Dealership Closure List? Do we have one yet?

[bigd1276]

Originally Posted by chevydude26

your so off its not even funny...i'm not going to discuss this because it has nothing to do with the auto industry or gm...

created a false crisis? dude the whole world thought there were weapons there and some entitities believed those weapons were moved to syria but i'm not going further on this topic but this is a whole other topic and debate that makes no sense on a camaro forum

the economy was not a a rallying cause for the wars...nor an issue as it is today... not to mention shortly after 9/11 gm led the way with the 0% financing and helped our economy right after that incident..

+2

[Sinergy]

I just wish our founding fathers were running GM as well as our government.

[chevydude26]

Originally Posted by DkknightX

Do you feel the Afghan/Iraq war brought our country closer together? The soldiers that can no longer speak because of it could probably help you select an answer. The previous administration "created" a false crisis invading Iraq on the basis of the country possessing WMD and handling a situation they moreorless generated just about as poorly as the excuse to invade.

Crisis situations need to happen first in order to rally enough support for a strong solution and then the solution needs to be attainable. Seems that the government was banking on the possibility that by going to war with Iraq, the US would rally and the economy would flourish as it has in the past. Not so.

To say that times are not as tough now as opposed to what your grandparents experienced is debatable.

lol i also find it ironic that your screenname on this forum is based on a movie that is actually a movie that puts the past administration you seem to dislike in a good light and defends the past administration





ok no more no more its all love man



edit : ok this is my last partisan comment i don't want them to lock what is probably a pretty informative thread...i have love for all camaro fans regardless of where you stand politically...but i will defend gm from crappy falsehoods and myths

[DkknightX]

Originally Posted by chevydude26

your so off its not even funny...i'm not going to discuss this because it has nothing to do with the auto industry or gm...

created a false crisis? dude the whole world thought there were weapons there and some entitities believed those weapons were moved to syria but i'm not going further on this topic but this is a whole other topic and debate that makes no sense on a camaro forum

the economy was not a a rallying cause for the wars...nor an issue as it is today... not to mention shortly after 9/11 gm led the way with the 0% financing and helped our economy right after that incident..

Newsflash! There were no WMD'S LOL! NP man. Don't know why I posted to be honest. Go to Hawthorne and get your car!!

[chevydude26]

Originally Posted by DkknightX

Newsflash! There were no WMD'S LOL! NP man. Don't know why I posted to be honest. Go to Hawthorne and get your car!!

its all good...i don't hate people who disagree with me...i will tell you this i don't know if i can wait for that convertible because the camaro looks fantastic in person...i might just make that order...but i'm in no rush so i don't mind waiting...but i am worried about there not being a gm in a few years...then i'm going to be p*ssed that i have to find a used camaro at 40 to 50 thousand dollars because its a rare car

[qbert48]

Originally Posted by Sinergy

I just wish our founding fathers were running GM as well as our government.

[justmeron]

One thing that also kinda concerns me about the thinning of dealershops. I understand the reasoning but with say fewer chevey dealers around would the ones left then be able to jack ppl around cause they know they are the only game in town?
I say with this then GM should institute some type of franchise code or guides or someway to monitor the types of actions we have saw her in our bad dealer threads.

[DkknightX]

Originally Posted by chevydude26

its all good...i don't hate people who disagree with me...i will tell you this i don't know if i can wait for that convertible because the camaro looks fantastic in person...i might just make that order...but i'm in no rush so i don't mind waiting...but i am worried about there not being a gm in a few years...then i'm going to be p*ssed that i have to find a used camaro at 40 to 50 thousand dollars because its a rare car

You know, that was my concern as well, to the proverbial "T." I wanted the vert, but with GM likely filing, I don't want to take my chances because I'm usually wrong.

[68 Z/28]

Originally Posted by DkknightX

You know, that was my concern as well, to the proverbial "T." I wanted the vert, but with GM likely filing, I don't want to take my chances because I'm usually wrong.

He who hesitates is lost

[KJS]

Originally Posted by chevydude26

how do you not know what legacy costs are...please don't address me if you don't know the facts...

unfortunately about 30 to 40 years ago gm had a pretty big marketshare and the management never foresaw competition that would occur decades later

so horrible agreements were made with the unions who are practically run by tony sopranos where workers would be paid for not working for almost the rest of their life...theres a program where if you get laid off you get paid almost your whole salary until another job somewhere else opens up

anyway bottom line this alone makes the avg cost of labor for gm to be double that of toyota and the other foreign competitors...not to mention gm has to pay tariffs in japan and in other places while they don't pay any sorts of tariffs to sell here...

then you combine that with c.a.f.e (if you noticed i never said c.a.f.e. was the only standard) and you've got an escalating issue which puts gm in a tradeoff bind where you either cut quality or the price...and throughout the 70's and 80's gm cut quality to keep their price in line with their competitors...

like i said every industry that is in trouble you will find it to be heavily unionized...and please watch that video i posted...ms bartiromo is one smart analyst and owns that union boss guy

the solution was to go bankrupt way back in october and null and void their contracts and restructure the right way before all these "car czar's" started calling the shots you know telling them to close dealerships and having the gall to fire their ceo's without a peep from the actual chairmen or stockholders input...

i'm just sick of misinformed people with mismanaged facts and misleading headlines blaming gm for all of this

it was never an even playing field and they've done a hell of a job making quality products for the past decade even with all the artificial obstacles put in their way

i apologize in advance if i offended anybody but it is what it is

Hey Chevydude....
Legacy costs are GMs fault, they signed the contracts with the unions. There are plenty of unionized companies that didn't have the sweet deals the UAW got because they managed their employee relations well. GM and other auto companies did not! Legacy costs are imbeded in other things like Corporate management's salaries, their bonuses, their benefits, etc. Choices made when deciding to purchase EDS and other failed enterprises.

GM never saw competition coming - So because they kept their heads in the sand and when it was too late and made boneheaded decisions like selling Caveliers badged as Cadillac Cimerons its not their fault that smart customers said WTF and bought well built well equiped foreign cars? I guess we give GM a free pass on that one right? Shame on the customers wanting something worth their hard earned money!

Bartiromo smart analyst? Along with Jim Cramer right? Ever work on Wall St? I did. She is known as a pretty 'talking head", the "money honey" with not much else to offer.

Quality "you either cut quality or the price...and throughout the 70's and 80's gm cut quality to keep their price in line with their competitors...". I guess your statement pretty much says it all - sacifice quality instead of cutting your costs. But remember there are other ways of making money and being competitive besides sacrificing quality. CUT YOUR BLOATED DUPLICATED STAFF! You don't need the exact same corporate structures - marketing/finance, etc. for every all 6-7 auto divisions!

And lastly how do you explain the "Saturn Factor". American built, in modern factories, with a devoted "cult like" buyer following, a honest to God foreign car competitor??? GM had a great plan, they really did. Leave them alone to act as an almost independent company. But guess what GM SCREWED THAT ONE UP TOO!!!! Not because of the unions, not because of the foreign competition, not because no one wanted their product! NOPE GM decided to bring it directly under its corporate control and guess what? IT FAILED. Another "artificial obstacle"?

Loyalty And to others who said there is Loyalty in sports. Huh? You'd be hard pressed to name a modern Football, Baseball, Basketball, Hockey, Soccer.... player who would continue to play for the same team just out of loyalty to the team if they weren't offered more money. Go ahead, give me a list of 10 out of the above! And how many teams moved out of their cities because of a better deal? Where is the loyalty to the fans in those cases?

[Iwantone2]

Originally Posted by chevydude26

...dude the whole world thought there were weapons there and some entitities believed those weapons were moved to syria ...

Originally Posted by DkknightX

Newsflash! There were no WMD'S LOL! ...

Another news flash: There are no weapons of mass destruction in Syria or Iraq...Chuck Norris lives in Oklahoma!!!

Now, where is that darn list?

[Iroczlover]

Originally Posted by Iwantone2

Another news flash: There are no weapons of mass destruction in Syria or Iraq...Chuck Norris lives in Oklahoma!!!

Now, where is that darn list?

There is no list that currently GM is releasing.

[Jim Thompson]

Originally Posted by justmeron

One thing that also kinda concerns me about the thinning of dealershops. I understand the reasoning but with say fewer chevey dealers around would the ones left then be able to jack ppl around cause they know they are the only game in town?
I say with this then GM should institute some type of franchise code or guides or someway to monitor the types of actions we have saw her in our bad dealer threads.

in general the dealerships that have not used shady practices in the past will continue to be on the up and up.

[shinzon]

Newsflash: the Goverment will never be out of your pocket.

Things were different back the in the age of our Grandfathers... for sure

Until I see a Leader actually act like a LEADER...... It is all about ME and MY OWN.

GM needs bankruptcy, they need to attrition dealers, they need chinamen to buy buicks, and americans to buy chevys. I have been buying American.

The reasons of how and why GM went down the drain are many. Some obvious and others subtle. However looking at the BIG picture here, Manufactering in the US is impossible with Labor cost where they are now. Unions protect their members b/c without them Kathy Lee would have everyone in a sweatshop.

I predict a GM where cars are built overseas and imported here. Oh wait....that is happening now.....and it will become more prevalent sooner. So then what ? BUY American even though my Chevelle is made in Austrailia ? or Malaysia.

There are alot of factors at play here than just the GM getting a re-org / bankruptcy. The US is a service Economy, sure this guys cuts grass, this guy paints, this guy repairs cars....etc. Where is the manufactering ? Where are the leaders who say enough is enough. Here are some tarriffs, here are some benefits to keep manufactering in the US. Mostly here is affordable Healthcare for the working class. Establish that and that will lower the cost of manufacting in the us.

But that is never going to happen.....I would like to know why.