Camaro VS 370Z

[THE EVIL TW1N]

Originally Posted by Dom

Don't feel like reading the whole thread. I sat in both cars at the Chicago Autoshow and I loved the interior of the camaro and hated the 370Z. I also hated the new look of the 370Z. I drive a 00Z now and the only people who like those no torque japanese cars have never owned a muscle car. How do you give up all that V8 torque after experiencing it? The answer is you don't.

I've also driven tons of other high performance cars when I worked for a press fleet. All the Audi cars, S6, RS6, S4, RS4. I didn't even like the torque-less V8s that I had to spin to 7k as much as my LS1. Just talking about the engine itself, Audi make awesome cars. I would take my stock LS1 over any 400hp+ 4.2L German V8. Noticeably less torque. On the street I stay below 3k and have all the power I need. I have also driven the EVO VIII when it came out and it was a terrible daily driver. On paper it's got power, but it's very peaky and narrow. Once you go with a big V8 you never go back. I love that GM is staying with big displacement and increasing it all the time.

Soo.... when are you getting a big v8? or is 5.7L a big v8?

[Miketebo22]

i would say that a 5.7 350 is a decent sized V8...not an especially huge one, but its not small.

[DeathChill]

I don't know, I appreciate all cars and I definitely think the 370Z is a great looking car and the numbers it's putting out are impressive.

I'd consider one if I didn't have my daughter.

[cyberbro]

Originally Posted by Patrick

Why does nissan put the 2 air bag. infront of the car ?

[JMM1181]

Originally Posted by Dom

Don't feel like reading the whole thread. I sat in both cars at the Chicago Autoshow and I loved the interior of the camaro and hated the 370Z. I also hated the new look of the 370Z. I drive a 00Z now and the only people who like those no torque japanese cars have never owned a muscle car. How do you give up all that V8 torque after experiencing it? The answer is you don't.

I've also driven tons of other high performance cars when I worked for a press fleet. All the Audi cars, S6, RS6, S4, RS4. I didn't even like the torque-less V8s that I had to spin to 7k as much as my LS1. Just talking about the engine itself, Audi make awesome cars. I would take my stock LS1 over any 400hp+ 4.2L German V8. Noticeably less torque. On the street I stay below 3k and have all the power I need. I have also driven the EVO VIII when it came out and it was a terrible daily driver. On paper it's got power, but it's very peaky and narrow. Once you go with a big V8 you never go back. I love that GM is staying with big displacement and increasing it all the time.

wanna cookie?

it's all preference, I know what you're saying because I drive my bro's charger to get the torquey 'round town, low rpm, V8 and I enjoy it fully, but it takes nothing away from what makes the 370z a unique car- they're not the same driving experience for sure, but it won't be long before every other car on the road is a camaro again, and the 370z will at least still be somewhat rare in comparison. And any V6 which competes directly with some of the best v8's on the market impresses me.

[Wesman]

Originally Posted by JMM1181

wanna cookie?

it's all preference, I know what you're saying because I drive my bro's charger to get the torquey 'round town, low rpm, V8 and I enjoy it fully, but it takes nothing away from what makes the 370z a unique car- they're not the same driving experience for sure, but it won't be long before every other car on the road is a camaro again, and the 370z will at least still be somewhat rare in comparison. And any V6 which competes directly with some of the best v8's on the market impresses me.

I'm with Dom, I hate gutless engines. If it doesn't have good torque, its not high performance in my book. You can have all the power you want at 7500RPM, but it its got no balls in daily driving, its no fun at all. You can't run around all the time on the rev limiter, most cars are DD's and are driven as such. And thats where torque matters.

As for the V6 competing with the best V8's, not quite. The car itself can run close 1/4 mile times to some V8 equipped cars, but thats because its lighter, not because it matches them in power. If you put the 370's V6 in the Camaro SS, it would be a complete dog. And if you put the LS3 in the 370Z, it would be running high 11's.

GM's 3.6L V6 is actually a much better design than Nissan's VQ. Nissan's best N/A V6 produces 330HP - GM's mainstream V6 produces 300HP. Not exacty a huge gap. And GM's V6 still has more torque, gets better fuel economy, and is much better built - its got a fully forged crank and rods. Nissan's VQ is an open deck 2 bolt block, which is an inherently weak and not an ideal design for any engine.

And everyone who gave me props - thanks

[Wesman]

Originally Posted by GatorBlue371

BTW- This is For Wesman


http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take_road_test


Notice the 13.1 1/4 mile time....

Remember the ringer GTR's that Nissan sent out to the mags in the beginning too that were running 11's at 120MPH??

Then all of a sudden they get a regular production model and it's running low 12's at 114MPH?? Coincidence?? I think not.

Nissan is pathetic enough that they need to send out ringers to make their cars look like they perform better. There's no way the heavier automatic 370Z should be running faster - let alone the same times - as the manual equipped version, especially with the VQ's inherent lack of low end power, hindering any hard launches. That, coupled with the fact that automatics (especially 6 speeds) have much higher parasitic losses than a manual transmission, makes those times seem highly suspect.

[Wesman]

Originally Posted by Phenix

This thread just needs to end. It's obvious Wesman won't like anything that doesn't have a bowtie in the grill. And he's seriously misinformed about the build quality of Japanese cars and engines.

Misinformed?? Not quite.

I work on a variety of both American and Japanese cars every day. Even some German. I see how things are designed, put together, and how the cars themselves drive. I take notice of the details, the way a car shifts, the design of the suspension, the way the engine sounds, how the clutch takeup is, ect. I often research the designs of engines to see where problem areas are. And thats where I draw my conclusions from.

And from the japanese cars I've worked on, I've rarely been impressed by any of them, especially in terms of the way they sound and drive. My friend's STI's shifter might as well be a stick in a box of rocks, thats how imprecise and sloppy it is, on a car with only 20K miles. Its also a non-forged factory boosted motor running 14.7PSI - a monkey could tell you thats a bad idea. We had a low mileage 2.5 STi engine in the shop just recently that spun the rod bearings and was being completely rebuilt. Things like that matter.

In fact, I have a VW Jetta apart right now, pulled the entire engine and trans out and installed a new clutch at the same time. European cars are hit and miss, some things are bulletproof in design, other things make you wonder how anyone could be so stupid to design something like that.

[Outrun]

Originally Posted by DDA_Skull

LOL, I wanna go over to the 370Z sight and just piss them off. They havn't even seen Camaro Track Numbers and they are dissing it. Its a 4 seater, and if it keeps up with your 2 Door "Sports Car" Then thats pretty damn impressive. Sorry but i would go for a Saturn Sky or a Solstic over the 370Z, cause i don't want a 2 Door Maxima.

Why would you want to do that? Let it be. Btw, nice sig.

[JMM1181]

Originally Posted by Wesman

I'm with Dom, I hate gutless engines. If it doesn't have good torque, its not high performance in my book. You can have all the power you want at 7500RPM, but it its got no balls in daily driving, its no fun at all. You can't run around all the time on the rev limiter, most cars are DD's and are driven as such. And thats where torque matters.

As for the V6 competing with the best V8's, not quite. The car itself can run close 1/4 mile times to some V8 equipped cars, but thats because its lighter, not because it matches them in power. If you put the 370's V6 in the Camaro SS, it would be a complete dog. And if you put the LS3 in the 370Z, it would be running high 11's.

GM's 3.6L V6 is actually a much better design than Nissan's VQ. Nissan's best N/A V6 produces 330HP - GM's mainstream V6 produces 300HP. Not exacty a huge gap. And GM's V6 still has more torque, gets better fuel economy, and is much better built - its got a fully forged crank and rods. Nissan's VQ is an open deck 2 bolt block, which is an inherently weak and not an ideal design for any engine.

And everyone who gave me props - thanks

*(removed, apologies Wesman)* I'm sorry, does not compete? What planet are you living on? Let me state it again and hopefully some common sense may sink in, YES, this V6 all motor car will DIRECTLY COMPETE with the V8's in every single aspect, including drag- not just because it's lighter, but because it's an all around performance car. GM's V6 is certainly a great engine, but it's been put in tanks for cars, the Cadillac and Camaro, and sorry to say neither car will be competing with the performance of the 370z without some decent upgrades so I don't know what you're talking about being inherently weak. Your arguments are 'inherently weak' as is your comprehension. You contribute very little useful information but like a little 5 year old sit around waiting to shout insults about what Nissan's done- it's an extremely respectable car and you just refuse to admit it.

[JMM1181]

Originally Posted by Wesman

Remember the ringer GTR's that Nissan sent out to the mags in the beginning too that were running 11's at 120MPH??

Then all of a sudden they get a regular production model and it's running low 12's at 114MPH?? Coincidence?? I think not.

Nissan is pathetic enough that they need to send out ringers to make their cars look like they perform better. There's no way the heavier automatic 370Z should be running faster - let alone the same times - as the manual equipped version, especially with the VQ's inherent lack of low end power, hindering any hard launches. That, coupled with the fact that automatics (especially 6 speeds) have much higher parasitic losses than a manual transmission, makes those times seem highly suspect.

Remember when people were saying the Camaro was supposed to be a high 12's car and all of the sudden they get a production and it's running 13.5's and higher? uuhhh, yeah, about that.. so did Chevy send out their 'ringers' to make the car perform better? Just cause a car has the potential does not mean you will see it in every or even most situations. You talk about the 370z having no low end power, and the last time you drove one was? Exactly, because my 350z has power throughout the power band not just past 6k as you tend to believe in your muppet baby world, your logic seems highly suspect

[Evotion]

[GatorBlue371]

Originally Posted by Wesman

Remember the ringer GTR's that Nissan sent out to the mags in the beginning too that were running 11's at 120MPH??

Then all of a sudden they get a regular production model and it's running low 12's at 114MPH?? Coincidence?? I think not.

Nissan is pathetic enough that they need to send out ringers to make their cars look like they perform better. There's no way the heavier automatic 370Z should be running faster - let alone the same times - as the manual equipped version, especially with the VQ's inherent lack of low end power, hindering any hard launches. That, coupled with the fact that automatics (especially 6 speeds) have much higher parasitic losses than a manual transmission, makes those times seem highly suspect.

You opened up and removed all doubt. The car runs the same quarter mile as the camaro, and easier with less wheel spin. But if you really think that a US spec car that was tested not as a pre-production car, but a car tested MONTHS after it's release than you should take that up with the koolaid clan

[Wesman]

Originally Posted by JMM1181

man you are a complete idiot, I'm sorry, does not compete? What planet are you living on? Let me state it again and hopefully some common sense may sink in, YES, this V6 all motor car will DIRECTLY COMPETE with the V8's in every single aspect, including drag- not just because it's lighter, but because it's an all around performance car. GM's V6 is certainly a great engine, but it's been put in tanks for cars, the Cadillac and Camaro, and sorry to say neither car will be competing with the performance of the 370z without some decent upgrades so I don't know what you're talking about being inherently weak. Your arguments are 'inherently weak' as is your comprehension. You contribute very little useful information but like a little 5 year old sit around waiting to shout insults about what Nissan's done- it's an extremely respectable car and you just refuse to admit it.

Complete idiot?? I'm not the Nissan fanboy on a Camaro forum. Think about that a for a second before you start calling names.

Obviously you didn't read my post, you skimmed it and got all bent out of shape because I didn't "respect" your Nissan. Read it again.

I'll say it again - the 370Z can only run with the Camaro, Mustang, and Challenger because its much, much lighter. Its a 3.7L V6 putting down somewhere around 270HP at the wheels, engine wise there is no comparison. Like I said, if you put that engine in the Camaro, it would be slow as molasses.

LS3>>>VQ37 regardless of the vehicles that they are in. End of story, there is no debate. You bring up any aspect of the VQ you can think of, the LS series is better in every way. Power, sound, reliability, design, fuel economy, everything.

As for the VQ engine being inherently weak, I backed that up with the facts about its design, which you obviously neglected to read, or more likely you just had no idea what they meant so you skipped over that part too.

I "shouted" no "insults" in my last post. I merely stated the facts about the car and its design.