2011 Camaro. Grinds when shifting from 1st to 2nd under hard acceleration - Page 3 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

mad@gm · 12-02-2010, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by denster

It is so important that everyone on this page and on this site that are having this problem to go to your dealer and report the problem. I have been working with my dealer and with GM and they say this is the first they have heard of this problem.
If you are having this problem, then report it.

Been there done that, the most common excuse I hear is "operating as designed" "can't duplicate the customers concern" and when I have asked to take a tech for a ride to duplicate the problem the answer has always been no followed by a B.S. reason why! So I guess I have to wait for this P.O.S. to explode before anything is fixed, truly love the car but the quality of it totally SUCKS! I've had nothing but problem after problem, and for those that got a good one I'm very happy you don't have to go through the crap me and some others have, been fighting since April 2010 to get my problems resolved and looks like no end in sight, and these stupid a$$, non-American customer care people that can barely speak english are no help at all either, sorry just pisses me off!

Logan1234 · 12-03-2010, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by autobotaz

Mine started doing this between around 4500 miles. I also noticed some noise when when pushing the clutch in especially at low speed, like the clutch wasn't fully disengaging. I took a look at my clutch fluid and it was black. I suctioned the black stuff out and replaced with GM Super DOT4 fluid and I have not had any problems since and the noise when pushing in the clutch is gone.

I think people should take a closer look at what you found with your car... the clutch not disengaging was/is a common problem with 03/04 Cobras (along with the high rpm shift and grind) so most owners eventually go with an aftermarket adjustment setup.

denster · 12-03-2010, 11:49 AM

Ok, so get this.... I took the car to the dealer, and I described how it grinds from 1st to 2nd at 3500 rpms, and about 1/4 gas pedal. he took it for a drive and shifted at about 1500 to 2000 rpms. Can you believe that he had the nerve to tell me that I should not be shifting at 3500 rpms, and that was beating on the car. I explained that the redline on this car was 6500. He also told me that I shift too fast and I should be pausing once I have the pedal pressed in before I move the stick shift. I also pointed out to him that he stalled it out 3 times before leaving the parking lot, and that he was the one who is not familiar with driving a stick shift. I told him it is a camaro, not a kia and that 3500 rpm is not considered high. While he was driving it, it also did the grinding. He told me it was because he had accidentally shifted improperly. He told me that it's not a race car and the problem with the grinding is user error. He said I'm not driving it properly. I told him I don't recall seeing anywhere in the GM manual that says you have to pause inbetween shifts, or that GM recommends shifting at 2000 rpm.
Un F*&%ing believable! I think people like him should not be working for gm and should not be representing them.

ssmike · 12-03-2010, 01:16 PM

This kind of stuff just gets my blood boiling! People like him should not be doing a customer service job because he obviously isn't a good listener! He has a predetermined opinion about everyone that we are all just morons that don't know anything about a car! When I brought mine in for notchy 3rd gear, for the 3rd time, I described the problem with my "service advisor" and I had to clearify 4 times as he was writing up the work order! Then he finally agreed to a test drive and I soon learned that HE had no clue! He admitted being a "rooky" at driving a "stick" and he was short shifting and just being a ***** shifting. Of course he only "felt it maybe 1 time but it may have been my shifting"...WTF! At least he did make a note of it but the technician reported "no trouble found"! Hire some proffessionals to be service advisors rather than some punk off the streets! This is just an insult to our intelligence! These are real problems that we're experiencing, what's i gonna take to get GM to listen???

MaddogZ28 · 12-03-2010, 04:24 PM

I have something along these lines. It doesn't grind usually when i put it into second but it is sometimes difficult to put it into second. sometimes it doesn't go in because its being difficult and then it grinds but as soon as i muscle it into 2nd it doesn't grind.

Also, third is pretty notchy and not smooth to shift into.

mad@gm · 12-03-2010, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by denster

Ok, so get this.... I took the car to the dealer, and I described how it grinds from 1st to 2nd at 3500 rpms, and about 1/4 gas pedal. he took it for a drive and shifted at about 1500 to 2000 rpms. Can you believe that he had the nerve to tell me that I should not be shifting at 3500 rpms, and that was beating on the car. I explained that the redline on this car was 6500. He also told me that I shift too fast and I should be pausing once I have the pedal pressed in before I move the stick shift. I also pointed out to him that he stalled it out 3 times before leaving the parking lot, and that he was the one who is not familiar with driving a stick shift. I told him it is a camaro, not a kia and that 3500 rpm is not considered high. While he was driving it, it also did the grinding. He told me it was because he had accidentally shifted improperly. He told me that it's not a race car and the problem with the grinding is user error. He said I'm not driving it properly. I told him I don't recall seeing anywhere in the GM manual that says you have to pause inbetween shifts, or that GM recommends shifting at 2000 rpm.
Un F*&%ing believable! I think people like him should not be working for gm and should not be representing them.

Just gotta love the B.S. don't ya! I was told anything over 60mph was aggressive, so what do you do when the speed limit is 70mph, get run over? I was also told that Im not suppose to downshift to 1st(grinds) till I completely stop! Well thats funny seeing how my manual says 40mph and under, don't GM teach these people anything?

denster · 12-08-2010, 11:53 AM

well i took it to a different dealer and they noticed the problem immediately. they took it in the shop and are currently working with GM to fix it. they said they're gonna change either the synchronizers, or the entire trans. i'm not sure yet. The one thing that I don't understand is since my car only had 1600 miles on it, you would think my synchronizers were new already. I don't see what the difference would be of putting new ones in. Are there any transmission experts that could explain. No guesses, only qualified manual transmission experts please.

ssmike · 12-08-2010, 12:21 PM

From what I have read it's all about tollerance. Some Tremecs are tighter than others. GM must have a loose spec on thier syncro tolerances for the assembly proccess. I've also heard that some guys are having their mechanics make adjustments to the syncros. Of course that would not be a warranty repair. I would ask the dealer doing your work to make sure the tolerances of the replacement syncros are dead nuts in the center of the spec, if they can! Hope this helps, and I'm glad you found a dealership to help you out!

denster · 12-08-2010, 12:46 PM

interesting. I just recently spoke to someone about this also and they stated that the replacement synchros may have a taper that the factory ones didn't.

RipperFox · 12-10-2010, 03:46 AM

I have been having the same issues as all of you.

1. Grinds 1st to 2nd at higher RPM's
2. Tried a new shifter (Hurst), got no better, maybe worse. Probably cause it shifts even faster.
3. Change the fluild to Mobile Syn. No improvement.
4. Noticed that is happens alot more when tranny temp is colder. Above 75-80F, nearly goes away.
5. I can get it to do in the garage too.

In the garage, I notice that if I go from neutral ALMOST into 1st. (just to the point of resistance) and hold it there. Then pull back into second really quick it will grind. No clutch involved at all. Pedal to the floor, car at idle.
Now, let me say that again. I get the exact same grind, from 1st to 2nd, if I push the clutch tothe floor, just nearly push it into 1st, hold or a couple of seconds, and pull back into 2nd (as if speed shifting), and it will grind. Car is at 500-700 RPM the whole time, clutch is on the floor, the whole time. Give it a little gas (say 2-3K RPM) and it will grind like speed shifting at 6K.

Someone else try this and see what results you get. PM me or post here.

This is why I know it is the syncro's: RPM, clutch are not involved in this test. Syncro's are not match gear speeds quick enough for these gears. That is why slowing down your shift fixes the situation. I do believe that the tappered syncro's could be the cure for this.

I think what is happening in the garage is: The syncro's are matching speed to first gear (just at the edge of the entry gate), and when you are pulling into 2nd really quick, there is not enough time for the 2nd gear syncro to make gear speed.

The temperature thing: The viscosity of the tranny fluild is lower thus allowing the bearings and thus the gears to react faster.

ssmike · 12-10-2010, 08:23 AM

Very interesting! I'd like to try that on my car but the throttle body is off waiting for the CNC porting! I'll try it as soon as I can. In the mean time hopefully some other guys can try it! Good observation and I agree that it points to a syncro problem!

denster · 12-12-2010, 06:22 PM

the dealership called me and said they replaced the transmission and put a brand new one in. They said they tested it and the problem does not occur. I will be picking it up tomorrow, so hopefully they are correct.

awforeman · 12-14-2010, 08:26 AM

Hey guys, add me to the list. I'm having a serious problem with this also. Just e-mailed my dealership and we'll see what happens. My car has about 500 miles on it and I have been unable to quick shift into 2nd without grinding. I have the factory Hurst installed. In my other car I have grinded maybe twice in 100K, and already over 5 times in my camaro.....I wanted to attribute it to driver error, but after that many times I have to start blaming the car. I will post updates as I figure things out

2010 SS RS · 12-14-2010, 08:39 AM

1,2 and 3 gear syncros are not carbon fiber, 4 5 and 6 are. Most likely cause is that the non carbon fiber syncros are not working properly when quasi power shifting. When upgrading syncros make sure to use the carbon fiber or the same result will happen soon.

12-03-2010, 11:49 AM	#31
denster Drives: 2011 Camaro 2-SS Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Central Fl Posts: 19	Ok, so get this.... I took the car to the dealer, and I described how it grinds from 1st to 2nd at 3500 rpms, and about 1/4 gas pedal. he took it for a drive and shifted at about 1500 to 2000 rpms. Can you believe that he had the nerve to tell me that I should not be shifting at 3500 rpms, and that was beating on the car. I explained that the redline on this car was 6500. He also told me that I shift too fast and I should be pausing once I have the pedal pressed in before I move the stick shift. I also pointed out to him that he stalled it out 3 times before leaving the parking lot, and that he was the one who is not familiar with driving a stick shift. I told him it is a camaro, not a kia and that 3500 rpm is not considered high. While he was driving it, it also did the grinding. He told me it was because he had accidentally shifted improperly. He told me that it's not a race car and the problem with the grinding is user error. He said I'm not driving it properly. I told him I don't recall seeing anywhere in the GM manual that says you have to pause inbetween shifts, or that GM recommends shifting at 2000 rpm. Un F&%ing believable! I think people like him should not be working for gm and should not be representing them. Last edited by denster; 12-03-2010 at 01:21 PM.*

12-10-2010, 03:46 AM	#38
RipperFox Grrr!!! Drives: BLK/IOM '11 2SS/RS Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: OK Posts: 380 View My Garage	I have been having the same issues as all of you. 1. Grinds 1st to 2nd at higher RPM's 2. Tried a new shifter (Hurst), got no better, maybe worse. Probably cause it shifts even faster. 3. Change the fluild to Mobile Syn. No improvement. 4. Noticed that is happens alot more when tranny temp is colder. Above 75-80F, nearly goes away. 5. I can get it to do in the garage too. In the garage, I notice that if I go from neutral ALMOST into 1st. (just to the point of resistance) and hold it there. Then pull back into second really quick it will grind. No clutch involved at all. Pedal to the floor, car at idle. Now, let me say that again. I get the exact same grind, from 1st to 2nd, if I push the clutch tothe floor, just nearly push it into 1st, hold or a couple of seconds, and pull back into 2nd (as if speed shifting), and it will grind. Car is at 500-700 RPM the whole time, clutch is on the floor, the whole time. Give it a little gas (say 2-3K RPM) and it will grind like speed shifting at 6K. Someone else try this and see what results you get. PM me or post here. This is why I know it is the syncro's: RPM, clutch are not involved in this test. Syncro's are not match gear speeds quick enough for these gears. That is why slowing down your shift fixes the situation. I do believe that the tappered syncro's could be the cure for this. I think what is happening in the garage is: The syncro's are matching speed to first gear (just at the edge of the entry gate), and when you are pulling into 2nd really quick, there is not enough time for the 2nd gear syncro to make gear speed. The temperature thing: The viscosity of the tranny fluild is lower thus allowing the bearings and thus the gears to react faster. __________________ Rules for ordering a car. 1. Dealers are liars 2. Buy off the lot 3. See rule #1 Last edited by RipperFox; 12-11-2010 at 06:53 AM.

12-14-2010, 08:26 AM	#41
awforeman Drives: 2011 SIM 2SS/RS M6 Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Sterling, VA Posts: 75	Hey guys, add me to the list. I'm having a serious problem with this also. Just e-mailed my dealership and we'll see what happens. My car has about 500 miles on it and I have been unable to quick shift into 2nd without grinding. I have the factory Hurst installed. In my other car I have grinded maybe twice in 100K, and already over 5 times in my camaro.....I wanted to attribute it to driver error, but after that many times I have to start blaming the car. I will post updates as I figure things out __________________ 10/01/2010 - 1102 Order Entered via Web 10/26/2010 - 2000 Order Accepted by GM 10/26/2010 - 2500 Order Preferenced 10/26/2010 - 3000 Order accepted by production control. 10/27/2010 - 3100 Order available to sequence. 10/27/2010 - 3300 Order Scheduled for Production 10/28/2010 - 3400 Order Broadcast 11/12/2010 - 3800 Order produced 11/12/2010 - 4000 Vehicle available to ship 11/12/2010 - 4150 Invoiced 11/12/2010 - 4B00 Your car is bayed and is waiting for transportation by Truck, Rail or transfer to vendor 11/15/2010 - 4200 Shipped

12-14-2010, 08:39 AM	#42
2010 SS RS Drives: 2010 2SS/RS IBM Black Polished Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Colorado Posts: 2,108	1,2 and 3 gear syncros are not carbon fiber, 4 5 and 6 are. Most likely cause is that the non carbon fiber syncros are not working properly when quasi power shifting. When upgrading syncros make sure to use the carbon fiber or the same result will happen soon. __________________ 418 Stroker, 621RWHP 648 lbs TORQUE Built by Laramie GM Auto Center Tuned by Nick at Mac Autosport. EForce SC, 2 3/4pulley,LPE dual fuel pump, JRE Twin fuel rail upgrade, posi clutch kit, RX oilcatch can and breather, Callies Compstar crankshaft and rods, Racing bearings, CP -13.8 race pistons, steel rings, Comp Cams X6 blower cam, Springs, HD timing chain and tensioner, Doug Thorley Tri Y LT headers, 89.7lb injectors, RPM rollbar, DSS1400 shafts, Simpson 5 pt harness, BMR Toe rods and trailing arms, led lights, RPM input and output shafts

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12-03-2010, 01:16 PM	#32
ssmike BL1ZZRD Drives: '16 Camaro 2SS, '20 Equinox Redline Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Buffalo, NY Posts: 7,840	This kind of stuff just gets my blood boiling! People like him should not be doing a customer service job because he obviously isn't a good listener! He has a predetermined opinion about everyone that we are all just morons that don't know anything about a car! When I brought mine in for notchy 3rd gear, for the 3rd time, I described the problem with my "service advisor" and I had to clearify 4 times as he was writing up the work order! Then he finally agreed to a test drive and I soon learned that HE had no clue! He admitted being a "rooky" at driving a "stick" and he was short shifting and just being a ***** shifting. Of course he only "felt it maybe 1 time but it may have been my shifting"...WTF! At least he did make a note of it but the technician reported "no trouble found"! Hire some proffessionals to be service advisors rather than some punk off the streets! This is just an insult to our intelligence! These are real problems that we're experiencing, what's i gonna take to get GM to listen???

12-03-2010, 04:24 PM	#33
MaddogZ28 Drives: 2002 Camaro Z28, 2011 SS/RS Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Lincoln, NE Posts: 219	I have something along these lines. It doesn't grind usually when i put it into second but it is sometimes difficult to put it into second. sometimes it doesn't go in because its being difficult and then it grinds but as soon as i muscle it into 2nd it doesn't grind. Also, third is pretty notchy and not smooth to shift into.

12-08-2010, 11:53 AM	#35
denster Drives: 2011 Camaro 2-SS Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Central Fl Posts: 19	well i took it to a different dealer and they noticed the problem immediately. they took it in the shop and are currently working with GM to fix it. they said they're gonna change either the synchronizers, or the entire trans. i'm not sure yet. The one thing that I don't understand is since my car only had 1600 miles on it, you would think my synchronizers were new already. I don't see what the difference would be of putting new ones in. Are there any transmission experts that could explain. No guesses, only qualified manual transmission experts please.

12-08-2010, 12:21 PM	#36
ssmike BL1ZZRD Drives: '16 Camaro 2SS, '20 Equinox Redline Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Buffalo, NY Posts: 7,840	From what I have read it's all about tollerance. Some Tremecs are tighter than others. GM must have a loose spec on thier syncro tolerances for the assembly proccess. I've also heard that some guys are having their mechanics make adjustments to the syncros. Of course that would not be a warranty repair. I would ask the dealer doing your work to make sure the tolerances of the replacement syncros are dead nuts in the center of the spec, if they can! Hope this helps, and I'm glad you found a dealership to help you out!

12-08-2010, 12:46 PM	#37
denster Drives: 2011 Camaro 2-SS Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Central Fl Posts: 19	interesting. I just recently spoke to someone about this also and they stated that the replacement synchros may have a taper that the factory ones didn't.

12-10-2010, 08:23 AM	#39
ssmike BL1ZZRD Drives: '16 Camaro 2SS, '20 Equinox Redline Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Buffalo, NY Posts: 7,840	Very interesting! I'd like to try that on my car but the throttle body is off waiting for the CNC porting! I'll try it as soon as I can. In the mean time hopefully some other guys can try it! Good observation and I agree that it points to a syncro problem!

12-12-2010, 06:22 PM	#40
denster Drives: 2011 Camaro 2-SS Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Central Fl Posts: 19	the dealership called me and said they replaced the transmission and put a brand new one in. They said they tested it and the problem does not occur. I will be picking it up tomorrow, so hopefully they are correct.