06-19-2014, 04:29 PM | #15 |
Drives: Widebody 2013 Mustang GT Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: 1721 E. Lambert Rd. Unit C, La Habra, Ca 90631
Posts: 2,848
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I was in the same boat as you originally. My car I road race all the time, I take to autocross events, but I wanted more power. I went with Vortech with a centrifugal supercharger, primarily because my 10 years of racing experience and my knowledge of how these superchargers discharge power, the centrifugal BY FAR for a road racing car is going to be suited for you much better than a twin screw blower.
Those who are suggesting twin screw blowers know that the torque you get from a twin screw is almost instantaneous. Putting a significant amount of torque down instantly is NOT good for road racing, nor is it good for autocross. I know this from experience, I had a Kenne Bell twin screw on one of my previous cars, and even at 2,500 RPM the torque was too big to put the power to the ground. Now some might say, don't you want torque? That's true, BUT not the way the twin screw delivers the torque. Getting out of a corner, the most important aspect of racing, putting the power down out of a corner, is very difficult to do with a boat ton of torque. Where the centrifugal benefits is that it's a linear power band, still with a high torque level, but it's not going to cause a spin like a twin screw would. I personally prefer the centrifugal on my car because of that, making it easier to drive on the streets, and much easier to drive very fast on a track. Think about it, seriously, you'll see where I'm coming from. I feel very adamant about the centrifugal for road racing cars, it's just too much torque on the ground too quickly with a twin screw. Hope that helps! Let me know if you have any questions |
06-19-2014, 05:58 PM | #16 |
Banned
Drives: 2010 Camaro Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: United States
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Good luck with your choice.
Autocross is about handling and linear torque. Make your decision based on that . I love my eforce and have over 33k on it . |
06-19-2014, 09:59 PM | #17 |
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Drives: 2010 2SS/RS Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: OC
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I am leaning heavily on the E Force and can get it at a smoking deal $6200 delivered to my door. But I live on Cali so I can not retune or it voids the carb, I would love to run it with headers and an intake but once again there goes the carb... So I have to run the unit bone stock. And besides I don't want the hassle of changing parts every smog and retuning all the time.
What is the heart beat??? Is that just the Magnuson? |
06-19-2014, 10:04 PM | #18 | |
CamaroFans.com
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Quote:
If my only choice was an E-Force I'd stay Naturally Aspirated. |
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06-19-2014, 11:29 PM | #19 |
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What do you mean by that? Stay naturally aspirated? The Edelbrock E Force is not a good choice compared to Magnuson???
In this thread there are about 5 or so people that praise this kit? So I don't really understand why you say that? The numbers between the edelbroxk and the Maggie are very very close ok a stock application. |
06-20-2014, 06:40 AM | #20 |
Drives: 2014 zl1 triple black Join Date: May 2014
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 439
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Heartbeat has my vote getting one myself
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06-20-2014, 08:04 AM | #21 | |
Drives: 2007 Corvette C6 983 RWHP Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 690
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Quote:
The eforce has been around a while now and has proved to be trouble free, while making decent power. If someone wants really big power, or plans to go that route later, neither the eforce or heartbeat are the right choice for them. Of the two in question, I think it comes down to personal preference. If you have some actual logs, results, or proof that the heartbeat makes better power or runs cooler, please post it up. I keep hearing that story but never seeing any proof.
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2007 C6 vert, auto, F55, LT3
LME LS402 , WCCH 245 Heads, Pat G. Custom cam YSI / 3.0 pulley, ARH 1 7/8 headers, NPP Dewitts / dual spals, A&A dual pump fuel system. 3.42 polished gears, hardened shafts, Alky control meth, Cartech line lock, ECS axle loops, Trans brace, 6L80 built by me. ID 1000 injectors, comp rockers, Morel lifters, BT springs, Trend 3/8 pushrods, ATI 10% OD Damper Circle D Triple Disc stall 1009 RWHP @ 7000, 817 RWTQ @ 6000, |
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06-20-2014, 08:05 AM | #22 |
Drives: 2007 Corvette C6 983 RWHP Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Montreal, Canada
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Pretty dumb statement. I have yet to meet many eforce owners who are not happy with the decision.
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2007 C6 vert, auto, F55, LT3
LME LS402 , WCCH 245 Heads, Pat G. Custom cam YSI / 3.0 pulley, ARH 1 7/8 headers, NPP Dewitts / dual spals, A&A dual pump fuel system. 3.42 polished gears, hardened shafts, Alky control meth, Cartech line lock, ECS axle loops, Trans brace, 6L80 built by me. ID 1000 injectors, comp rockers, Morel lifters, BT springs, Trend 3/8 pushrods, ATI 10% OD Damper Circle D Triple Disc stall 1009 RWHP @ 7000, 817 RWTQ @ 6000, |
06-20-2014, 09:41 AM | #23 |
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Well what would make really big power but is legal in California? The whipple?
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06-20-2014, 10:57 AM | #24 |
Drives: 2007 Corvette C6 983 RWHP Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 690
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Define "really big".
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2007 C6 vert, auto, F55, LT3
LME LS402 , WCCH 245 Heads, Pat G. Custom cam YSI / 3.0 pulley, ARH 1 7/8 headers, NPP Dewitts / dual spals, A&A dual pump fuel system. 3.42 polished gears, hardened shafts, Alky control meth, Cartech line lock, ECS axle loops, Trans brace, 6L80 built by me. ID 1000 injectors, comp rockers, Morel lifters, BT springs, Trend 3/8 pushrods, ATI 10% OD Damper Circle D Triple Disc stall 1009 RWHP @ 7000, 817 RWTQ @ 6000, |
06-20-2014, 02:24 PM | #25 |
Speed Freak
Drives: 2013 ZL1 Camaro, 2016 Camaro SS Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Ardmore, OK
Posts: 2,637
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California has a little more regulations than most other states but if a car is tuned properly by a good tuner just about any forced induction system can pass emissions tests.
All of the TVS 2.3 roots blowers use the exact same rotors produced by Eaton. This includes the E-force, the LS9 on the ZR1 Corvette, Magnacharger, Heartbeat and many other superchargers built for other brands of cars. The difference between these blowers is all related to the airflow design and the cooling capacity of the intercooler(s) built into the supercharger. Better airflow always equals more power, this is why we do porting on heads, put in bigger cams and throtle bodies, to get better airflow. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to look at the internal design of a blower and see some have rounded flowing chambers and lids and some have square and boxy chambers and lids. This all effects airflow. As you drive the blower faster it makes more heat. The ability of the blower to transfer the heat to the cooling system and still pass a large volume of air through the coolers always determine the upper limit of the performance capability of a blower. If you don't plan on running the blower at its limits these issues don't matter a bit. Any one of the blowers mentioned above can give you 550whp without breaking a sweat. But if you start trying to make 800whp with a 2.3 blower it is going to get down right impossible with some of these blowers because you cannot get the amount of air the engine needs crammed through the intercoolers at a reasonable temperature. The Heartbeat is the newest kid on the block and Magnuson did a lot of research into the issues I have described in the above paragraphs and they made a better blower. I have already seen the maximum amount of boost some folks are running through this blower and it is above what the others will run. Try to run 17 pounds of boost through an E-force and tell me how that works for you, people are doing it without any trouble the Heartbeat. I'm swapping a heartbeat onto my car right now and within a couple of weeks I should be able to put up some numbers on the difference in maximum power between a Heartbeat and a LS9 blower at least. I have had 5 different superchargers on different cars I have owned and just going by evaluation of the design features, I would recommend the Heartbeat.
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2016 SS -AGP twin Borg Warner 7163 EFR's, LT4 mechanical pump, LT4 injectors, Walbro 255 low side, Castrol SRF. 734whp/759 tq
2013 ZL1 -ADM - 427 LSX 6 bolt, O-ringed block built by LME. Twin PT6466 turbos. RPM custom manual trans, RPS Quad carbon clutch, 9" Hendrix rear diff & axles. ADM/squash fuel system, Ron Davis radiator, Spal fans, AGP air to air, turbo plumbing. LPE oil cooler, rear bushing upgrade, roll bar...etc. rwhp 1400+... 212.5mph, best Texas mile to date. |
06-20-2014, 03:48 PM | #26 | |
Drives: 2007 Corvette C6 983 RWHP Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 690
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Quote:
People may think I am pushing the eforce but I am not. I am hoping that the claim of more power and lower IAT's with the heartbeat is true, in which case I might consider a swap myself. So far what I have seen doesn't support the claims though.
__________________
2007 C6 vert, auto, F55, LT3
LME LS402 , WCCH 245 Heads, Pat G. Custom cam YSI / 3.0 pulley, ARH 1 7/8 headers, NPP Dewitts / dual spals, A&A dual pump fuel system. 3.42 polished gears, hardened shafts, Alky control meth, Cartech line lock, ECS axle loops, Trans brace, 6L80 built by me. ID 1000 injectors, comp rockers, Morel lifters, BT springs, Trend 3/8 pushrods, ATI 10% OD Damper Circle D Triple Disc stall 1009 RWHP @ 7000, 817 RWTQ @ 6000, |
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06-20-2014, 06:42 PM | #27 |
Drives: 2015 1LE Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: SE Florida
Posts: 311
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Here is a thread on the heartbeat. Seeing how they have not released a kit for the SS yet its difficult to get much info on them.
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=346187 I can't wait to see some solid info and testing on this supercharger. |
06-20-2014, 06:48 PM | #28 | |
Speed Freak
Drives: 2013 ZL1 Camaro, 2016 Camaro SS Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Ardmore, OK
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Quote:
I will put the numbers up on the Heartbeat when it is done. I suspect I will be able to spin it a little faster before the power drops off and this will translate into more peak horsepower. My LS9 blower made a peak of 835 no matter what combination of pulleys I ran on the car. I could show more boost on the gauge but the boost was coming from hot air rather than more air and to make more power you have got to get more air in the engine. Couple weeks and it should be on the dyno.
__________________
2016 SS -AGP twin Borg Warner 7163 EFR's, LT4 mechanical pump, LT4 injectors, Walbro 255 low side, Castrol SRF. 734whp/759 tq
2013 ZL1 -ADM - 427 LSX 6 bolt, O-ringed block built by LME. Twin PT6466 turbos. RPM custom manual trans, RPS Quad carbon clutch, 9" Hendrix rear diff & axles. ADM/squash fuel system, Ron Davis radiator, Spal fans, AGP air to air, turbo plumbing. LPE oil cooler, rear bushing upgrade, roll bar...etc. rwhp 1400+... 212.5mph, best Texas mile to date. |
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