MERGED: Has anyone read this (bankruptcy) about GM?

[headpunter]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

Buy the bumper sticker (actually magnetic) that I have:

"Out of a Job Yet? Keep buying foreign!"

http://cgi.ebay.com/ONE-OUT-OF-A-JOB...1%7C240%3A1318

1 Billion % correct.....i got in an arguement with a family member about the quality of foreigns vs domestics and then i showed him our tahoe and my colorado vs his Nissan.....no comparison in the trim and durability of his car vs ours. And his nissan only drive like 10 miles a day, i drive my truck for work and put 1000 - 1300 miles a month on and our GM vehicles are still nicer then his car....

[Hylton]

Well I remember when Japan used to have us drop goods off at the farthest end of the country. We should have all Japanese cars dropped off in the Jersey area instead of Seattle and Vancouver.

[headpunter]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Mirror trade laws. If Japan makes it a pain to export cars to them, fine. Make it a pain for them to export cars to us. Thing is, they need America to buy Japans (or Korean or German) cars a lot more than America (or Canada) needs those cars. Our plants could make up for the gap, but there isn't another market that will buy 1,000,000 Toyota's each year. Oh, and take measures to stop the influx of foreign assembly plants too so that the gap is made up by domestic automakers as opposed to Honda Canada or Kia Motors America. Sure they create jobs , but what does it really help with it forces the closure of a plant in Michigan or Ontario?

and the profits dont even stay here...

[trm0002]

How about we get some Government to citizen incentives for the Camaro or for buying US vehicles in general? Their version of factory-to-dealer incentives. They're giving money to everyone else, why not some to us to help purchase the car? Hell, it's our money anyways...

Government backed 0% financing on any new US vehicle? That would actually make some sense wouldn't it? That's why it'll never happen.

-end rant-

[fastball]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

OK....I'm willing to go along with your suggestions. (and no, you aren't making me mad..... Fastball, I'm glad you're on this site!!!)

BUT--

Tell me how you will:

>Address francise laws to compensate all dealerships that will necessarily have to be terminated. What are your plans to take over leases of dealership facilities? What is your plan to fund "blue sky" that is provided for under most francise laws. How do you plan to arrive at a 'fair' settlement to each Dealer Operator? And -- what are your best estimates (dollar-wise) for escrowing money to show 'good faith' as you go to court in hundreds if not thousands of lawsuits that will occur when you close down a francise?


>Address the volumes of each Division using last year's CYTD total sales volume.....and how you plan to move that volume to other Divisions within the company. What is the budget amount you plan to request in order to carry out adequate marketing activities? (remember -- we STILL have people coming into car shows saying 'wow....I didn't know they WEREN'T building Camaros!' and "where are the new Oldsmobiles?" (yes - it happens .........a LOT!)

>Address how you will fund payments to employees who will be out of a job under this plan.

>Address how you will fund all current contracts for parts/services/proprietary assets with outside suppliers and contractors.

>Address how you will fund all tax abatements offered by current states and municipalities when you close select plants (including sheetmetal stamping/powertrain/etc) facilities.


Good luck -- you are going to be quite busy.

(and again, Fastball - this is nothing against you and I don't want you to think I'm picking on you --) but I DO hope that everyone stops for a minute and thinks about what I'm saying........

See -- we have looked at this from "60 ways to Sunday" -- and if it WERE doable-- we would have done it.

I gotta tell you. ( 'you' meaning everyone on this site..) If you think you have the answer to the nightmares this country is facing - you most likely don't -- because there are thousands upon thousands of people with more experience than you or me -- and with better insight than you or me -- and I guess the bottom line is:

There is NO easy list of solutions............and DEFINITELY not one solution to anything.........

Now -- that said -- conversation is good...........

I have a very good feeling franchise laws could be defeated in court with GM's current financial situation. If the company becomes insolvent because dealers insist on getting massive settlements and lease payoffs, they would not get anything near what they ask for. If GM continues to opperate on their current platform with 7 divisions producing redundant product, they will become insolvent at the current pace, hanging EVERY dealer out to dry, with nothing for them to sue for (sucking blood out of a turnip, etc.)

Every efficiently operated company does this every so often. It's called restructuring, not just layoffs or cutbacks. But a full, complete restructure of GM as a company, not just a car manufacturer. Thus, franchise laws should not be applicable.

You have lots of lawyers on your side. I'm sure they could argue that in court and win.

[Scotsman]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

Buy the bumper sticker (actually magnetic) that I have:

"Out of a Job Yet? Keep buying foreign!"

http://cgi.ebay.com/ONE-OUT-OF-A-JOB...1%7C240%3A1318

How much does this matter anymore with parts being made literally all over the world??? Not to mention our economy is a globalized one; what happens to one country (as we now see) directly impacts pretty much all other national economies.

[RealQuickCamaro]

it looks like the Canadian Government is going to provide aid also


Although the federal government has promised the auto sector some C$450 million ($375 million) in grants, McGuinty said more would have to be done and in particular cited the need for loan guarantees.


"I found some positive signals and I am now confident we can work with Prime Minister Harper, (Industry) Minister (Tony) Clement and the automobile sector to find a solution," he said after the meeting, without giving details.


McGuinty said he would meet with the Canadian arms of General Motors Corp, Ford Motor Co, and Chrysler -- most likely next week -- to discuss what an aid package might look like

[HotRodPilot]

There are plenty of imported cars here in Japan. You should see the huge number of European cars on the road here.

GM, Ford, and Chrysler don't make cars that people want to buy here

[headpunter]

Originally Posted by HotRodPilot

There are plenty of imported cars here in Japan. You should see the huge number of European cars on the road here.

GM, Ford, and Chrysler don't make cars that people want to buy here

doesnt change the fact that the japenese government limits imports by each foreign manufacturer into the country

[HotRodPilot]

Originally Posted by headpunter

doesnt change the fact that the japenese government limits imports by each foreign manufacturer into the country

source?

BMWs and VWs are everywhere here, as are M-Bs.

If I want to go to the Chrysler dealer and get a Jeep or a Caliber the dearler isn't going to tell me "oh, sorry, since we can only import so many cars you can't buy one"

[Max]

I seen it comming,i knew one day this would happen.You cant keep sending our jobs over seas and expect us to have jobs to buy products.imports have killed this country.And it's to late to say buy American now when nothing is being built here.Camaro is built in canada,Ford and GM both use Mexican labor.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by HotRodPilot

source?

BMWs and VWs are everywhere here, as are M-Bs.

If I want to go to the Chrysler dealer and get a Jeep or a Caliber the dearler isn't going to tell me "oh, sorry, since we can only import so many cars you can't buy one"

Well, every other market in the world where GM is the most popular auto maker. Generally they have 10-25% market share wherever they go. So to think that its an inability for GM to make a car that the Japanesse people want is a bit absurd. They make plenty of small cars for europe and south east asia that sell well. Oh, and there is this. http://www.mac.doc.gov/japan/nte/2004nte.pdf
on page 31

Originally Posted by US Department of Commerce

Further opening of the Japanese auto and auto parts markets remains an important objective of the United
States. Access to Japan’s automotive market continues to be impeded by a variety of overly restrictive
regulations, a lack of transparency in rule making, and lackluster enforcement of antitrust laws. While
there has been a trend toward closer integration and important technological advancements in the global
automotive industry over the past several years, the effect these changes will have on market access and
competition in this sector remain unclear.
The U.S. Government remains disappointed with falling sales of North American-made vehicles and parts
in Japan. Sales of motor vehicles produced in the United States declined in 2003, with sales decreasing
by 15 percent (year-on-year) following a decline of 17 percent in 2002. U.S. automakers sell less than a
quarter as many U.S.-made vehicles in Japan as they did in 1995.
Even as American automakers have invested in Japanese auto manufacturers, foreign access to Japan’s
automotive distribution network remains troubling to U.S. auto companies. The U.S. automotive trade
imbalance with Japan, $44 billion in 2003 ($32 billion deficit in autos and $12 billion deficit in auto
parts), is the equivalent of more than 66 percent of the overall U.S. trade deficit with Japan and made up
eight percent of the 2003 worldwide U.S. trade deficit.
The Automotive Consultative Group, which is co-chaired by USTR and the Department of Commerce on
the U.S. side and METI and Ministry of Land, Infrastructure, and Transport (MLIT) on the Japanese side,
met in January 2003. The group discussed industry trends based on a series of trade and economic data
on autos and automotive parts provided by both countries and identified areas in which specific action can
be taken by Japan to address U.S. concerns. This would include further deregulation (particularly in the
automotive parts aftermarket), increased transparency in rules and regulations governing this sector, and
more rigorous application of Japanese competition laws. The United States also continues to address
cross-cutting issues affecting the automotive sector, such as expanding opportunities for foreign
investment, increasing transparency in rule making, and promoting corporate restructuring in the Japanese
economy under the Economic Partnership for Growth.

[trm0002]

Originally Posted by Max

I seen it coming,i knew one day this would happen.You cant keep sending our jobs over seas and expect us to have jobs to buy products.imports have killed this country.And it's to late to say buy American now when nothing is being built here.Camaro is built in canada,Ford and GM both use Mexican labor.

There is a lot of truth to that statement. While you still have the option of buying an American vehicle, try to buy an American-made TV or toaster for that matter...

[Stevo]

OMG...10,000 shares of GM = 1 camaro SS...