Air suspension vs Springs and shocks

[live2well]

What are the pros and cons of each? Why would one want one over the other? Please and in small words please. :-)

[Brian@AirLift]

I'll get to this one this weekend! Crazy busy here at Air lift today!

[2010SLVRBULIT]

cost, ride, adjustability, and killer looks(scraped on air).

[Hess Motorsports]

This is simple....... What would you like your car to do? Each style of suspension has its place.

If you want to handle well and keep proper alignment specs, and want to be low but not too low, go with dampers and springs.

If you like the look of a slammed car, go with air-ride. Air ride has adjustments for ride height so therefore unless you get out and measure your car every time you raise or lower it, your alingment goes to $#!t. Also as the bag increases or decreases you are effectively changing your spring rate and how the car handles.

I have been building street/race/show cars for the better part of almost two decades and unless you're a weekend only show car guy, go with springs (or coil overs if you want to get a bit lower but still handle well; i.e. Pfadt Racing).

And yes.... I dare anyone riding on bags to tell me there car handles well at the track and if for some weird reason you beleive that, I have a plot of ocean front property in Vegas I'd love to sell you at a great deal!

[Brian@AirLift]

Mr Hess-

Apparently, you weren't at the Camaro5fest Track Attack. If you were, I would have taken you for a ride in a car with our full Performance Air Suspension..Stay tuned for more video of this car from that event. I suggest you watch the video links below.




http://youtu.be/wTf9vXhl9O8

http://youtu.be/5_j9uGo5Ew8

http://youtu.be/p8h0oUOf2KI




And you can have this beautiful home in Vegas for a mere $100.

Originally Posted by Hess Motorsports

This is simple....... What would you like your car to do? Each style of suspension has its place.

If you want to handle well and keep proper alignment specs, and want to be low but not too low, go with dampers and springs.

If you like the look of a slammed car, go with air-ride. Air ride has adjustments for ride height so therefore unless you get out and measure your car every time you raise or lower it, your alingment goes to $#!t. Also as the bag increases or decreases you are effectively changing your spring rate and how the car handles.

I have been building street/race/show cars for the better part of almost two decades and unless you're a weekend only show car guy, go with springs (or coil overs if you want to get a bit lower but still handle well; i.e. Pfadt Racing).

And yes.... I dare anyone riding on bags to tell me there car handles well at the track and if for some weird reason you beleive that, I have a plot of ocean front property in Vegas I'd love to sell you at a great deal!

[Hess Motorsports]

Like I said.... There is a palce for air-ride in the car culture. It just isn't for the track or for performance handling. If you want to prove me wrong... Show me ONE SINGLE real race team running air ride.

Enough said.

[Brian@AirLift]

Originally Posted by Hess Motorsports

Like I said.... There is a palce for air-ride in the car culture. It just isn't for the track or for performance handling. If you want to prove me wrong... Show me ONE SINGLE real race team running air ride.

Enough said.

Eric, we can agree to disagree! You stated that a car on air suspension can't handle good at the track. I have illustrated that it can for over 8 years now. I have data, video and countless other people's opinions that it works just as good as any STREET specced coil over WHEN it is properly engineered with attention to proper spring balance and damping, like our kits are.

I AGREE that IF you want to build a racecar, go buy a racing suspension. For the record, I work weekends for professional road race teams as a race engineer so I really do understand that air is not used for pure racing! HOWEVER, most people on this forum do not race their cars in any series and our suspension offers them all the benefits of having air like stance and ability to tailor ride height to any situation WITHOUT sacrificing handling capability OR ride comfort. Try keeping your expensive front lip from getting damaged with a coil suspension set at a decently low height.

The aim of my response is not to pick a fight but rather to illustrate that OUR air suspension DOES handle well while providing other benefits that coils can't. I understand that you are not a believer. Most of the vehicles that people have experienced on air were not great handling devices, usually because they were not properly engineered or installed. My mission is to put people in the seat so they can experience what I know to be true.

So, getting back to the original point of this thread....benefits of air in a nutshell: Drive it, show it, track it. You can do all 3! Go lower when parked than any coil, ride quality better than OEM, handles better than OEM (and some coils) on the racetrack.

[Marauder]

Originally Posted by Hess Motorsports

Like I said.... There is a palce for air-ride in the car culture. It just isn't for the track or for performance handling. If you want to prove me wrong... Show me ONE SINGLE real race team running air ride.

Enough said.

Just wanted to add a little to the conversation...


A 'real race team' uses purpose built race suspensions and their cars dont typically have to do double duty. Whereas most cars on this site have to adjust from daily driver, occasional track, car show, etc.

I have seen a number of comparisons on cars driven with air and without and very rarely are the static drop cars much faster. Yet they have no adjust-ability for speed bumps, steep departure and ascent angles of some driveways I have driven up, parking garages, etc.


In regards to your comment about alignment settings going out of whack. You are right if you only consider a narrow set of air kits on the market. Meaning the full manual setups. The majority of setups these days use self leveling computers that have height sensors at each corner. Set it at the ride height you want, lock it in as a preset, get it aligned, and you are good. Then if you have to go up the house on the hills driveway or that huge parking garage ramp, raise it up using a preset 'high' setting or manually air it up until you are over the obstacle and then hit the preset back to ride height and aligned. They also adjust for the times when you load 3 buddies in the car with you and the suspension sags on the static drop and wheels rub etc.

I am not saying air is better or worse. But to dismiss it as hocus pocus or somehow inferior is not fair or informed. And to push those opinions actually do harm.

Accuair and Air Ride Technologies make some pretty cool kits and computers. I am not as familiar with Airlift products, but I imagine they are just as good. Plus they are a supported of the site.

[live2well]

Hey thanks for the info guys. I get the convenience and all. But what about the durability? Leaky hoses and couplers and compressor? What is the durability like compared to the springs and such?


Also where does one get the air ride installed? One can get springs installed just about any where it seems.

[VictoryRacingEngines]

The installation is fairly simple. If you can install a set of springs or coils then Airlifts kit is within your skill set. No major mechanical tools required and with basic 12v knowledge you will be back on the road in no time.

Originally Posted by live2well

Also where does one get the air ride installed? One can get springs installed just about any where it seems.

[Cully]

I can tell you first hand that I have installed Airlifts kit and the my car is a pleasure car that may never see track use but it rides like a dream and looks killer. I can still drive up a steep driveway approach, hoist, ect without worrying about damaging the car. When it is layed out at a car show/gathering it commands attention. I would do this again and look forward to building an older truck with air ride as well. In my opinion it is the best of both worlds. And by the way it was installed in my garage with hand tools very easily with no need for spring compessors and such.

[Ivan @ Southwest Speed]

Originally Posted by Cully

I can tell you first hand that I have installed Airlifts kit and the my car is a pleasure car that may never see track use but it rides like a dream and looks killer. I can still drive up a steep driveway approach, hoist, ect without worrying about damaging the car. When it is layed out at a car show/gathering it commands attention. I would do this again and look forward to building an older truck with air ride as well. In my opinion it is the best of both worlds. And by the way it was installed in my garage with hand tools very easily with no need for spring compessors and such.

This picture alone would sell any of our Airlift customers.........

Damn great comparison pic!

Thanks for your input Cully,
Ivan

[VictoryRacingEngines]

Originally Posted by Cully

I can tell you first hand that I have installed Airlifts kit and the my car is a pleasure car that may never see track use but it rides like a dream and looks killer. I can still drive up a steep driveway approach, hoist, ect without worrying about damaging the car. When it is layed out at a car show/gathering it commands attention. I would do this again and look forward to building an older truck with air ride as well. In my opinion it is the best of both worlds. And by the way it was installed in my garage with hand tools very easily with no need for spring compessors and such.

[Cully]

Here is a couple more comparison photos of the stock versus lowered all the way.