08-08-2015, 04:39 PM | #29 |
When is enough ever...
Drives: 2006 Silverado 2500HD CC/SB LBZ Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Residence: Chula Vista, CA Home: Billings, MT
Posts: 996
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Well I've crunched the numbers and it looks like adding a second 25 row cooler will be quite a bit cheaper than trying to go bigger like X25 did. Now the next problem is those damn brake cooling ducts. Seems the fog lights are not very efficient due to lower pressure and turbulence in this area. I think I am going to see how close to center I can put the coolers and then fit brake ducting outside of those if possible.
Orange, what kind of oil pressures were you seeing (hot and cold) running the dual setup. Improved Racing estimate a 6 psi drop across two coolers. I think I can live with that running a ported Melling 10296.
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The Project: 2011 Camaro 2SS/RS (ERL 427 Superdeck NA Monster)
"Just like farmer engineering. Find the weak link and fix it, then find the next one." Salt Cat Racing |
08-08-2015, 05:32 PM | #30 | |
Drives: '16 C7 Z51 Join Date: May 2012
Location: Redmond, WA
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I suppose I should post it here, too
From my build thread: Quote:
As I've explained in my build thread, if I were to do it again, I'd keep the OEM cooler intact, let it do 80% of the job, and supplement it with a modest external oil cooler through a sandwich adapter (with no thermostat). I'd then check if coolant thermostat is effective enough to regulate oil temps as well through the OEM cooler/warmer, and add an oil thermostat only if it lets it over- cool at the street.
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08-08-2015, 06:13 PM | #31 |
When is enough ever...
Drives: 2006 Silverado 2500HD CC/SB LBZ Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Residence: Chula Vista, CA Home: Billings, MT
Posts: 996
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Well that might have been worth looking into with the hybrid system but I sold the stock cooler and lines so no going back now.
Hoping to see what ORANGECRUSH had for pressure drop on his setup. He was duals with a -8 which would probably be more drop I would think.
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The Project: 2011 Camaro 2SS/RS (ERL 427 Superdeck NA Monster)
"Just like farmer engineering. Find the weak link and fix it, then find the next one." Salt Cat Racing |
08-09-2015, 10:51 AM | #32 |
Drives: 2022 SS 1LE Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,086
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Hi guys,
Oil pressure was a huge concern after grenading my previous motor and not really knowing why. I spoke with several that thought that my stock 1LE oil pump would be up to the task. Taking no chances, I had an oil pressure sensor, oil temp sensor, and Aim data acquisition system installed which continuously monitors both. A data acquisition system will even capture momentary dips, as it outputs a plot of your entire session. Momentary dips may be hard to catch on just an oil pressure gage. Keep in mind that not only did I install the oil coolers, but also an Improved Racing Oil Pan Baffle. As I run a big wing set at 9 degrees (tons of downforce) and 315 Hoosiers, the car is at risk of oil starvation. Although I can't quote numbers on oil pressure because I sold the car, two things I observed which put my fears to rest: 1. No oil pressure starvation at all. The Aim plot for pressure confirmed that even in long sustained high-g sweepers like Riverside at Buttonwillow Raceway, no pressure starvation at all. Very relieved! 2. Oil pressure was fine at all temperatures and RPM. Never dipped low at all. Sorry I can't remember the numbers but they were way out of the danger zone. This was true with both 15W-50 and 5W-50. So although I agree with you guys that oil pressure drop should be of concern, I'm happy to report that I had no issues with this.
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Sold but not forgotten! Pedders Supercar Coilovers, 32mm rear sway bar,bushings; APR wing and splitter
Forged 416 road course stroker. 514 RWHP, 497 RW Ft-Lb 1 Camaro, 75 Vipers: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=393697 Buttonwillow Raceway: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=389086 Last edited by Orange Crush 1LE; 08-09-2015 at 11:12 AM. |
08-09-2015, 11:01 AM | #33 |
Cadillac Service Manager
Drives: 2014 Camaro 1SS, 1LE, NPP, RECAROS Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Indiana
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Do you know if your coolers were ran in sequence or parallel?
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08-09-2015, 11:11 AM | #34 |
Drives: 2022 SS 1LE Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: San Jose, CA
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I hate to admit being a dummy about my own car, but it was installed by 7s Only and I didn't get a chance to look at all of the details. I am pretty sure they were run in sequence, but you could call 7s Only in Buttonwillow to confirm.
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Sold but not forgotten! Pedders Supercar Coilovers, 32mm rear sway bar,bushings; APR wing and splitter
Forged 416 road course stroker. 514 RWHP, 497 RW Ft-Lb 1 Camaro, 75 Vipers: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=393697 Buttonwillow Raceway: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=389086 |
08-09-2015, 11:00 PM | #35 |
When is enough ever...
Drives: 2006 Silverado 2500HD CC/SB LBZ Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Residence: Chula Vista, CA Home: Billings, MT
Posts: 996
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Some good info from Mocal on cooler placement, series vs parallel, cooling system efficiencies, etc. Encourage everyone to read it. Seems we are seeing a lot of bad info getting put out there on the forums.
http://www.mocal.co.uk/FAQ.html
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The Project: 2011 Camaro 2SS/RS (ERL 427 Superdeck NA Monster)
"Just like farmer engineering. Find the weak link and fix it, then find the next one." Salt Cat Racing |
08-09-2015, 11:49 PM | #36 | |
Drives: '16 C7 Z51 Join Date: May 2012
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 3,056
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Quote:
What bad info have you been seeing? We should address them, and make sure they are corrected (to avoid getting them spread further).
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08-10-2015, 10:26 AM | #37 | |
When is enough ever...
Drives: 2006 Silverado 2500HD CC/SB LBZ Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Residence: Chula Vista, CA Home: Billings, MT
Posts: 996
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Quote:
One thing I found interesting was the discussion on possible problems running coolers in parallel and problems with flow. Also the recommendation to mount larger coolers in a cradle vice using the mounting brackets. This might drive me to change my mounting solution.
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The Project: 2011 Camaro 2SS/RS (ERL 427 Superdeck NA Monster)
"Just like farmer engineering. Find the weak link and fix it, then find the next one." Salt Cat Racing |
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08-13-2015, 10:35 PM | #38 |
Drives: 2013 Camaro SS 1LE Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 105
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hcsi99 - his were done in sequence. I called 7's before ordering my parts for the dual setup. I'll be hopefully knocking out the install this weekend if all the parts are in.
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08-13-2015, 10:37 PM | #39 |
Cadillac Service Manager
Drives: 2014 Camaro 1SS, 1LE, NPP, RECAROS Join Date: Jun 2013
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Thanks! I hope be done with my new set up this weekend as well. I have a track day next Friday. I will post details of my set up after that (if it works). Good luck!
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08-17-2015, 10:00 AM | #40 |
Drives: 2013 Camaro SS 1LE Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Charlotte, NC
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Well, I had all intentions of installing the dual oil cooler setup this weekend but decided to pull the plug after the bumper was off. It would have been a pain to install the duals since they barely fit between the bumper supports and would have had to have been on a sloping angle for clearance. It just didn't seem worth it considering I was losing a good spot for brake ducts as well. After the article tadams72 posted along with some further research I've decided to go with X25's setup instead. The 5-15 degree increase in air temps reaching the radiator will not be ideal but when I'm on the track going an average of about 80-90 MPH, I don't think it will be an issue at all considering I'm freeing up the radiator from cooling the oil. It will be a month or so before a track day but I'll keep you all posted.
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08-17-2015, 03:06 PM | #41 | |
Drives: 2022 SS 1LE Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,086
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Quote:
However if you're sticking with the stock 4-piston brakes, they really need effective cooling if you're pushing it hard at brake-intensive tracks like Laguna Seca. So in that case, running the brake ducts to the high pressure area in the grille may be the better choice. Looking forward to seeing how the single big cooler set up works for you guys that chose that route.
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Sold but not forgotten! Pedders Supercar Coilovers, 32mm rear sway bar,bushings; APR wing and splitter
Forged 416 road course stroker. 514 RWHP, 497 RW Ft-Lb 1 Camaro, 75 Vipers: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=393697 Buttonwillow Raceway: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=389086 |
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08-18-2015, 03:33 AM | #42 | ||
Drives: '16 C7 Z51 Join Date: May 2012
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 3,056
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Just did a track day with the bigger oil cooler. From my build thread:
Long story short, the oil temps stabilized for the first time, and I did not need cool down laps, but it might still be a bit too high for some. I'm sure it can be improved even further by using a non-thermostatic oil cooler adapter (and just putting a high flow thermostat installed on the hoses), but I think this will be sufficient for me. Quote:
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