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Old 07-07-2011, 01:12 PM   #11817
Huggerorange73
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Originally Posted by Black5thgen View Post
I must have logged on to the wrong website again............. wait a minute.........this is Camaro5.
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Old 07-07-2011, 01:12 PM   #11818
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New left over 2011 GT500's are going for as low as $44-47k.

Sure a 5.0L with a blower on it is going to make more then the stock GT500 but the 5.0L is now stuck at my stock GT500's power level due to its non forged pistons and spent almost 10k to get there.

Now for the GT500 the fun has just begin because they can take 22psi of boost all day and it only takes $2,500 supercharger swap that you can do in you driveway in 2 hours and enjoy making 700whp+ and the rest of the drivetrain is stout enough to take vs the questionable GT trans.

Last edited by BigDan; 07-07-2011 at 02:21 PM.
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Old 07-07-2011, 01:20 PM   #11819
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Originally Posted by BigDan View Post
New left over 2011 GT500's are going for as low as $44-47k.

Sure a 5.0L with a blower on it is going to make more then the stock GT500 but the 5.0L is now stuck at my stock GT500 power level due to its non forged pistons and spent almost 10k to get there.

Now for the GT500 the fun has just begin because they can take 22psi of boost all day and it only takes $2,500 supercharger swap that you can do in you driveway in 2 hours and enjoy making 700whp+ and the rest of the drivetrain is stout enough to take vs the questionable GT trans.

Completely agree..
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Old 07-07-2011, 01:21 PM   #11820
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Yes, it is true. You're right, the difference may not be clear cut from one car to the next, but the bottom line is that shorter gears will not make any car accelerate any faster once the engine is in the powerband. Its as simple as that, and physics back it up 100%.

Acceleration is a direct relationship with horsepower. If a car makes 400WHP at 6,000RPM, it will make that same horsepower with 3.42 gears or 4.10 gears, and therefore accelerate at the same rate at that given RPM. The difference is the car with 4.10's will just go through the gears faster, but the speedometer will climb at the same rate.
All gears do is help you get into the powerband faster in 1st gear, so they are good for drag racing, allowing you to get off the line faster.
That is not accurate. Put a really high gear (low number) and see how fast you accelerate at higher rpms. You will hardly increase speed. Effective torque is what creats acceleration. Effective torque meaning what the tires are putting to the road. Heck, with your theory you would accelerate the same in 1st gear as sixth. Engine speed + transmission gear+rear gear all effect the effective torque and/or acceleration. Gears add a multiplier to the effective torque which will then increase your acceleration. That is why it is easier to spin yor tires with gears then not.
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Old 07-07-2011, 02:02 PM   #11821
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Originally Posted by Sax1031 View Post
Latest rumors have the 2013 GT500 at 650hp with a variant of the 5.0, not 5.4. Supposed to be turbo instead of supercharged.
The ZL1 is supposed to have 675 hp in 2014. Get at me.
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Old 07-07-2011, 02:05 PM   #11822
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Did not sound like the stock tranny.
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Old 07-07-2011, 02:12 PM   #11823
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Originally Posted by a_Username View Post
The ZL1 is supposed to have 675 hp in 2014. Get at me.
If Chevrolet really wanted to hit a home run with the ZL1 they should have gone with the LS9 instead of the LSA.
The hand built made in the USA LS9 makes more sense than the made in Mexico LSA to go against the hand built made in the USA 5.4 GT500 engine.
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Old 07-07-2011, 05:08 PM   #11824
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Originally Posted by BigDan View Post
Another thing to take into consideration is how long and high the engines power band goes. This is where a stock LS3 had the disadvantage to the 5.0L because it make's its power lower in the rpm range and with a shorter rpm power band vs the new 5.0L's power band which it higher up there and can be taken past 7,500 rpm while still maintaining peak power.

This is the reason why Honda's and other 4 cylinder even bother racing.

In road racing higher rpms help. In drag racing not a big factor but torque is very important. In the 60's and 70's big blocks did not rev like the small blocks but they had the torque. Same is true with the LS3 over the 5.0 can not rev as high but it has more torque.
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Old 07-07-2011, 05:33 PM   #11825
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In road racing higher rpms help. In drag racing not a big factor but torque is very important. In the 60's and 70's big blocks did not rev like the small blocks but they had the torque. Same is true with the LS3 over the 5.0 can not rev as high but it has more torque.
Horsepower in the usable rpm range is what's important.
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Old 07-07-2011, 06:48 PM   #11826
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Originally Posted by 8cd03gro View Post
Horsepower in the usable rpm range is what's important.
I must disagree. While you need to consider HP in the power band you want but torque and its curve on the power band is equally or more important. Torque is what launches you off the line and will give you the advantage over a high HP lower torque car. For example two equal cars but one has 3.73 gears the other has 4.11s. who wins? the car with 4.11's because it has more force to rotate the tires, thus torque, and will accelerate quicker.
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Old 07-07-2011, 07:06 PM   #11827
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I must disagree. While you need to consider HP in the power band you want but torque and its curve on the power band is equally or more important. Torque is what launches you off the line and will give you the advantage over a high HP lower torque car. For example two equal cars but one has 3.73 gears the other has 4.11s. who wins? the car with 4.11's because it has more force to rotate the tires, thus torque, and will accelerate quicker.
Horsepower is a function of torque and RPM. Whichever car has more torque in the USABLE rpm range will also have more power in the usable rpm range. Ideally, a car will immediately be in the bottom of it's powerband at launch with a proper setup for drag racing. Shorter gearing does not necessarily mean better overall acceleration. What's important is balancing gearing with the power delivery of the engine to maintain the highest average hp throughout the used rpm range.

We're basically arguing the same point, but what's important is the usable rpm range, not the curve before then. If you launch at 4,500rpm and redline at 7,500, the only important power and torque figures for racing are within that range, most importantly whatever your post-shift rpm is in each gear to redline. Whichever car makes more torque at those rpms is also making more horsepower as hp=tq*rpm/5252. The broader the rev range, the more you can take advantage of shorter gearing to shift that powerband and torque multiplication.

Last edited by 8cd03gro; 07-07-2011 at 07:38 PM.
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Old 07-07-2011, 07:40 PM   #11828
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Originally Posted by macwest View Post
In road racing higher rpms help. In drag racing not a big factor but torque is very important. In the 60's and 70's big blocks did not rev like the small blocks but they had the torque. Same is true with the LS3 over the 5.0 can not rev as high but it has more torque.
Low end torque is great and all especially when driving around town but it doesn't play that big of a role or have a big advantage in drag racing these modern muscle cars like the Mustang because it's launching at 6k rpm and is in 2nd gear in about a second and then its just nothing but 5k-7500k pulls the rest of the way down the strip. Stock 5.0L's are pulling air with a dead hook on stickies at the track so torque is not a problem with the 5.0L
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Old 07-07-2011, 08:21 PM   #11829
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I have a 2011 Shelby, and a 2011 Camaro SS, both are wonderful rides.

Shelby is fun to drive, and a real monster when you push it. I have the performance package with the 3.73 gears and it's easy to break the rear end loose if you aren't careful.

Camaro is also very fast and lots of fun to drive. It's a little easier to control under hard acceleration.

In a straight race extra 124hp Shelby makes the difference. They are a great garage pair if you love muscle cars.

I looked at the 392 Hemi several times, and always wanted a Hemi......but the Dodge names is tough to overcome!
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Old 07-07-2011, 09:16 PM   #11830
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That is very misleading. You got to remember it's a performance company trying to sell a product. That car is far from stock. They probably mean it has a stock bottom end ,but three passes don't mean it's reliable.
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