overall but what I wanted was a V8 Camaro and would only sacrifice space if I could own a lovely V8 so I'm leaning away from the car I've lusted for since the Transformers movie.

Who is left? Not much...a German company and a Koren. The BMW 328 or 335 (used, I can't afford a new one) and the up and coming Genesis Coupe. Both fit me best.

You won't consider the Camaro because the V8 isn't practical for you, but every other car on your list (and the two you think fit you best) don't even offer a V8. I'm confused. I think I'm failing to understand some part of the Camaro part of the above quote...why would the V8 be sacrificing space, and if you're willing to sacrifice space to get the V8, why don't you get the V8?

I'm not trying to imply that the Camaro is necessarily right for you, but since you posted your reasoning here and I fail to understand your reasoning, it leaves me curious...

[KILLER74Z28]

Originally Posted by theholycow

You won't consider the Camaro because the V8 isn't practical for you, but every other car on your list (and the two you think fit you best) don't even offer a V8. I'm confused. I think I'm failing to understand some part of the Camaro part of the above quote...why would the V8 be sacrificing space, and if you're willing to sacrifice space to get the V8, why don't you get the V8?

I'm not trying to imply that the Camaro is necessarily right for you, but since you posted your reasoning here and I fail to understand your reasoning, it leaves me curious...

+ 1

[Cubanaso]

You won't consider the Camaro because the V8 isn't practical for you, but every other car on your list (and the two you think fit you best) don't even offer a V8. I'm confused. I think I'm failing to understand some part of the Camaro part of the above quote...why would the V8 be sacrificing space, and if you're willing to sacrifice space to get the V8, why don't you get the V8?

I'm not trying to imply that the Camaro is necessarily right for you, but since you posted your reasoning here and I fail to understand your reasoning, it leaves me curious...

My reasoning is this, if I was going to get the Camaro (which would mean I sacrifice tons of space in the rear) then it would have to be for the V8. Since, the V8 (mainly because of it's weight) will have only 1 mpg more in the highway I should probably just stick with what I got and save on the monthly bill. There is the option of the V6, but I don't want a Camaro if it does not have the V8.

So, if I can't get a V8 then I'd at least like RWD 2+2 or Sadan. GM has the G8, but then forces you into a automatic. So, with the G8 at least I'd get 2mpg more in the highway and a large rear seat area. Then...GM screws that up for me by forces the automatic. I've even considered letting go of my love for stick and getting the auto anyways but I'd like to avoid that if possible.

So...then I'm left with the BMW (year old or so) or the Genesis, new probably but I don't know the price yet. Mazda had a AWD 6 but it's long gone and it didn't get great gas mileage either.

So...I'm thinking I can't consider the Camaro because as much as I love it's looks, I don't want one without a V8.

I still have not made up my mind, I'm still debating on what I'll do. I don't know the final price of the SS nor how usable the rear is (while 29 inches of knee space kinda speaks for itself) with a future rear facing seat.

So, I'd consider other cars that save me more gas and offer much better space in the rear. Hence...why I want a GM but they just seem to not offer me the best bang for my buck considering my needs.

I'm just voicing how I view my outlook on buying a GM. The G8 GT has 1k off and I can get almost employee pricing so I'd love to consider it, but then I'd be stuck with the dang automatic.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by Cubanaso

Hello folks!

Most of you know that I own an Mazda RX8 which overall I just love, but with gas as high as it is and driving 60 miles on the highway daily I need better than 22-23.5mpg on the highway while still having rear seats than can hold at least 2 kids (in the future a rear facing baby seat).

So, for my next car I'll need at least a 2+2 or sadan. Considering that I'm a sports car guy to the core the idea of saving gas with a FWD sadan or coupe just leaves a heartbroken feeling right to my core. LOL

So, my options are limited to something RWD that can carry at least 4 people in relative comfort and save gas at the same time.

I've looked and looked, waited for the Camaro since early 2003, lusted after the G8, BMW 328-335, Genesis coupe, Audi A4, and even that concept from GM Coupe 60.

I've been trying to buy American all my life, but based on what I could afford or my needs at the time I have been unable. Now, looking at a possible 2011 purchase (yes, I have tons of time but I'm Mr. Research and might get something sooner).

Which leaves me in the hole I'm in, GM nor Dodge can offer me something that can work with what I'm looking for. Sure, the Camaro V6 has the looks and appears to be a good product overall but what I wanted was a V8 Camaro and would only sacrifice space if I could own a lovely V8 so I'm leaning away from the car I've lusted for since the Transformers movie.

Which leaves me with the only other thing GM can offer me that I'd love to own, the G8 but they go and screw that up by forcing an automatic on me. Hence...that's also dead in the water also for me because I can't stand auto.

Oh, that lovely Coupe 60 with huge back seats...Well, I've lusted after that also but who knows if that will EVER come here. GM apparently thinks a new El Camino would make more sense....as retarded as that is to me, so that probably wont happen either.

Not to mention that both the G8 and Camaro V8 will get crappy fuel economy because of their mass. Note: Actually because of their mass it's very respectful fuel economy actually but not good enough over my car to make "fuel economy sense".

So, that leaves me disappointed again that I can't buy American nor GM...nor get my V8.

Who is left? Not much...a German company and a Koren. The BMW 328 or 335 (used, I can't afford a new one) and the up and coming Genesis Coupe. Both fit me best.

It leaves me disappointed in the US car companies and GM, whom I so wanted to buy from considering I like the look of the G8/Camaro and love their engines. I guess...they just don't get me as a car enthusiast and I'm forced to look elsewhere.

It's like one way or the other, they don't get me and blow some detail that leaves me looking and buying elsewhere.

Sad state of affairs for me...I'd love the Camaro/G8/Coupe 60 in my garage considering that I can't keep this up, and my next car I'll drive it till the wheels fall off.

:(

The Camaro SS and G8 GT both get better mileage than that RX8, under the new system it is rated at 22 mpg highway. And GM's V8's have a tendency to get very good highway mileage. So I'd expect real world numbers for the Camaro at about 25 or more if you take it easy on the highway.

[camaro&T/A]

for 2009 the G8 GXP comes out with a 6 speed stick. either the same year or the year after the G8 GT gets the manual.

[Cubanaso]

^Are you sure, so far all I hear from GM is "no stick" for the G8 GT. The GXP will be priced out of my range and probably have worse fuel economy so it's a no go there either.

The Camaro SS and G8 GT both get better mileage than that RX8, under the new system it is rated at 22 mpg highway. And GM's V8's have a tendency to get very good highway mileage. So I'd expect real world numbers for the Camaro at about 25 or more if you take it easy on the highway.

THIS IS THE 3RD $#&)$%(#&%#)(#*$)(* time I've tried to respond, I keep hitting some &#)$(*%#)(%*#)%(* (lol, sorry folks) key on my laptop which backs me up to the front page!!!!!!!!!!!

LOL...sorry

Anyway, I'll recap because I grow tired...

1) I agree that the G8 and SS will probably get better fuel economy than the EPA gives it credit for considering that I consistently beat their old EPA numbers let alone the new ones.

2)Now, not very much more than the RX8 but who knows from my reading on forums I hear some folks who drive "normal fully" instead of "normal aggressive" are hitting high 20's with even normal aggressive hitting more than the EPA gives it credit for (25.something vs 24 per the EPA).

What remains...is the forced automatic on the G8, and the last few details on the SS.

I still feel let down by the US car makers, FOR ME that is, but I have time to consider all options till the very last minute of putting down my John Hancock.

[theholycow]

I still don't understand, but I'll pick out a couple specific bits that I find most difficult:

Originally Posted by Cubanaso

My reasoning is this, if I was going to get the Camaro (which would mean I sacrifice tons of space in the rear) then it would have to be for the V8. Since, the V8 (mainly because of it's weight) will have only 1 mpg more in the highway I should probably just stick with what I got and save on the monthly bill.

Can you rephrase that, or include more background info? I'm intrigued and want to understand. You are willing to sacrifice space to get the V8 Camaro, but (I'm guessing at some missing info here) only if it has a significant MPG advantage over your current car?

GM has the G8, but then forces you into a automatic.

The G8 shouldn't even make your list for that reason, and doesn't make mine.

So...I'm thinking I can't consider the Camaro because as much as I love it's looks, I don't want one without a V8.

See, here's a common attitude that I can't wrap my brain around: People would rather have no Camaro than a fast V6 Camaro (with more power than a classic V8).

I'm just voicing how I view my outlook on buying a GM. The G8 GT has 1k off and I can get almost employee pricing so I'd love to consider it, but then I'd be stuck with the dang automatic.

You don't want an automatic...don't waste your time thinking about the G8.

Is the Charger offered with a V8 and manual transmission? That might fit your needs, but then you'd be stuck driving a (yuck) Dodge...

[camaro&T/A]

no stick for the charger, as far as I know. I heard about the manual G8 from one of the car mag's web sites, but I dont think it was a "we think this will happen" type thing, I think it was a "GM said this will happen" type thing...

[The_Blur]

Wait for the Camaro. It'll be fine for space and will get better than 25 mpg if you drive conservatively, add an intake, and add an exhaust.

You could also get the V6. It will still punish most cars on the street and will easily attain 30 mpg with the same modifications.

[Cubanaso]

theholycow, the reason I consider the G8 is because I like it so much I wonder if I'd be willing to part ways with my beloved stick. I doubt it, but that's why I'd consider it.

The Camaro, again...it's looks are just great...no bout about it. But, if I'm sacrificing rear seating space then I'd want the V8 and not the V6. So I don't think I'd be willing to sacrifice rear space for the V6...while still a nice car itself.

Hence...I'm thinking of the BMW (slightly used) or the Genesis coupe, both of which offer what I'm looking for. With that said, I don't know the details of he Genesis coupe yet either so I'm holding off on that one too.

My sad complaint is, that I can't get my #1 or #2 or heck even my #3 choice with GM products like the G8, Camaro, or that shot in the sky Coupe 60. So, I conclude that GM in particular screws some detail to lose....again, ME...as a customer.

G8, no stick, a bit heavy and just slightly better fuel economy, but mainly the lack of stick.

Camaro, weight, super tight space in rear (why did I expect any different considering the Camaro history), and even less better fuel economy.

Coupe 60, a LONG SHOT of unknowns

Other GM products...none

I have to go for a while, but I'll say more if I still can't explain myself. Sorry if this is confusing.

[theholycow]

Originally Posted by The_Blur

Wait for the Camaro. It'll be fine for space and will get better than 25 mpg if you drive conservatively, add an intake, and add an exhaust.

Common misconception. If you think about it, it's not ture. Conservative drivers don't use a lot of airflow/high RPM, so the same intake/exhaust that flow acceptably at high RPM will flow completely freely at low RPM.

[theholycow]

Originally Posted by Cubanaso

The Camaro, again...it's looks are just great...no bout about it. But, if I'm sacrificing rear seating space then I'd want the V8 and not the V6.

So why not get the V8?

Are you looking for a new car specifically because you want to improve MPG vs. your current car?