Report: 2012 Camaro to get new LFX V6 Engine

[Sevn86]

Thats awesome! Maybe I can get a camaro again in 2012.

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by Vega

Whoa, whoa, too much E85 bashing here, i wish people would read up on it instead of listening to all of the propaganda surrounding it. Ever notice that anything that has to do with change in America gets a bad rep?

- E85 does not effect the food prices at all, they use feed corn, and they boil what they need off the kernel which (for those of you who have voided your bowls before) is irrelevant to digestion or nutrition anyways, and with the abundance of corn in America its not like we're stealing good cattle feed corn from starving children in Africa, its perfectly harmless.

- E85 does indeed get worse mileage than gasoline, but that is soley because the motor your burning it in is optimized for gasoline, even if it says "E85 compatible" that still just means "compatible" and doesnt mean it was built for that fuel. Motors built for E85 have been proven to get better mileage and horsepower than their gasoline counterparts, it just takes more than an E85 conversion kit to do it.

- E85 would be less expensive if people werent so scared of it, many companies dont want to invest all their money into a product nobody wants, even if most of the reason people dont like it is from propaganda, for them its not about saving the world its about profit, if demand is low they will make lower amounts of it and less interest will promt less development which will keep the prices where they are. If more people were interested they would make more and the price would drop, then development would kick up and they would eliminate the difference between gaslone MPG and E85 MPG.

- E85 has a higher octane so its a better performance fuel anyways. An all-american performance fuel thats better for the environment and potentially cheaper? Sounds like muscle car heaven to me.

- E85 is a renewable resource, which gasoline is not. No matter how much E85 you use there will still be more to be made, keeping the price steady, again supply and demand. Gasoline will continue to rise because it is non-renewable and is becoming less and less scarce.

- Increasing E85 production will put a lot of farmers to work, boosting corn production anyways, and odds are not all of that excess production will go straight to E85 production so in the end foreign countries might even see MORE food coming to them than without E85.

- E85 is a huge economical boost for America, having a self-sustained fuel and a huge boost to farming and agriculture, plus the development and companies that get involved, it would pour money back into the economy, not only would it help your wallet and the environment but it would also help our country as a whole.

- On a personal note, id much rather put a self-sustained American fuel in my American muscle car rather than put oil in it from the middle east. Which in fact have the prices hiked on them cause they know its a necessity for us, not to mention China and all the other countries wanting to buy it as well. Plus all the American oil tycoons who want to raise the price even after the price was raised from the first sellers.


Sorry if i sound a little preachy, and if i seem to have hi-jacked the post, i just get a little ticked when people write things off without looking into it, they just listen to politicians and word of mouth, and im not calling anyone for that but the facts are out there and theyre very interesting especially to us muscle car guys.
Anyways, back to the new Camaro V6 =P

Bold = Irony.

BTW, Economic nationalism is as dead and stupid as mercantilism.

[mondain]

I would expect the 2012 V8 to be a direct-injected engine. There's simply no reason (and no excuse) not to go that route.

The new Challenger SRT8 392 will clock in at around 475hp, GM needs direct-injection to pull another 50+ ponies out of thin air.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by mondain

I would expect the 2012 V8 to be a direct-injected engine. There's simply no reason (and no excuse) not to go that route.

Do you know what's involved with integrating Direct Injection with an engine that was never designed for it? It's the closest you can come to redesigning the thing without officially 'redesigning' it. And that means time, testing, time, validation, and more time.

The Generation V Chevy small blocks with have SIDI, VVT, E85-capability (maybe), among other things a "new combustion process". Those potent little powerplants should make other V8s look like toys.

The new small blocks are due out shortly...probably in the C7 Corvette first, if I had to guess...but the next model year Camaro isn't likely to get a brand new engine...it's too soon.

[Earnhardtfan77]

Originally Posted by squat

You'll be waiting until after April if you do hold off. Good luck with that

It will be hard but I think I can do it. It will give me some more time to come up with a bigger down payment

[mondain]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

Do you know what's involved with integrating Direct Injection with an engine that was never designed for it? It's the closest you can come to redesigning the thing without officially 'redesigning' it. And that means time, testing, time, validation, and more time.

The Generation V Chevy small blocks with have SIDI, VVT, E85-capability (maybe), among other things a "new combustion process". Those potent little powerplants should make other V8s look like toys.

The new small blocks are due out shortly...probably in the C7 Corvette first, if I had to guess...but the next model year Camaro isn't likely to get a brand new engine...it's too soon.

Yes, I was not suggesting SIDI be slapped onto the existing engine, but that engine be replaced with a SIDI one which I pray has been in development within GM for some time now And if the 'big news' for 2012 model is the Z28 I'll be happy with the 2013 model being SIDI

[DarkneSS]

I'm happy to see improvements for sure. I'd rather have my 2010 V6 just because that's when all the coolness and buzz was in the air about the new camaro, it added to an already awesome driving experience.

I also like that the V6 is getting a bump in power but not enough to really piss off current V6 owners. If they add a turbo and 300 + hp stock I think a lot of us would be pretty angry...

[jmaryt]

Originally Posted by Brokinarrow

I seriously doubt that they would make the 'entry level' Camaro require 91 octane, as more people are going to want it for a daily driver, or because they don't have cash to throw at an SS. People in those situations (like myself) don't want to have to spend extra money on gas, and I'm sure this engine will still put out exceptional performance on the standard 87/89 octane.

i agree!..we are lucky,the general is NOT developing "blower" 4 bangers!
things are gonna get real 'dicey" when those caf'e ratings take hold!...i hate to say it,but the 8 may have to go away,and maybe even the 6!..stay tuned!

Originally Posted by pennor

I could care less about a few extra horses, but I totally stoked about being able to use E85 finally. So I've once again come up a year short. Should'a waited 'till '12 so I could get the E85 model!

Anyway, if there are any factory type's out there I would be REALLY interested to know if the 2010 E85 rating is due to actual changes being made to the injectors or the computer or if like the 2011 V6 changes they are simply advertising and rerating the engine for something that it always had the cability to do. With gas headed north of $4/gal this year I'd love to start buring E85 for a number of reasons, some environmental, some economic, and some tax advantages.

$4.00 a gallon?..try $5.00 within a year!..gotta let the oil companies ''drill" again!..at this rate,may be a lot of used product out there!..don't buy new!.."just sayin!"

Originally Posted by CamaroSSRS11

I found something related to this in the January issue of Motor Trend. It says the 2014 Camaro, ATS, and CTS will be on the new Alpha platform. It goes on to say the Alpha is flexible enough to handle a larger than CTS chevrolet performance sedan. I'm guessing this could be the Impala that would share parts with the Camaro.

P.S. As for the new V6, I don't understand why they are putting effort into making it E85 approved. I would have thought a LS and LT standard turbo DI 4 banger with about 250 hp would be the next step with the current V6 becoming a option.

sounds accurate!.what we DO know is that at some point,you can say 'goodbye"
to the 8,AND the 6!..putting a 'blower" on a 4 sounds right!

Originally Posted by FC_GIBB

better get a better 6speed Manual Tranny for the 6 banger before throwing more power at it... it hardly takes the LLT's

i agree!..cannot believe the general would "farm" the tranny out to a "jap" company!..(aisin!)..don't understand why warner didn't get the contract!
apparently the "bean" counters got involved!...remember!..it's a chevy!,and NOT a caddy!..guess that might explain why!

Originally Posted by Trailnut

Hope it's not just more things to go wrong!

sorry to sound so negative,but the more complicated they become,the more expensive to fix!....remember!..after 3 years are up,you are literally on your own!..very seldom will the "drivetrain" break,but just about everything else has just a 3 year warranty!..many dealers are already at $100.00 per hour labor rate!..just somethin' to think about!..just sayin!

Originally Posted by iPODFAN11

CTS, Camaro, Traverse, Acadia, Outlook, Enclave...the latest of the 3.6 family (07-up?) has been troubled with timing chains stretching.

wel!..that's understandable!!..however,at some point, this "issue" MUST be addressed,and i'm hopin' it's addressed BEFORE my warranty "croaks!"..after that,all bets are off,and the "general's" rep will go right back into the "crapper!"

[Lazerbrainz2k3]

Originally Posted by Vega

Whoa, whoa, too much E85 bashing here, i wish people would read up on it instead of listening to all of the propaganda surrounding it. Ever notice that anything that has to do with change in America gets a bad rep?

- E85 does not effect the food prices at all, they use feed corn, and they boil what they need off the kernel which (for those of you who have voided your bowls before) is irrelevant to digestion or nutrition anyways, and with the abundance of corn in America its not like we're stealing good cattle feed corn from starving children in Africa, its perfectly harmless.

- E85 does indeed get worse mileage than gasoline, but that is soley because the motor your burning it in is optimized for gasoline, even if it says "E85 compatible" that still just means "compatible" and doesnt mean it was built for that fuel. Motors built for E85 have been proven to get better mileage and horsepower than their gasoline counterparts, it just takes more than an E85 conversion kit to do it.

- E85 would be less expensive if people werent so scared of it, many companies dont want to invest all their money into a product nobody wants, even if most of the reason people dont like it is from propaganda, for them its not about saving the world its about profit, if demand is low they will make lower amounts of it and less interest will promt less development which will keep the prices where they are. If more people were interested they would make more and the price would drop, then development would kick up and they would eliminate the difference between gaslone MPG and E85 MPG.

- E85 has a higher octane so its a better performance fuel anyways. An all-american performance fuel thats better for the environment and potentially cheaper? Sounds like muscle car heaven to me.

- E85 is a renewable resource, which gasoline is not. No matter how much E85 you use there will still be more to be made, keeping the price steady, again supply and demand. Gasoline will continue to rise because it is non-renewable and is becoming less and less scarce.

- Increasing E85 production will put a lot of farmers to work, boosting corn production anyways, and odds are not all of that excess production will go straight to E85 production so in the end foreign countries might even see MORE food coming to them than without E85.

- E85 is a huge economical boost for America, having a self-sustained fuel and a huge boost to farming and agriculture, plus the development and companies that get involved, it would pour money back into the economy, not only would it help your wallet and the environment but it would also help our country as a whole.

- On a personal note, id much rather put a self-sustained American fuel in my American muscle car rather than put oil in it from the middle east. Which in fact have the prices hiked on them cause they know its a necessity for us, not to mention China and all the other countries wanting to buy it as well. Plus all the American oil tycoons who want to raise the price even after the price was raised from the first sellers.


Sorry if i sound a little preachy, and if i seem to have hi-jacked the post, i just get a little ticked when people write things off without looking into it, they just listen to politicians and word of mouth, and im not calling anyone for that but the facts are out there and theyre very interesting especially to us muscle car guys.
Anyways, back to the new Camaro V6 =P

I don't mean to be a preachy thread-jacker either but I think that deserves a considered response.

Even if farmers don't end up converting large portions of food crop acreage to fuel crops (which if it's more profitable for them they very well may - it's human nature), I have yet to see any analyses which don't admit that producing E85 is more costly than producing gasoline, all for a slighly higher octane rating than what you get with premium gas as it is. That can easily end up raising the price of everything requiring transport from A to B, even if indirectly. Whether it's an intended or unintended consequence doesn't mean a whole lot to my wallet.

Demand for E85 is low because only a fraction of vehicles car use it, not because of "propoganda." The vast majority of people are justifiably afraid of E85 - because it'll destroy their engines! The transportation infrastructure simply isn't designed to use E85, and it's pretty heavy-handed to use very little carrot and a lot of stick to compel privately-owned gas stations to sell an unprofitable product while pressuring drivers to buy new cars compatible with a hurried, manufactured change in that infrastructure. Shoving something down people's throats via regulation from on high is a pretty crummy business model, especially coming from an industry which wouldn't exist except for subsidies as it is.

The environmental benefits of E85 are questionable, at best. Yes, gas produces some nasty stuff like lead (and some stuff like CO2 which is nasty for us but not so much for things which are actually green), but given the choice between breathing in gas emissions and breathing in some carginogen aldehyde emissions from E85 which don't benefit us or vegetation, I'd prefer neither. However since all-electric vehicles are still pretty crummy (and open up a whole new can of unintended-consequences worms I won't go into), I don't care to buy a new car to adopt a new standard which risks giving me health issues, and I'll stick with gas.

As for jobs, we could create those if we drilled for oil more, as well, without all the hidden costs of a frantic reconfiguration of the country. We can get it from conventional sources like the continental shelf and the Gulf, as well as new sources like coal, oil sands, shale, even from thermal depolymerization (which as an engineer I think is just about the coolest thing ever). As it is we already get most of our gas either from domestic or friendly international sources, namely Canada - they built our Camaros for us so they can't be that bad, right? - and to a lesser extent Mexico. True, Saudi Arabia and Venezuela are big contributers but for all the talk of "peak oil", North America is sitting on top of potentially the biggest oil reserve on the planet and it's mostly untapped - we could tell OPEC where to shove it while relying on ourselves and our friends for our energy needs, and probably end up selling a heck of a lot to the rest of the world (leaving our terrorist-funding friends in the Middle East with about the only thing they had before we found oil there... a lot of sand). Imagine the economic security to be found from that. Not to mention it would give us an abundance of time and security to study and develop new alternative energy and fuels that are a real improvement over gasoline and implement them in a more gradual, less authoritarian way.

[The Black Stig]

Originally Posted by jmaryt

sorry to sound so negative,but the more complicated they become,the more expensive to fix!....remember!..after 3 years are up,you are literally on your own!..very seldom will the "drivetrain" break,but just about everything else has just a 3 year warranty!..many dealers are already at $100.00 per hour labor rate!..just somethin' to think about!..just sayin!

Ummmm I believe the power train warranty is 5 years???

Please stop with the misinformation, wither it be on purpose or accident.

[The Black Stig]

As far e-85, if you wanna make power it's the new fuel of champions... I can do the same power and slightly better on e-85 as i can do on c16 race gas.

e-85 has a minimal octane rating of of 100 and up to 105, pump e-85 is mixed with 85 octane as will, making your own ethanol(with the blessing of the A.T.F.) and mixing with 93 octane+ leads to much better results, that and an e50 blend works better of D/I and d/i turbo cars as you do not need flow as much fuel, and it has nearly the same octane (usually one point lower), but it has an slightly higher stioch. so you can't run as lean.

Verdit
E-85 on dd boring ass cars FAIL x2 if there "flex fuel"

E-85 with an proper tune and even slightly modded.... Win

[08-G35s/6MT]

So the new engine is a 3.0 liter ??? Or just a modified version of the current 3.6 ???

[DarthNacho08]

I wonder if any of the drivetrain will get upgraded as well to handle the extra power if this is true

[doc7000]

Originally Posted by mondain

I would expect the 2012 V8 to be a direct-injected engine. There's simply no reason (and no excuse) not to go that route.

The new Challenger SRT8 392 will clock in at around 475hp, GM needs direct-injection to pull another 50+ ponies out of thin air.

Its possible that the 2012 Camaro can get the Gen V motors as they started the tooling up process some time ago. Maybe they will have a early gen V release for the 2012 Camaro and 2012 Corvette to get some sales back in the Corvette. Other then that I don't see them adding direct injection and being so close to the Gen V I didn't see them altering the LS3 for more power. However considering that the Mustang has the 5.0L engine which in the latest test ran to 60 in 4.4 seconds makes me wonder. There are some other things they can do to the camaro SS to get the power up however I wonder what that will do to fuel economy. Considering that the Mustang gets more miles per gallon boosting power may make the Camaro faster but at the cost of fuel economy. So maybe Gen V direct injected VVT engine would be the way to go.

BTW the Camaro SS at competes head to head with the Mustang GT and Challenger R/T in price at $30,000 each. The SRT8 model starts at $42,000 which is priced with the Mustang GT500 which starts at $48,000. The Camaro Z28 will compete with those two, though even with the new 6.4L 470BHP engine in the Challenger its going to be slightly faster then the Camaro (due to weight).

If the new V-6 produces around 330BHP and they allow you to opt for the FE4 suspension option then Camaro will see a boost. When I test drove the SS Camaro I felt that the suspension tuning was a bit on the soft side. Those who would be looking at something like a BMW 135i may consider a V-6 Camaro RS with the FE4 suspension a manual transmission and 330ish Horsepower. Not to mention the new interior with Navigation that I think the 2012 model will get.