Throttle Body Service? - Page 2 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

Russell James · 01-11-2012, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LADodgerBlueFan

I have had pretty good service at this dealership (Camino Real Chevrolet), I bought the car there and was given complimentary oil changes so I don't think they are necessarily trying to scam me. It seemed like it was a service recommendation that popped up on their computer once they punched in my car's info. Maybe it's a "standard" recommendation at 20K miles in their system even if we don't really need it.

They absolutely were trying to scam you.

The actual services recommended by GM are in your owner's manual. There is even a bulletin from GM to dealers telling them not to sell unnecessary services and flushes... so many crooks out there, they needed to publish the fact to stop being crooks.

daveagogo1 · 01-11-2012, 04:53 PM

10 minutes to remove. 5 to clean then replace. If you dont have an oil catch can then it will be needed more often. A ton of crap gets in there. Dealer charge is insane for this novice simple service.

nyrfan · 01-11-2012, 05:42 PM

So here's a question. For those of us with a catch can, should we do any maintenance to our TB and if so at what mileage?

Russell James · 01-11-2012, 06:11 PM

Catch can or not, if your car starts perfect, idles perfect, never stalls.... I wouldn't touch the throttle body.

Most of your throttle body carbon is from combustion reversion. A catch can is not going to stop that, it's a normal phenominom in all engines. When you get to real high mileage, and you get a hint of not starting or idling perfect... time to clean it.

At 20,000 miles, sure someone could go in there and wipe a little carbon off. But if it was starting and idling perfect, a complete waste of money. Todays ECM programming and electronic throttles are very smartly engineered, a little carbon at low mileage is meaningless.

Best approach is - if you went there with a perfectly running car for an oil change.... anything else they try to sell you is a commissioned based salesperson trying to make your money his/hers. If your car is hard to start and stalls a few times in the morning, that TB cleaning recommendation is probably legit.

Caspers2SSRS · 01-11-2012, 06:42 PM

I won't spend the Evening discussing the necessities of having the cleanest Throttle Body one can, but its notable that counteless posts can be found here and elsewhere on the proven advantages of a ported and polished Throttle Body. Hence the cleaner and slicker the better...............

Its unlikey that anyone expert or otherwise know when a car is starting, idling or running as some put it............... perfectly normal. The ECM is designed to make minor temporary adjustments to the spark delivery, engines timing, and to the controls and sensor functions of the throttle body air and fuel circuits.......because the car isn't starting, idling or running perfectly, as it should efficiently.

These corrections aren't a permanent fix or meant to be be, in lieu of proper vehicle preventive maintenance.............uncluding a regiment of scheduled Throttle Body cleansings. Fact is whether a vehicle has 10 miles on the odometer or 100,000, either can suffer from the ill effects on overall performance and economy of one single fill up of contaminated fuel let alone the mirad of other causes of a dirty TB.

Cleaning the Throttle Body could solve and save someone BIGGer $$$ than ignoring fact. I'm saying, being penny wise and pound foolish has often found folks proving themselves wrong at the least opportune time............

Just my .02

RED DEMON SS · 01-11-2012, 07:09 PM

Absolutely agree Casper, one can never take for granted that just because a vehicle is running, idling, and starting fine that the Throttle Body doesn't need cleaning, preventative maintenance is the cure all for all that ails in any vehicle. It is so easy to clean why not take a peak into your throttle body and check for yourself if it bugs you or you are so concerned with what the possibility of not doing it could be?
In fuel injected engines, the throttle body is the part of the air intake system that controls the amount of air flowing into the engine, in response to driver accelerator pedal input in the main. The throttle body is usually located between the air filter box and the intake manifold, and it is usually attached to, or near, the mass airflow sensor.
The largest piece inside the throttle body is the throttle plate, which is a butterfly valve that regulates the airflow. This is what i would take a peak at to see if you have any oil or deposits, i took mine of to paint and it had oil inside of it (Before Catch Can install) that i knew would cut down on airflow, so obviously i cleaned it out!

Russell James · 01-11-2012, 07:25 PM

A good service writer will convince you that you need your TB cleaned at every oil change. A complete waste of money, and needless dissassembly/reassembly of parts that are working perfectly if you don't need it. The crank main bearings are also a little worn at 10,000 miles, they don't need to be changed.

A little carbon on the back of the TB is meaningless. Every engine has it, every combustion engine has a little reversion. When it becomes a problem will be obvious... starting, idling, stalling... won't pass an emission sniffer test... legit reasons to clean. Running perfectly, perfect emissions... zero reason to clean the TB.

Been there, worked there, watched the service writers steal peoples money all day long. The vast majority of crap like that they sold, when we did it in the service bay... the car ran exactly the same when it left as came in, just the owner was about $100 buck lighter in the wallet. On the flip side, many higher mileage cars that ran like crap absolutely needed it.

You can boil it down to .... did you come in for an oil change or because your car is running like crap. If you just came in for an oil change and they want $100 for something else, it's a scam. The Service Writer gets a commission for all those add ons they pack onto an RO.

Oldest trick in the service business. Send out some cheap oil change coupons... then kill them with add on crap they don't need.

Caspers2SSRS · 01-11-2012, 08:11 PM

Lets say that more often than not, it benefits the consumers wallet.....................whether or not its a matter of absolutes or not, cleaning the Throttle Body or not at every oil change that is, is so subjective.................no one could always know for sure, that is unless the parts of the system are visually inspected and thus..............they only way to objectiively eliminate the unknown is by looking.

We could spend a century on the differences and similiarities between TB cleaning and bearing wear ( Acceptable Tolerances & Average Longevity/Life Cycle of Internal Lubricated spinning and moving parts) or better yet the actual connections between the two.

I'd suggest that the comparo's cross paths to a greater degree than most think.............bearings wear because contaminates are breathed deeply into the engine, passing first through the Throttle Body passage, into the intake as they are being injested into the cyclinders, which are being scraped clean by the piston rings..........eventually being deposited into the crank case, from which the oil is drawn and cycled throughout the various oil passages and galleyways......that lubricate the Crankshaft and those bearings you've mentioned being worn a little.................

Its also not a matter that you can or might not find some or alot of smudge on the TB components at any given time.......its a matter that someone is having one ( percieved or believed ) preventative measure taken at a recommended and accepted interval, why not eliminate another potental issue before it rears its costly ugly head.

If you were partaking in or witnessing the deliberate raking of consumers as a employee and stood idly by.....................that doesn't discount the importance of what the vast majority of good honest service writers or mechanics do or the fundamental, why or why nots of proper vehicle maintenance.

Sword5 · 01-11-2012, 08:38 PM

Just take a look at every few months or so. I clean my 93 Z28 tb once a year, it has 96,000 miles. I take a can of tb cleaner and a couple of old detail brushes and clean it. It really builds up on the blade or flapper but cleans really easy.

CWI · 01-11-2012, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by valnzula

There is also increased sound when the throttle is applied by way of the accelerator. If the vehicle is operated at lower speeds, there is less noise coming from the engine. However, at higher speeds, the engine tends to become very noisy. These two statements make the throttle body service important in itself, as it makes the automobile more environmentally friendly. !

With CAI, headers, cam, and Flowmasters, my Camaro make some noise. Hmmmm....... Do I need a new throttle body to protect the environment?
WTF?

mulletman · 01-12-2012, 12:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russell James

A good service writer will convince you that you need your TB cleaned at every oil change. A complete waste of money, and needless dissassembly/reassembly of parts that are working perfectly if you don't need it. The crank main bearings are also a little worn at 10,000 miles, they don't need to be changed.

A little carbon on the back of the TB is meaningless. Every engine has it, every combustion engine has a little reversion. When it becomes a problem will be obvious... starting, idling, stalling... won't pass an emission sniffer test... legit reasons to clean. Running perfectly, perfect emissions... zero reason to clean the TB.

Been there, worked there, watched the service writers steal peoples money all day long. The vast majority of crap like that they sold, when we did it in the service bay... the car ran exactly the same when it left as came in, just the owner was about $100 buck lighter in the wallet. On the flip side, many higher mileage cars that ran like crap absolutely needed it.

You can boil it down to .... did you come in for an oil change or because your car is running like crap. If you just came in for an oil change and they want $100 for something else, it's a scam. The Service Writer gets a commission for all those add ons they pack onto an RO.

Oldest trick in the service business. Send out some cheap oil change coupons... then kill them with add on crap they don't need.

Thank you for telling the truth. Car owners are sold millions of dollars of unneeded services every year. DO NOT TRUST THE SERVICE WRITER!

Sevn86 · 01-12-2012, 12:17 AM

I need to get this done for my DD.

Scott@Bjorn3D · 01-12-2012, 04:50 AM

I also say get a catch can. I got a VMAX Throttle body at 20K miles. The old one had all kinds of moist oil and built up carbon behind the blade. I am at 37K now and my VMAX is still looking new behind the blade. I put the catch can on the same time as the VMAX.

blackSSRS · 01-12-2012, 11:51 AM

had this done to H2 at 60k miles. had a funny lil hiccup in the idle no one else noticed but me, they said clean throttle body so i had them do it and it idles smooth again. like previousy said higher miles or if you have a rough idle its probably a good idea to do.

01-11-2012, 05:42 PM	#17
nyrfan Let's go Rangers! Drives: 13' AGM 2SS/RS L99 Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 10,742 View My Garage	So here's a question. For those of us with a catch can, should we do any maintenance to our TB and if so at what mileage? __________________ Soprano 4/1/00-6/14/11, Gone but NEVER forgotten! FSP tuned: 377/389

01-11-2012, 07:09 PM	#20
RED DEMON SS OFF THE CHAIN Drives: PSHHH UWISH Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: This Side Of Hell Posts: 8,406 View My Garage	Absolutely agree Casper, one can never take for granted that just because a vehicle is running, idling, and starting fine that the Throttle Body doesn't need cleaning, preventative maintenance is the cure all for all that ails in any vehicle. It is so easy to clean why not take a peak into your throttle body and check for yourself if it bugs you or you are so concerned with what the possibility of not doing it could be? In fuel injected engines, the throttle body is the part of the air intake system that controls the amount of air flowing into the engine, in response to driver accelerator pedal input in the main. The throttle body is usually located between the air filter box and the intake manifold, and it is usually attached to, or near, the mass airflow sensor. The largest piece inside the throttle body is the throttle plate, which is a butterfly valve that regulates the airflow. This is what i would take a peak at to see if you have any oil or deposits, i took mine of to paint and it had oil inside of it (Before Catch Can install) that i knew would cut down on airflow, so obviously i cleaned it out! __________________

01-11-2012, 08:38 PM	#23
Sword5 Drives: 2010 2SS Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Lexington, Ky Posts: 1,164 View My Garage	Just take a look at every few months or so. I clean my 93 Z28 tb once a year, it has 96,000 miles. I take a can of tb cleaner and a couple of old detail brushes and clean it. It really builds up on the blade or flapper but cleans really easy. __________________ Ordered 6/19/09 Black on Black 2 SS Delivery 10/14/09! Added CAI, Heritage Grill, DRL Plug and Play Harness

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01-11-2012, 06:11 PM	#18
Russell James Drives: '15 SS 1LE, '69 Z28 drag car Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Mich Posts: 4,482	Catch can or not, if your car starts perfect, idles perfect, never stalls.... I wouldn't touch the throttle body. Most of your throttle body carbon is from combustion reversion. A catch can is not going to stop that, it's a normal phenominom in all engines. When you get to real high mileage, and you get a hint of not starting or idling perfect... time to clean it. At 20,000 miles, sure someone could go in there and wipe a little carbon off. But if it was starting and idling perfect, a complete waste of money. Todays ECM programming and electronic throttles are very smartly engineered, a little carbon at low mileage is meaningless. Best approach is - if you went there with a perfectly running car for an oil change.... anything else they try to sell you is a commissioned based salesperson trying to make your money his/hers. If your car is hard to start and stalls a few times in the morning, that TB cleaning recommendation is probably legit.

01-11-2012, 06:42 PM	#19
Caspers2SSRS Caspers2SSRS Drives: Summit White 2010 2SS/RS Camaro Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Somewhere north of a midlife crisis. Posts: 2,865	I won't spend the Evening discussing the necessities of having the cleanest Throttle Body one can, but its notable that counteless posts can be found here and elsewhere on the proven advantages of a ported and polished Throttle Body. Hence the cleaner and slicker the better............... Its unlikey that anyone expert or otherwise know when a car is starting, idling or running as some put it............... perfectly normal. The ECM is designed to make minor temporary adjustments to the spark delivery, engines timing, and to the controls and sensor functions of the throttle body air and fuel circuits.......because the car isn't starting, idling or running perfectly, as it should efficiently. These corrections aren't a permanent fix or meant to be be, in lieu of proper vehicle preventive maintenance.............uncluding a regiment of scheduled Throttle Body cleansings. Fact is whether a vehicle has 10 miles on the odometer or 100,000, either can suffer from the ill effects on overall performance and economy of one single fill up of contaminated fuel let alone the mirad of other causes of a dirty TB. Cleaning the Throttle Body could solve and save someone BIGGer $$$ than ignoring fact. I'm saying, being penny wise and pound foolish has often found folks proving themselves wrong at the least opportune time............ Just my .02

01-11-2012, 07:25 PM	#21
Russell James Drives: '15 SS 1LE, '69 Z28 drag car Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Mich Posts: 4,482	A good service writer will convince you that you need your TB cleaned at every oil change. A complete waste of money, and needless dissassembly/reassembly of parts that are working perfectly if you don't need it. The crank main bearings are also a little worn at 10,000 miles, they don't need to be changed. A little carbon on the back of the TB is meaningless. Every engine has it, every combustion engine has a little reversion. When it becomes a problem will be obvious... starting, idling, stalling... won't pass an emission sniffer test... legit reasons to clean. Running perfectly, perfect emissions... zero reason to clean the TB. Been there, worked there, watched the service writers steal peoples money all day long. The vast majority of crap like that they sold, when we did it in the service bay... the car ran exactly the same when it left as came in, just the owner was about $100 buck lighter in the wallet. On the flip side, many higher mileage cars that ran like crap absolutely needed it. You can boil it down to .... did you come in for an oil change or because your car is running like crap. If you just came in for an oil change and they want $100 for something else, it's a scam. The Service Writer gets a commission for all those add ons they pack onto an RO. Oldest trick in the service business. Send out some cheap oil change coupons... then kill them with add on crap they don't need.

01-11-2012, 08:11 PM	#22
Caspers2SSRS Caspers2SSRS Drives: Summit White 2010 2SS/RS Camaro Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Somewhere north of a midlife crisis. Posts: 2,865	Lets say that more often than not, it benefits the consumers wallet.....................whether or not its a matter of absolutes or not, cleaning the Throttle Body or not at every oil change that is, is so subjective.................no one could always know for sure, that is unless the parts of the system are visually inspected and thus..............they only way to objectiively eliminate the unknown is by looking. We could spend a century on the differences and similiarities between TB cleaning and bearing wear ( Acceptable Tolerances & Average Longevity/Life Cycle of Internal Lubricated spinning and moving parts) or better yet the actual connections between the two. I'd suggest that the comparo's cross paths to a greater degree than most think.............bearings wear because contaminates are breathed deeply into the engine, passing first through the Throttle Body passage, into the intake as they are being injested into the cyclinders, which are being scraped clean by the piston rings..........eventually being deposited into the crank case, from which the oil is drawn and cycled throughout the various oil passages and galleyways......that lubricate the Crankshaft and those bearings you've mentioned being worn a little................. Its also not a matter that you can or might not find some or alot of smudge on the TB components at any given time.......its a matter that someone is having one ( percieved or believed ) preventative measure taken at a recommended and accepted interval, why not eliminate another potental issue before it rears its costly ugly head. If you were partaking in or witnessing the deliberate raking of consumers as a employee and stood idly by.....................that doesn't discount the importance of what the vast majority of good honest service writers or mechanics do or the fundamental, why or why nots of proper vehicle maintenance.

01-12-2012, 04:50 AM	#27
Scott@Bjorn3D Drives: Kami, 2013 2SS LS3 Luvin Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Eufaula, Alabama Posts: 6,427	I also say get a catch can. I got a VMAX Throttle body at 20K miles. The old one had all kinds of moist oil and built up carbon behind the blade. I am at 37K now and my VMAX is still looking new behind the blade. I put the catch can on the same time as the VMAX.

01-12-2012, 11:51 AM	#28
blackSSRS Drives: 2010 RS Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: FL Posts: 540	had this done to H2 at 60k miles. had a funny lil hiccup in the idle no one else noticed but me, they said clean throttle body so i had them do it and it idles smooth again. like previousy said higher miles or if you have a rough idle its probably a good idea to do.