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Old 03-20-2008, 11:20 PM   #57
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Might this shed some light on the economy/priceing advantages of using the 2.0L in a Camaro??

Quote:
Originally Posted by GM

Powered by a 260-horsepower (194 kW) turbocharged and intercooled 2.0L Ecotec engine, the Cobalt SS delivers a balance of track-proven performance capability, driving refinement and premium features. Offered exclusively with a five-speed manual transmission, it is also an efficient performer, delivering an estimated 30 mpg in highway driving – the best among top competitors.

That combination of performance, features and efficiency comes with a MSRP of $22,995, including a $660 destination charge.

http://media.gm.com/servlet/GatewayS...=3&docid=44499
Soooo...since this would probably be used with a 6-speed = increase efficiency. Add wieght = decrease efficiency. Net efficiency change: nada (or or very minimal)

Price.
VERY well equipped, top of the line Cobalt SS; Take away some toys. Take away some performance, and take away the 'SS' badging = slight price drop when found in the Camaro.

This isn't looking bad at all, imho.
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Old 03-20-2008, 11:21 PM   #58
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As for me, I've set one of my life's goals to be owning a car with power, as well as having a '69 camaro RS/SS as my uncle had one. I have never seen it, but I've always wanted a muscle car for the V8 rumble and I want to be able to own a car that others can envy and that I can drag or pull on people almost at will.
Exactly what I was thinking!

As far as the other engine options, to each his own!

Me, I'm going with the biggest and baddest option out there because I can and because a turbo charged 4 cyclinder does not sound like this.


Last edited by Wikkid1; 03-20-2008 at 11:28 PM. Reason: Fixed your YouTube embed.
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Old 03-20-2008, 11:55 PM   #59
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Speaking of that Vid, Where's MaZda?

But in response to Wikkid, I quote the way I assume you feel as it's what stovt and I agree with.

Quote:
Now if a 4 cylinder power plant allows us to keep our affordable V8s, then bring on the turbos!
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Old 03-21-2008, 12:05 AM   #60
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Before we heard from fbodfather on this subject, I wanted to start singing earlier "Oh where, oh where has the fbodfather gone... Oh where, oh where can he BEEEE?" lol

I still have very mixed emotions on this whole 4-cylinder thing... One thing I hate is to meet a Camaro on the road that has been riced out!
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Old 03-21-2008, 01:12 AM   #61
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Are people so retarded that they think rice is 4 cylinders? It isn't. It is putting gt-r emblems on a mustang, it is using park benches as wings that weigh 1/5 the weight of the car, it is putting a muffler tip on and not a full exhaust, it is putting 40lb chrome cheese-gradder rims on the car, not light weight racing ones. 4 CYLINDERS IS NOT RICE SO DROP IT PLEASE, OR GET EDUCATED. We all know what imports can do if they are built right, and if you don't you're ignorant either by choice or fate. Btw AMERICAN is doing what ever the hell you want with your money
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Old 03-21-2008, 01:22 AM   #62
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Are people so retarded that they think rice is 4 cylinders? It isn't. It is putting gt-r emblems on a mustang, it is using park benches as wings that weigh 1/5 the weight of the car, it is putting a muffler tip on and not a full exhaust, it is putting 40lb chrome cheese-gradder rims on the car, not light weight racing ones. 4 CYLINDERS IS NOT RICE SO DROP IT PLEASE, OR GET EDUCATED. We all know what imports can do if they are built right, and if you don't you're ignorant either by choice or fate. Btw AMERICAN is doing what ever the hell you want with your money
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Old 03-21-2008, 03:19 AM   #63
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To me rice has a different meaning. Rice is when someone does something cosmetic to a car and claims it as a racer. If you have a full out body kit/wing/rims/muffle without exhaust, hood, led washer lights, etc. and claim that the car is a racer and not just for car shows...you're a ricer

If you have a civic and put all your money into performance upgrades, you are a tuner.

If you have an integra and you want it to look "cool" (and I know it's relative) so you put a body kit and paint it to match, that's not rice unless you act ignorant.

If you have a 240 sx and put a drift wing, new front clip, etc and take it drifting/auto-xing, you are a driver, not a ricer

Only if you put cosmetic crap on your car and then drive around like a moron claiming, you're racing are you a ricer.


The 4 cylinder turbo camaro would be fine in my book. If people start putting rice wings/ground effects and all, that's their choice and GM might be able to cash in on it. On the other hand, teens that can't afford the V-8 but want a VERY INTENSE looking car without needing a body kit to change the camber and take it drifting with their import buddies who can't afford a "premium" car so that they can be the envy of their peers driving a GM vehicle, can purchase this and help the Camaro name stay around. While they have fun with their little toys, we get to stomp ponies and thrash around in our beasts.

I'm all for the Turbo. It means that us folk who want the adrenaline rush of our asses planted to the seat and the world turning blurry will get to experience our dream and not lose it after a year or two.
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Old 03-21-2008, 03:22 AM   #64
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This is why I thought the small RWD Pontiac G6 replacement was such a good idea. They could use the 2.0, make it pretty darn quick, offer it in coupe, sedan, and convertible body styles (fun for the whole family) and best of all make it pretty light and efficient.
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Old 03-21-2008, 05:48 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoFlaZ View Post
If the turbo I-4 can actually move the car and enable it to drive without revving it over 5K in every gear to get boost out of that 2.0, I say go for it. But I dont see it getting any better gas mileage than a equal hp V6.
Well I can attest to that if it has the same kind of 4-cylinder engine that I have in the Saab, I get it moving at far below 5k. Agreee on the mileage though, even though me and dad drive it pretty economically and gets decent mileage out of it.
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Old 03-21-2008, 08:56 AM   #66
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Well I can attest to that if it has the same kind of 4-cylinder engine that I have in the Saab, I get it moving at far below 5k. Agreee on the mileage though, even though me and dad drive it pretty economically and gets decent mileage out of it.
How much does the saab weigh? If its around the Camaro's weight, I say go for it if there is decent power and economy. Plus I was exaggerating a little with the 5K but its just to get a point across that it MIGHT not be as good as a V6.
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Old 03-21-2008, 09:47 AM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mindz View Post
To me rice has a different meaning. Rice is when someone does something cosmetic to a car and claims it as a racer. If you have a full out body kit/wing/rims/muffle without exhaust, hood, led washer lights, etc. and claim that the car is a racer and not just for car shows...you're a ricer

If you have a civic and put all your money into performance upgrades, you are a tuner.

If you have an integra and you want it to look "cool" (and I know it's relative) so you put a body kit and paint it to match, that's not rice unless you act ignorant.

If you have a 240 sx and put a drift wing, new front clip, etc and take it drifting/auto-xing, you are a driver, not a ricer

Only if you put cosmetic crap on your car and then drive around like a moron claiming, you're racing are you a ricer.

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Old 03-21-2008, 10:45 AM   #68
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After reading all this the last few days I've formed these opinions.

4cyl. offering will be fine. It it helps sales and keeps the car alive, great.
Tuners will undoubtedly have fun with this car.

The V6 must have been a misquote or reporter error. I can easily see how this would happen in the confusion of an Auto show interview. Makes no sense to purposely detune it to 260hp. It wil be 300.

I never expected this car to be as cheap as a Mustang. I'll gladly pay a couple of g's more for a better car.
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Old 03-21-2008, 10:54 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mindz View Post
To me rice has a different meaning. Rice is when someone does something cosmetic to a car and claims it as a racer. If you have a full out body kit/wing/rims/muffle without exhaust, hood, led washer lights, etc. and claim that the car is a racer and not just for car shows...you're a ricer

If you have a civic and put all your money into performance upgrades, you are a tuner.

If you have an integra and you want it to look "cool" (and I know it's relative) so you put a body kit and paint it to match, that's not rice unless you act ignorant.

If you have a 240 sx and put a drift wing, new front clip, etc and take it drifting/auto-xing, you are a driver, not a ricer

Only if you put cosmetic crap on your car and then drive around like a moron claiming, you're racing are you a ricer.


The 4 cylinder turbo camaro would be fine in my book. If people start putting rice wings/ground effects and all, that's their choice and GM might be able to cash in on it. On the other hand, teens that can't afford the V-8 but want a VERY INTENSE looking car without needing a body kit to change the camber and take it drifting with their import buddies who can't afford a "premium" car so that they can be the envy of their peers driving a GM vehicle, can purchase this and help the Camaro name stay around. While they have fun with their little toys, we get to stomp ponies and thrash around in our beasts.

I'm all for the Turbo. It means that us folk who want the adrenaline rush of our asses planted to the seat and the world turning blurry will get to experience our dream and not lose it after a year or two.
I think of rice in much the same way-bodykit, wing, and a fart pipe = RICE. Like was said already, if this could make the price of the V8s and the car overall come down, DO IT. A Camaro is a Camaro is a Camaro.
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Old 03-21-2008, 12:02 PM   #70
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The thing GM needs to consider also is type of gas. Most if not all DI or FI engines require premium fuel. If they have a V-6 at 250hp and a FI 4 at 260 (even with tunability of a turbo engine) most will opt for the 6 since it can run on 87 octane and not 91/93.

Another thing to consider is that they would broaden their audience by adding a turbo 4 to the options list. Look at what can be done with the 2.5l boxer from Subaru or the 4G63 (now 4B11) from Mitsubishi, easily 300hp with a lighter engine than a 6 or 8.

While they need to meet CAFÉ they can do it with other cars as well, volt, other hybrids, smaller cars, diesels. Every single car in the lineup doesn’t need to hit 35mpg. Of course having a lineup that’s not bloated with Trucks and SUV’s would help.
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