05-28-2011, 09:22 AM | #29 | |
Downright Upright
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Quote:
This is not a new concept... All manner of Camaro-based support for a BOSS-specific competitor exists, and has since well before the BOSS appeared... Serious discussions occurred in Summer/Fall-'09, regarding this type of Package. Through an enterprise well-regarded by GM, but ultimately lacking Team support, then; the supply of cars was given as the "issue" and, as you know, "two-sticker" Programs are "banned". But that was "then"...and this is "now". Since then, ZL1-specific components await: trans, HD driveline, brakes, wheels/tires; FE4 is now developed. Just how many Camaros, as spec'd above, does the Team need to create a Spring-'12 Launch? 2,000? 5,000? 2-per-Dealer? Float this specific idea in HRM, or Motor Trend, or CandD, or Camaro Performers and see what the response is. Fulfilling the above numbers would happen! Regardless of the numbers required, I can GUARANTEE you 1...Black-on-Black, hold the stripes! Oh, and the name? Does anyone need to ASK?! Last edited by LOWDOWN; 05-28-2011 at 09:33 AM. |
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05-28-2011, 09:41 AM | #30 |
Too Many Great Choices
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I believe tha handling goes without saying (at this point the expectations have been discussed) We are making a case for the use of the LS7 in the Z28 as a last hurrah before it the LS7 goes away. The numbers show it would make sense in competing with the Boss. Plus it along with the other items suggested are avaiable. I say just do it for the Gen5, the Gen6 will be what has to be based on the times and circumstances.
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05-28-2011, 10:08 AM | #31 | |
Too Many Great Choices
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05-28-2011, 10:19 AM | #32 |
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Yep. Eliminating the titanium parts, and the cnc LS7 heads. If you can do without the dry sump setup. There's another 1k in parts there too. The LS3 from the GS is handbuilt too. It'll still be cheaper than th LS7. I just want the big motor.
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05-28-2011, 10:32 AM | #33 |
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Not saying it wouldn't be an awesome car because it would, but I really don't want to see a 3800 pound car called z28. JMO
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05-28-2011, 11:05 AM | #34 |
Downright Upright
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Funny, in 1970, there were 3800 lb. Camaros...an SS396/M40/C60-loaded...and they did not enjoy the structure or the "safety/technology" of the current versions...
Two-sticker? SLP (SS/Firehawks) wore two stickers...one from GM, one from SLP, but sold and warranted directly by GM Dealers. As to a de-contented LS7, first of all, it doesn't exist...and therefore must suffer through all the certification/validation processes (time/$$$$)...to arrive at a place with lower power/lower redline/less durability (perhaps) and LESS VALUE. Powdered rods tossing heavier, bigger-bore pistons is not my idea of "performance" and, ultimately, may save little/nothing per low volume (relatively) unit. Go with the BEST you have, that meets Production criteria...NOW! Built, as I say (and the Market reality would be), in low volume, any added costs and complications simply endanger the Business Case... |
05-28-2011, 11:24 AM | #35 | |
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It doesn't exist? Well build it. That's what car companies do right? I bet a 7.0 LS3 would do just fine. Not good enough? Do an LS7. Too expensive? Well your outta of luck then. A z28 that performs as it should Is not gonna come at less than 40 to 45k. Might be better off if they just not build it |
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05-28-2011, 11:33 AM | #36 |
Downright Upright
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Business Case:
Remember SEMA '08? Something called the COPO? Add ZL1 wheels/tires/brakes/trans/diff., and add FE4...and leave the hood body-colored... Raise your hand if you think someone cross-shopping the sold-out BOSS wanted a nose-heavy, supercharged, "overweight" straight-line-oriented car instead. If SO, they'd have bought a GT 500, wouldn't they? Would the BOSS-buyer prefer a ZL1? No...or they'd wait, or they'd have bought the GT 500... And they obviously didn't settle for a GT...and likely never looked at an SS! Again, the BOSS is sold out...both ways... "But ya gotta wanna do it"... |
05-28-2011, 11:34 AM | #37 | |
Downright Upright
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05-28-2011, 11:38 AM | #38 | |
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yuada, whatever. Lets hear from GM!! Don't get me wrong, I love the Camaro--just can't figure out 1) why it takes GM so long to respond to other companies product, 2) why they are not LEADING, and 3) why they always have excuses about tweaking engines for specific output. Just my $00.02 T |
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05-28-2011, 12:16 PM | #39 | |
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What product have they not responded to from Ford? The Boss that JUST came out?? Besides the fact that it just came out who says you have to have a competitor for each car the other guy has. If you have to have a competitor then I say GM is leading... see Vette comment above |
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05-28-2011, 12:19 PM | #40 | |
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From GM's perspective its not about going model for model and beating Ford. Their biggest concern is how to make money. Throwing a bunch of off the shelf parts is cheaper than developing all new stuff, but the testing & tuning & validation for it on the Camaro isn't pocket change. Same goes for engines. To offer a Z28, they have to know that there are enough distinct customers for that car to more than make back their investment. Stealing customers away from the SS & ZL1 doesn't help a whole lot. And don't forget ... right now the Camaro coupe and convertible are handily outselling the Mustang in all its forms, with fewer incentives. That means they're probably making more money off the Camaro than Ford is off the Mustang, and that is more important to them than braging rights are to you and I.
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05-28-2011, 12:22 PM | #41 | |
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T |
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05-28-2011, 12:23 PM | #42 |
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LSA is a way toned down LS9
I think we can get a toned down LS7. On GMs defense however, they still have many flavors of corvettes and cadillacs to develop before camaro. So that's another reason for slower response times. Ford has the mustang and that's it. |
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700 hp z/28 in 2014, the greatest camaro |
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