i wasn't comfortable with onstar before :S (cracked article)

[Nemo13]

Um, no. You cannot just undo the box. tried it. For 2012, there are 2 connectors, 1 antenna, and the fuse. You disconnect all of them and take the box out? You get a trouble light. The fuel pump is routed through. More and more, things are all routed together, either for cost effectiveness or to just make it harder for you to turn things off. How odd. You are almost forced to have a service you don't want or need. And if you opt out (pull the fuse / antenna ) you lose another service (blue tooth) haha.. You can't just disconnect the antenna, because it still works. I still got (even though I SPECIFCALLY told the Onstar rep I wanted to opt out / cancel /etc ) a monthly report with ALL of my details. I just pulled the fuse and took the antenna off. So far, no more reports. So I assume it is not working.

Onstar is just a cell phone. You all know how well your cell phone works when you really need it. 50 - 50 chance. I know all about cell service as I was a tech for 3 years. Its only as good as your signal. But one thing it is really good at is tracking. That always works because you are at some point close to a tower for a brief moment to snag your stats. In a ditch far out of town? Good luck.

Also, for the people who have to come on and whine about others saying negative things, boo hoo. Life is not all roses. Did you not figure that out yet? If you don't like someone's negative opinion, you simply can choose not to read it. -Just as easy as you beg others not to post, you see?

If you feel your information is worthless and don't mind being tracked, that is fine. You are lifes perfect victim and corps LOVE your mindset! Being one who has worked in the info world, I've seen it all. All of it. Your whole life in the hands of other people, and some who you wouldn't trust to take your garbage out. But I'm sure you don't care about that, do you, hahaha.. ;-)

[doubletap407]

This is old stuff it has been changed since that was done !

[Ozzie RS]

Your smart phone is tracking you by Big Bother!

[Nemo13]

Yeah smart phones do too. Even if you turn it off, it's still 'active' on some or all phones. You have to yank the battery out to kill it. Your contacts are free game for 3rd parties when you use some apps. Be careful. Your friends might be getting spam email or sales calls, haha.

Sucks, but tracking is everywhere. If the phone freaks you out, use an older one, or pre paid. Even besides the tracking, doesn't it piss you off that you may be paying close to $100 for your monthly bill and these suckers are also making $$$ with your info? Hackers are moving to phones. Careful there too. I would not do any banking with a cell phone, or any other imporatant accounts. Just sayin.

[Rogue Leader]

Originally Posted by Nemo13

....

Onstar is just a cell phone. You all know how well your cell phone works when you really need it. 50 - 50 chance. I know all about cell service as I was a tech for 3 years. Its only as good as your signal. But one thing it is really good at is tracking. That always works because you are at some point close to a tower for a brief moment to snag your stats. In a ditch far out of town? Good luck.

Also, for the people who have t.....

Just wanted to mention, while Onstar is a cellphone, as discussed earlier in the thread it has a 3W antenna, it is far more powerful than a handheld battery powered cellphone. It will work in places a normal phone won't. Mine has had no problem even in the boonies of northern VT.

[SnowVert]

There is probably a much higher liability if Onstar was to track a vehicle with a cancelled subscription... Picture this, you are on a lonely stretch of back country road when you miss a corner and drive off the side into a ravine. 150 feet down, your car is invisible from the road. Your injured, unable to get out of the vehicle.

Meanwhile, dispatchers at Onstar receive a crash notification from that evil-doer's camaro advising that it was involved in a serious accident from leaving the road at a high rate of speed... while texting... They look up the account information and notice that it was cancelled yesterday because the owner was afraid of the government (which Onstar, conveniently enough, is not part of) and he felt that the tinfoil hat on the shark antenna wasn't good enough to block the signal. Since the account is cancelled, they decide to do nothing. And you die a slow painful death from starvation. Explorers find your petrified remains a thousand years from now...

While they may very well track locations, and other data from subscribers, they are not selling it to the police or calling your insurance company to tell them that you have been naughty. They will use it for their own marketing. They are in the business of making money. Not the business of law enforcement or moral judges.

But if it makes you feel better, feel free to remove the onstar box and smash it with a hammer... Just as a side note, you better do the same to your cell phone. After all, they can be tracked much more easily and have much more data on their owners than Onstar has on you.

Good luck!

[Doc]

It would be nice if someone could have a discussion about concerns they have without all the "tin foil" condescending put-downs and smart-ass remarks.

On the one hand if you have Onstar and your car is stolen and recovered as a result of Onstar, that would be a good thing. If you are involved in an accident and are trapped in the car or are unconscious and Onstar was able to get help to you and save your life, that would be a good thing.

On the other hand, if you go in to your dealer for a service call and they plug their computers into your car's computer, and that data which has everything you've done in the car is sent to the city/county/state, you could be ticketed/fined and if your insurance company is given that data, they could raise your rates or even cancel you if the data shows you were greatly exceeding the speed limit. That would not be a good thing. The fact that you were on a track when you did that might escape their attention but go ahead and try to "correct" a mistake like that in the system once it's made.

If the data implies you are a "danger and threat" to "public health and safety" and a disable command is sent shutting down your car; you now have a car that you paid/are paying for which some bureaucrat has legally disabled and it's now completely useless to you. And you also have a record now of being a "danger and threat to public safety" which of course would dramatically affect your job, career and status in society. Imagine how you'd be treated if you were pulled over by a cop and he runs your plate and that warning pops up on his screen.

There are extreme possibilities on both sides of the coin. Question is, does the good out-weigh the bad and how carefully has that been considered? As long as it's optional then you have the freedom of choice to use it or not. The moment you are forced by government to accept something that should be optional; it becomes a tyranny. That I think is the main concern.

The only thing preventing tyranny is lack of infrastructure and means to enforce it; the mentality is certainly there. Did you know in North Korea people who were seen "not grieving enough" at the recent funeral of dear departed dictator were rounded up and sent to labor camps? The mentality for that kind of tyranny is active and out there; mocking someone's concerns over it's possible establishment and growth is extremely foolish, naive and short-sighted.

It's much better to intelligently and rationally discuss it in a civil manner so everyone can be informed and aware, because only then do we have a chance to safeguard our hard-won liberties.

[1BADLS3]

Originally Posted by Doc

It would be nice if someone could have a discussion about concerns they have without all the "tin foil" condescending put-downs and smart-ass remarks.

On the one hand if you have Onstar and your car is stolen and recovered as a result of Onstar, that would be a good thing. If you are involved in an accident and are trapped in the car or are unconscious and Onstar was able to get help to you and save your life, that would be a good thing.

On the other hand, if you go in to your dealer for a service call and they plug their computers into your car's computer, and that data which has everything you've done in the car is sent to the city/county/state, you could be ticketed/fined and if your insurance company is given that data, they could raise your rates or even cancel you if the data shows you were greatly exceeding the speed limit. That would not be a good thing. The fact that you were on a track when you did that might escape their attention but go ahead and try to "correct" a mistake like that in the system once it's made.

If the data implies you are a "danger and threat" to "public health and safety" and a disable command is sent shutting down your car; you now have a car that you paid/are paying for which some bureaucrat has legally disabled and it's now completely useless to you. And you also have a record now of being a "danger and threat to public safety" which of course would dramatically affect your job, career and status in society. Imagine how you'd be treated if you were pulled over by a cop and he runs your plate and that warning pops up on his screen.

There are extreme possibilities on both sides of the coin. Question is, does the good out-weigh the bad and how carefully has that been considered? As long as it's optional then you have the freedom of choice to use it or not. The moment you are forced by government to accept something that should be optional; it becomes a tyranny. That I think is the main concern.

The only thing preventing tyranny is lack of infrastructure and means to enforce it; the mentality is certainly there. Did you know in North Korea people who were seen "not grieving enough" at the recent funeral of dear departed dictator were rounded up and sent to labor camps? The mentality for that kind of tyranny is active and out there; mocking someone's concerns over it's possible establishment and growth is extremely foolish, naive and short-sighted.

It's much better to intelligently and rationally discuss it in a civil manner so everyone can be informed and aware, because only then do we have a chance to safeguard our hard-won liberties.

Well stated. Civility should be a requirement for any conversation.

I'm on the side of the coin that sees OnStar as useful, and I have not seen any data that indicates that it could be used against me in the normal course of how I use my car.

I'll tell you what, though, if I ever wanted to rob a bank or become untraceable as I made an exit, I sure as heck wouldn't be driving the Camaro as my getaway car (as cool as I'd look...). If I ever crashed the car and was, god-forbid, under the influence, I'd be getting the hell away from that car and reporting it stolen because the police would already be on their way. OnStar can be your best friend and most helpful enemy.

But if it's me, in a situation gone wrong and I turn the car over on a remote road in a totally unintended accident, and my cell phone goes flying out of the car as the windows break out, and I'm trapped inside, injured...I'm going to be pushing that little onstar phone button for all its worth and thanking my lucky stars that I paid $20/month or whatever for that simple service.

Onstar works when a car is laying on its side, 10,000 feet up a mountain, 2 hours from the nearest place that's got a tow truck. I know this for fact.

[Rogue Leader]

Originally Posted by Doc

It would be nice if someone could have a discussion about concerns they have without all the "tin foil" condescending put-downs and smart-ass remarks.

On the one hand if you have Onstar and your car is stolen and recovered as a result of Onstar, that would be a good thing. If you are involved in an accident and are trapped in the car or are unconscious and Onstar was able to get help to you and save your life, that would be a good thing.

On the other hand, if you go in to your dealer for a service call and they plug their computers into your car's computer, and that data which has everything you've done in the car is sent to the city/county/state, you could be ticketed/fined and if your insurance company is given that data, they could raise your rates or even cancel you if the data shows you were greatly exceeding the speed limit. That would not be a good thing. The fact that you were on a track when you did that might escape their attention but go ahead and try to "correct" a mistake like that in the system once it's made.

If the data implies you are a "danger and threat" to "public health and safety" and a disable command is sent shutting down your car; you now have a car that you paid/are paying for which some bureaucrat has legally disabled and it's now completely useless to you. And you also have a record now of being a "danger and threat to public safety" which of course would dramatically affect your job, career and status in society. Imagine how you'd be treated if you were pulled over by a cop and he runs your plate and that warning pops up on his screen.

There are extreme possibilities on both sides of the coin. Question is, does the good out-weigh the bad and how carefully has that been considered? As long as it's optional then you have the freedom of choice to use it or not. The moment you are forced by government to accept something that should be optional; it becomes a tyranny. That I think is the main concern.

The only thing preventing tyranny is lack of infrastructure and means to enforce it; the mentality is certainly there. Did you know in North Korea people who were seen "not grieving enough" at the recent funeral of dear departed dictator were rounded up and sent to labor camps? The mentality for that kind of tyranny is active and out there; mocking someone's concerns over it's possible establishment and growth is extremely foolish, naive and short-sighted.

It's much better to intelligently and rationally discuss it in a civil manner so everyone can be informed and aware, because only then do we have a chance to safeguard our hard-won liberties.

I understand what you're saying. The problem is you devote 3 sentences to the good of Onstar, and 2 paragraphs to a theory about how it COULD work, when the service has been available for YEARS and never once has it been used or considered to be used in that fashion.

We've already proven here that the stories people said of OnStar calling them because they drove too fast are false (the Hennessey CTSV video it was a crash response because the car accelerated so hard it thought it was rearended). It would take a LOT for your theories to happen, and as someone mentioned earlier in this thread, and I've said in the past, OnStar isn't a public service, it isn't a charity, its there for one reason, to make money. The minute stuff like this really started to happen, people would just stop using it, cancel it, etc, and they wouldn't make one red cent.

[greenrail]

All this hysteria about a Comedy Web Site. Am I the only one here who remembers "Cracked" Magazine, a weak competitor to "Mad" Magazine.....


Geez, Lighten up folks... The OnStar Snooping stuff went away when the masses protested.

[90503]

Originally Posted by greenrail

All this hysteria about a Comedy Web Site. Am I the only one here who remembers "Cracked" Magazine, a weak competitor to "Mad" Magazine.....


Geez, Lighten up folks... The OnStar Snooping stuff went away when the masses protested.

You are not the only one who remembers those mags!!...lol

I think those who see no harm in the privacy issues of On-Star, when in fact On-Star had to be forced to stop their post-cancellation practices, speaks volumes about how the majority of people have become lulled to sleep in regards to the value of their own privacy. Just because other hi-tech gadgets can and are being used for various info gathering and tracking type purposes, is no reason to become numb to their potential and future harmful uses.

I find it outrageous that we are asked to pay for what seems like a convenience and good idea at the time, but which actually is a total scam to collect data on your personal habits and patterns, for which we recieve no compensation and do not even approve of. To blow off this type of corporate practice, is exactly what every type of hi-tech gadget manufacturer loves too see. Besides laughing their asses off behind our back, we are made to feel like the bad guy if we want it stopped.

Many cars have a gas guzzler tax when purchased. I could foresee a "high mpg assessment/penalty"...if your driving habits put you way below the rated mpg for your car. And they would have the technology available to show that! The potential for all types of gov't regulation and social engineering with all the hi-tech info gathering at their disposal is mind-boggling.

If you choose to blow it off and play their game, do so at your own peril!

When I drive my Camaro, I want it to be an enjoyable and as "free" experience as possible.

[joe h]

Your average $200 gps, or smart phone app, blows onstar out of the water.

Bluetooth and your own cell phone will always be better than the lousy prepaid onstar service that is tied to one car.

For $3/month verizon will unluck any door, provide fuel, and tow 10 miles any car that my phone is next to. AAA will provide better service than onstar for $91 a year.

I have yet to hear one story where automatic crash response worked where a person was unable to dialing 911. I am not paying $200 per car per year for an occurrence that is less likely than 2 lightning strikes or winning the lottery.

The only places that cell phones do not work, are the same places onstar has little chance of working. Desert back roads, mountainous areas, deep valleys, metal building.

I would rather my car stayed stolen and my insurance cuts me a check, than get a car back that was beaten to ##@@!!#$!

[irocnroll]

The selling of you information to companies is to improve response services in those areas with problems. Or to adjust insurance rates for vehicles with fewer or more accidents. The data that is sent off to other companies, be it law enforcement or insurance agencies is agregated and does not include personal information such as names.

It most likely contains the make, model and year of the car as well as the geographic area. All of which will be used to make decisions at a large scale. They arent ratting you out to the patrol man saying John Doe in his 2011 Camaro with VIN XYZ just drove 60mph in a 30mph zone. You need to take the tin foil hats off and understand what is being done with the data.

This goes for Social Networking sites and Google as well. Its how they figure out how to target people for advertisements. If you have a key word in your profile Marketing companies pay to have advertisements show up on peoples pages that have specific key words on their page. They have no idea who you are. Its all based on Age, Location and interests.

Do some research before you post up false claims and bogus articles.

[Obzen]

We already had about 75 threads about this a couple months ago when this was actually news. OnStar already decided not to implement those two new agreements because of the shit storm they got.

Cracked should probably let the "professionals" handle the news from now on.