Mustangs................

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

as a moderator I have to say, don't troll.

Please. 2 of my 7 posts over there have said the same thing: "Why do some articles still say the 2010 GT is better than the 2010 SS?" But if you want to see a troll, then look at the Simon Says guy over at GMI. He has a picture of some Ford executive in front of a Ford sign, with a picture of a 2010 GT with a Car & Driver quote about its Live Rear Axle.

[Black5thgen]

Originally Posted by 10SS500HP

I think 2011 sales numbers will be interesting =)

No they won't, I doesn't take a genius like yourself to see the mustang will out sell the Camaro in 2011. It's the new car on the block. 2012 will be the interesting sales year.

[truth411]

Great job ford!! BUUUUUUUUTTTTTT, I am going to assume the following. FORD FANS SAY GOODBYE TO AFTERMARKET SUPERCHARGERS OR ANY TYPE OF FORCE INDUCTION FOR THE V8!! From my understanding the cyote is:

A. 5.0 DOHC 32 V8
B. 7000rpm Redline
C. 412hp around 6500rpm
D. THEREFORE it most likely have a comprestion ratio of 11.0 to 1!!!!!!!

It is really expensive to get more power out of an OHC design and keep it N.A. Therefore most ford fans have been adding blowers, but with this new motor not as blower friendly as I am predicting. The 2011 mustang may have an advantage stock depending on how much it weighs, But mod for mod and dollar for dollar, The LS3 still have a significant advantage. Before the blue boys were adding blowers to compete, but what will ford GT fans do now to add a significant amount of performance to the 2011 mustang since it has a very highly tuned v8, which make blowers not much of an option any more???

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by Black5thgen

No they won't, I doesn't take a genius like yourself to see the mustang will out sell the Camaro in 2011. It's the new car on the block. 2012 will be the interesting sales year.

And if it does, its not going to be with the gap of a thousand + units a month that the 2010 SS is seeing.

[10SS500HP]

Originally Posted by Black5thgen

No they won't, I doesn't take a genius like yourself to see the mustang will out sell the Camaro in 2011. It's the new car on the block. 2012 will be the interesting sales year.

Ever taken a look at year over year mustang versus camaro sales since each cars inception?

Year: Mustang/Camaro
64:*121,583/NA
65: 559,451/NA
66: 607,568/NA
67: 474,121/*220,906
68: 317,404/ 235,147
68: 299,824/ 243,065
69: 299,824/ 243,065
70: 190,727/ 124,901
71:*149,678/*114,630
72: 125,093/ 114,630 (not a typo!)
73: 134,867/ 96,751
74:*385,993/ 151,008
75: 188,575/ 145,770
76: 187,567/ 182,959
77: 153,173/ 218,858
78: 192,410/ 272,631
79:*369,936/ 282,571
80: 271,322/ 152,005
81: 181,552/ 126,139
82: 130,418/*189,747
83: 120,873/ 154,318
84: 135,678/ 261,591
85: 156,514/ 180,018
86: 224,410/ 192,219
87: 159,145/ 137,760
88: 211,225/ 96,275
89: 209,769/ 110,850
90: 128,189/ 35,048
91: 98,737/ 101,316
92: 79,280/ 70,712
93: 114,228/ *39,755
94:*123,198/ 119,934
95: 185,986/ 122,844
96: 126,483/ 66,827
97: 100,254/ 95,812
98: 170,642/ 77,198
99: 126,067/ 42,098
00: 218,525/ 45,417
01: 155,162/ 29,009

Bolded years where Mustang outsold Camaro. Those not blinded by fandom will see that more likely that not, Mustang will outsell Camaro. The Camaro in 2010 had a two fold advantage:

1. New model
2. Ford's new powertrains have been no secret for the past 2 years.

[Black5thgen]

What point are you trying to make?

[10SS500HP]

Ford is going to kill Chevy in the segment =)

[10SS500HP]

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by 10SS500HP

Ford is going to kill Chevy in the segment =)

By offering a new powertrain? I'll agree the newfound power of the 2011 GT will sway some buyers, but don't expect it to be an absolute blowout. If everyone cared that much about power, then you'd see the GTOs annihilating the 06 Mustangs in sales, but in reality it was the other way around.

[Black5thgen]

It's a whole new ballgame. It is very possible that mustang will sell more, but the 5th gen is not the same old Camaro. More 2010's were sold before one car was ever built then the whole 2002 model year. Bring it on!!!

[lil_chef]

Originally Posted by scrming

How is a fully loaded 2010 GT $8K less than your 2LT/RS? Quick search of the local Ford dealers inventory showed one 2010 GT and it was $36,400... Stick on my 2LT/RS was just over $30K...

the rebates and discounts are not shown on the websites. my GT stickered for about 36k and i walked out at around 30k

[KoTToN]

Originally Posted by 10SS500HP

I think 2011 sales numbers will be interesting =)

they might, but thats because people will actually be getting the part that they paid for.

on a side note i wish I could get that same effect from my customers....

Oh by the way we are rasing your prices this year because later on down the line our product will be better.

[Jinx]

Originally Posted by truth411

Great job ford!! BUUUUUUUUTTTTTT, I am going to assume the following. FORD FANS SAY GOODBYE TO AFTERMARKET SUPERCHARGERS OR ANY TYPE OF FORCE INDUCTION FOR THE V8!! From my understanding the cyote is:

A. 5.0 DOHC 32 V8
B. 7000rpm Redline
C. 412hp around 6500rpm
D. THEREFORE it most likely have a comprestion ratio of 11.0 to 1!!!!!!!

It is really expensive to get more power out of an OHC design and keep it N.A. Therefore most ford fans have been adding blowers, but with this new motor not as blower friendly as I am predicting. The 2011 mustang may have an advantage stock depending on how much it weighs, But mod for mod and dollar for dollar, The LS3 still have a significant advantage. Before the blue boys were adding blowers to compete, but what will ford GT fans do now to add a significant amount of performance to the 2011 mustang since it has a very highly tuned v8, which make blowers not much of an option any more???

In 2007 Saleen made P. Jones Edition Mustang and including with 3.73 in the package it has these things:

1) 10.5:1 compression ratio
2) actual crank 370hp
3) 5.0 3v
4) 6500rpm redline

Now with that said, an all new engine all-together to feature newer technologies, with new characteristics, superior 4v compared to the P.Jones's 3v........ I guess I dont see why some people think this engine does have room to grow in terms of modification. Like mentioned before by someone else on here, the limitation of torque is usually bearing on displacment on NA engines. well the P.Jones and 2011 isnt too far apart on torque. I would put the extra hp on the 4v as an excuse. But saying a blower and etc is a no-no, is out there.

The LS3 has an 10.7:1 ratio, and if the ratio is similar to the P.Jones then the 2011 GT will have slightly less. And the last time I checked people on here are using Maggies and etc. And it been mentioned that Whipple has been in the loop with developing a blower anyway.

Not to mention I have a set of 4.10s that I been meaning to put into my 2001, and with the 8.8 still in the house; about any tom, dick, and harry blue collar can have these cheap gears installed. I cant say so much for the 2010 Camaro's current gear offerings in or over the $700 range (thanx, Linger). So much for money mod for mod.


And for the sake of arguement and to put my 2 cents in the hat:

-Using an official Saleen/P.Jones quoted 1/4 time of 12.9 sec & 109 mph
http://www.seriouswheels.com/cars/to...on-Mustang.htm

-Similar equipment (brembos, and struts, etc) most likely a similar curb weight of 3556lbs, but add 100lbs for the naysayer for a total of 3656lbs

-3.73 gearing


Ok at this point it looks like 2010 Camaro and 2011 is on a even playing field, but.........

The 2011 Coyote does have more power than the P.Jones. So I can see that 12.9 coming down a tenth or two. Factor in the ease of a launch on a solid axle.........starting to sound like even the most average drive could give the best driver in a Camaro a run for his money. So to be fair I think these car are going to be a drivers race.

And like I said, the "Camaro will beat the Mustang Mod for Mod" arguement is weak. Off the top of my head I can see $700 buying gears, UDPs, and a CAI. $700 doesnt even buy the Camaro gears, and most CAI are above $300. So I wouldnt go there on that.

[fdjizm]

Originally Posted by truth411

Great job ford!! BUUUUUUUUTTTTTT, I am going to assume the following. FORD FANS SAY GOODBYE TO AFTERMARKET SUPERCHARGERS OR ANY TYPE OF FORCE INDUCTION FOR THE V8!! From my understanding the cyote is:

A. 5.0 DOHC 32 V8
B. 7000rpm Redline
C. 412hp around 6500rpm
D. THEREFORE it most likely have a comprestion ratio of 11.0 to 1!!!!!!!

It is really expensive to get more power out of an OHC design and keep it N.A. Therefore most ford fans have been adding blowers, but with this new motor not as blower friendly as I am predicting. The 2011 mustang may have an advantage stock depending on how much it weighs, But mod for mod and dollar for dollar, The LS3 still have a significant advantage. Before the blue boys were adding blowers to compete, but what will ford GT fans do now to add a significant amount of performance to the 2011 mustang since it has a very highly tuned v8, which make blowers not much of an option any more???

I will note your predicitons sir and save this quote for future reference thank you.

ask bowtie about being premature on his "predicitons" lol